Show me cases of CHS where the cannabis is COMPLETELY clean of azadirachtin or neem.

Douglas.Curtis · Feb 13, 2017

Just like the title says, I'm looking for Cannabis Hyperemesis Syndrome patients who "Know for a fact" their cannabis has zero neem or azadirachtin on it.

So far, I've only come across two types of CHS sufferers, those who have zero clue about what's in/on their cannabis and those who are using neem/azadirachtin contaminated cannabis.

So who's growing cannabis without neem or aza and only using this clean cannabis, that STILL has CHS symptoms?

This CHS garbage has gone on long enough and it needs to stop.

Edit: Keep in mind resin absorbs aza and creates a contaminated smoking/vaping device. Simply switching to clean cannabis will still poison the user with azadirachtin from the resin.

Gry · Feb 13, 2017

heady blunts · Feb 13, 2017

Douglas.Curtis · Feb 13, 2017

heady blunts said:

I LOVE popcorn, also coffee.

Unfortunately, both drop my pH levels. Too low of a pH and my compromised digestive system starts having issues.

As far as I'm aware, I now have permanent damage in my intestines. At times it feels/acts like part of my colon is not working properly. Each time I get poisoned with Azadirachtin, it gets worse.

@Gry, I appreciate the pm. I've never heard of glyphosate (round-up) causing similar issues. Seriously doubt it's the problem as it's also not something people would be using on cannabis. I certainly haven't used it, only aza products.

who dat is · Feb 13, 2017

You are located 10K feet above sea level.

:lurk:

Douglas.Curtis · Feb 13, 2017

who dat is said:
You are located 10K feet above sea level.

My issues started 9 years ago in Cali, near sea level. Yes, I've been at 10k feet the last 6 years and now I'm back near sea level. Altitude doesn't seem to change the effects of the aza. (Would be nice though. lol)

Weird · Feb 13, 2017

neem has no restriction on foodstuff by the fda because of its relatively benign nature

not to say people may posses sensitivities but it begs the question have you studied the effects of neem toxicity and placed those effects juxtpose chs to see if they are identical?

Douglas.Curtis · Feb 13, 2017

Weird said:
neem has no restriction on foodstuff by the fda because of its relatively benign nature

not to say people may posses sensitivities but it begs the question have you studied the effects of neem toxicity and placed those effects juxtpose chs to see if they are identical?

Unrefined neem contains 200-2000ppm of azadirachtin. Yes, there are examples of people having CHS issues from neem, though the only one I remember off hand was from someone who drank (accidentally?) an ounce of neem oil.

Neem is used (in small amounts) for a lot of things and in some countries they ingest small amounts of it. (rubbing your teeth with a neem stick would never have enough aza to cause a problem)

I remember reading a case where a number of children were accidentally given azadirachtin, instead of the usual neem oil. A couple of the children died and the others had various symptoms of CHS, including hypothermia and digestive/vomiting issues. Perhaps someone can find that article again and post the link?

I *have* read a few reports of growers who have experienced CHS, with neem as their only pesticide.

Weird · Feb 13, 2017

the symptoms for neem toxicity and the symptoms for CHS are not the same

Douglas.Curtis · Feb 13, 2017

Weird said:
the symptoms for neem toxicity and the symptoms for CHS are not the same

The symptoms for neem toxicity are from people eating it without heating it. The symptoms from the guy who drank an ounce of neem still mirrored CHS. There are no neem toxicity reports from cannabis users because doctors list it as CHS, which their information says is from the cannabis itself.

I'm looking for people who have used neem/azadirachtin free cannabis and have CHS, is this you?

Avinash.miles · Feb 13, 2017

i've seen it - pal grew chronic safely no aza or neem and his bro had the CHS bad when dabbin hard on trim run bho and fat doobies all day
don't know how i can SHOW you it

many people already have their minds made up on certain issues so no amount of telling OR showing will change their minds
i've found CHS to be one of these issues - if it's not people just CONVINCED 100% that it's FAKE and total BS anti-cannabis prohibition, it's people just CONVINCED they know exactly what causes it....

i'm not about to deny the possibility that some people could have a sensitivity to cannabis, could be result of mis-shapen cannabinoid receptors... could be all kinds of things

i'd say that sicknesses and symptoms caused by pesticide/fungicide residue on plant matter and in concentrates could for sure disguise itself as some of the symptoms of CHS

Douglas.Curtis · Feb 13, 2017

Avinash.miles said:
i've seen it - pal grew chronic safely no aza or neem and his bro had the CHS bad when dabbin hard on trim run bho and fat doobies all day

We can rule out the doobies, but was the BHO dabbed from clean equipment? The aza stays in the smoking gear, I even edited the original post to include that info.

