Soil recipe help

With my last post about pricing with super soil [cant make it right now so id have to buy] i may just go soil. My question is, good easy recipe for a beginner? How far will it gom do i need to add nutes during veg/flower? Id like to go organic so ive been looking around and my mind is just over welmed. Could use someobe to walk me step by step? Or point me to something...

This will be my 3rd grow. 1st grow was coco and turned out well. 2nd grow never got off the ground. Now im building my grow room and have space to do so on a scale i want. I plan on going with 4 to 6 planta flowering at a time while about that many veg while adding in clones. Im thinking 5 gallon fabric? Only doing around a 5 to 7 week veg.

Hi Mrkline,

This thread has all the info in the world. Most importantly soil recipes in the first few pages.

https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=53792

If you are on a budget, find some Promix, or equivalent, and get some bottled nutrients like Botanicare, Fox Farm, or Earth Juice.

Water feed water feed water feed water....etc

Mix nutrients and then adjust pH to 6.5-.6.8.

Make sure when not feeding, to pH water to correct level as well.

Following this method you can be assured some degree of success, gain experience, and then tweak a soil recipe to your liking.

Best of luck!

I was hoping to stay away from anything bottled.. if need be than okay lol... Thats why I wanted to attempt Super soil, but with the added cost, and still possibility to need added nutes I dont see the point at this time (till I can make my own super soil)

I have kinda went over the beginner one and read up... lots of it just sounded like gibberish to me LMAO.. my first grow i went Coco/perlite and just used Jacks 3/2/1 system, was pretty dummy proof...

I would steer you away from a super soil. They never dry out. I made up a mix at buildasoil that a bunch of folk are liking, it is much lighter, dries out quickly and has enough Ca and P in it to get you started. You will have to fertilize though! Which is a good thing! And it is not hot and will easily take seedlings as the conductivity is low.

Ill check that out.. Thanks

Trick is to veg in a container around 1/3 of the size of the flowering pot/tub. Repot and flip on the same day. This will allow the lazy growing style of grow without the need for bottles.
You'll do better with added bottles but a lazy grow followed by adding one bottle at a time, allows you to see the diff that bottle makes before moving to the next one.
If you aren't using any silica though, (a £5 bottle rather than a £50 bottle like the feeds) you will want to multi top the plants in veg. Otherwise you may get bud rot in the cola, which on a large single cola plant is heartbreaking.
If you are comfy with how much to water, go with no drainage holes, no point in washing the goodness out. Stay away from bulking agents like perlite, it just takes up room.

Just run coot's mix, it doesn't get any more basic and I have had great results with it, only slightly adjusting it over 2 years.

Basically you mix a basic foundation consisting of equal parts (for simplicity, can adjust these ratios according to your environment later on):
- Peat moss
- Perlite
- Earth Worm Castings

All 3 are very inexpensive. This is your basic soil mix.

You amend it with the following (how much of each depends on how much basic mix you have, look at the thread where clackamas coot's mix is explained, I think it was already posted above):
- Kelp meal/powder
- Bonemeal
- Bloodmeal
- Dolomite Lime

Thats it.

This mix will get you through flower fine.
If you want to kick it up a notch, it is highly recommended to add whatever rock dusts you have available to you. The most famous one is Azomite. But any glacial rockdust will be a good adition to your mix.
I personally like to mix in neemseed meal because I like to think it helps with combating pests.

For amounts/ratios, again, read the thread that was posted above.
To give you a start though:
I make basic soil batches of about 13 gallons.
I amend them with 1 cup each of:
- Kelp meal
- Bloodmeal
- Neemseed meal

And 2 cups each of:
- Bonemeal
- Dolomite lime


I have started top-dressing my pots with fresh earth worm castings in between grows and have experimented with mixing mycos straight into the soil as well as different calcium sources like oystershell flour.

The basics, listed above, are what is most important and all of it is cheap.

If you want to go cheaper, I think there is only one way to do so and that is using the LUCAS Formula with Maxibloom.

But even with this very basic soil mix, you will blow any cannabis grown with LUCAS out of the water, at the very least terpene-wise.

/Edit
Yeah the link Lester Beans posted is the one you should check out. LC's mix is coot's mix.