So, was it a clean/new rig?

Avinash.miles · Feb 13, 2017

Douglas.Curtis said:
We can rule out the doobies, but was the BHO dabbed from clean equipment? The aza stays in the smoking gear, I even edited the original post to include that info.

So, was it a clean/new rig?

yes new rigs, this was back before dabbing was a big thing and rigs were kinda hard to come by.... CHS wasn't a big thing either, took some searching to connect the dots.

symptoms may overlap, but that doesn't mean they are one in the same if some people can be super sensitive to aza/neem couldn't some (other) people be super sensitive to cannabinoids?

Douglas.Curtis · Feb 13, 2017

Avinash.miles said:
yes new rigs, this was back before dabbing was a big thing and rigs were kinda hard to come by.... CHS wasn't a big thing either, took some searching to connect the dots.

symptoms may overlap, but that doesn't mean they are one in the same if some people can be super sensitive to aza/neem couldn't some (other) people be super sensitive to cannabinoids?

Well, this thread was put up to find out. Yours is the first instance I've seen with clean gear and clean meds. Sucks to verify some people are sensitive to cannabis itself. I'm definitely not one of them, straight up aza issues with me.

Looks like overlapping symptoms, including hypothermia and relief from hot showers. Crazy...

Anyone else have CHS and know your meds and gear are clean?

Avinash.miles · Feb 13, 2017

Douglas.Curtis said:
Well, this thread was put up to find out. Yours is the first instance I've seen with clean gear and clean meds. Sucks to verify some people are sensitive to cannabis itself. I'm definitely not one of them, straight up aza issues with me.

Looks like overlapping symptoms, including hypothermia and relief from hot showers. Crazy...

Anyone else have CHS and know your meds and gear are clean?

and untainted herb - even in massive quantities / dosage levels does not affect you at all?

Douglas.Curtis · Feb 14, 2017

Avinash.miles said:
and untainted herb - even in massive quantities / dosage levels does not affect you at all?

24/7, mass dosage, dabs, edibles, doesn't matter, I'm perfectly fine. Hit me with contaminated and I'm down for the count.

Lightly contaminated (Where I can barely detect it) will mess me up in a week, heavily contaminated can mess me up in 2 hits.

Douglas.Curtis · Feb 14, 2017

@Avi, was the soil re-used/amended by any chance? Soil which had neem or azadirachtin drenches added to it? No neem seed meal? Just want to remove any possible variables where the neem/aza could have gotten in un-noticed.

Avinash.miles · Feb 14, 2017

coco grow, canna, gh
no amendments, no neem seed meel no aza drench.

and even if it WERE tainted it wouldn't have mattered to this individual, im sure thy had smoked PLENTY of tainted herb, and didn't get sick after 2 hits or have a CHS episode

lots of factors are going to be contributing to CHS depending upon the individual, the thing ain't going away anytime soon in reality or in public eye - probably will become more widespread and sensationalized as legality spreads and more people start using it (squares, the kind of people who would never do it because of illegality but will start when its legal... the ones that do what they are told LOL)

HazyBulldog · Feb 14, 2017

This is the question I often ask as well. Cases seem to follow concentrate users, those toxins build up more in concentrates. Seems to fit.

Avinash.miles · Feb 14, 2017

HazyBulldog said:
This is the question I often ask as well. Cases seem to follow concentrate users, those toxins build up more in concentrates. Seems to fit.

you are totally right about the higher levels of toxins in concentrates from residue on flower that is processed
but
my wifey had a friend who had CHS outbreaks from flower smoking
same with douglas' sensitivity - can be brought on even by a few hits of the bowl of tainted herb

Show me cases of CHS where the cannabis is COMPLETELY clean of azadirachtin or neem.

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