I use that one, slightly adjusted. The only thing that could be remotely pricey is the kelp, blood and bone meal. Everything else is really, really cheap. You will find out though that as an organic soil grower, you will start wondering what you could throw in there that would benefit your plants. Spoiler alert: Most expensive additives do more good than harm and the best you can do for your soil is likely raise your own worms and make your own worm castings along with making your own compost (bokashi is really good for organic soil).

Oh, speaking of which:
Adding worms to your soil can do wonders as well! I skipped them 1 grow and the second I added them and they make a big difference.

Man some of you make things so hard. Just buy a bag of organic potting compost at your local builders supplies store. A 20 litre bag is a fiver and they did the mixing for you.

If coot's mix is complicated then I don't know what's simple...

Besides:
He said cost is a factor and he wants to get away from bottled nutes.

Getting away from bottles, trying to cut cost along the way only to go to premixed soil bags where you don't know what's in them and pay more for than mixing it up yourself seems like bad advice to me.

Also:
I have ruined an entire grow because I threw in some store-bought premixed soil. Most do not come pest-free and the quality control on these soil mixes is not what you'd expect.

Then change the store bought premixed soil to a different store bought premixed soil. Factor the cost of your time in, and I've never seen anything more expensive than mixing your own.
As for pests, yeah that is an issue but pre opening the bag and watering it, leave it in the garage for 7 to 10 days and anything that needs to eat, will hatch/move out or die.

I do have account for the fact that you have had a huge increase in quality and availability of premixed soils since legalization.

My impression is that you do have good premixed soilmixes available, just don't have them here, hence my stance on them but in the states should be fine I guess.

Gentlemen,

I have been testing mixes for growers a couple of years now. The results are horrible.

Depending on which wormcasting you get, 90% of it is toxic with Fe and Al, no Mn. Can't get there that way!

Using Coots, you will have all your calcium in carbonate forms, if you have alkaline water, oops, no Ca! The lab will say you do, but if done using the right soil analysis procedures developed by the PGA, you will quickly see the issue behind using other forms of Ca, especially those low in Mg.

If you want to hear a bit more, go visit the slownickel lounge thread here on ICMAG. On the first page of the thread there is a great video to watch that explains the importance of understanding what you have in a soil, testing is everything. Everything else is bro science and guessing. Throw the bottles of woowoo juice in there and the resulting quality sucks. A lot of the organic quality sucks too. I have at least 15 analysis of different worm castings. Only a couple were decent. The rest are horrible. The reason folks don't see "negative" results that often is because all those elements are buffered by humus molecules, making uptake somewhat selective, but realize the issue is competition between elements, such as Fe/Mn. Read up in the thread mentioned and read the analysis presented plus listen to the folks that have tried working with a bit more "real" science instead of the bro stuff that gets deep in these forums.

I produce my personal crops organically, but I work with lots of folks that are conventional. Nutrition is nutrition, period.

Slow...with all due respect (and i sincerely mean that )

I'm reading this as U telling us that ALL pre-mixed soils and/or soil formulations are not good?? many growers use simple premixed soils all the time ...what are we doing wrong?

~star~crash~ said:

Slow...with all due respect (and i sincerely mean that )

I'm reading this as U telling us that ALL pre-mixed soils and/or soil formulations are not good?? many growers use simple premixed soils all the time ...what are we doing wrong?

Click to expand...

Not at all. They can all be fixed! Just how do you start blindly? You of all people know that.

From hydro, to coco, to mediums, to soils, you have to dial it in.

You want to start with some mix, fine. But figure out what is in it prior to planting out! I have seen growers get crap from the store that the conductivity was off the chart. Starting with 20% plus K, sorry. Most mixes have absurd K/P levels. Sorry.

No mix has enough Ca. Really sorry...

Fe/Mn ratios that are silly. I will now stop apologizing, haha..

Ok now i understand what U are saying ... dude i'm dying to learn ...this season i've a field of dreams @ my disposal & working with native soil , but i fear to amend to ur specs would be physically impossible ??? i want to learn how to feed my crop the best within my framework of abilities

~star~crash~ said:

Ok now i understand what U are saying ... dude i'm dying to learn ...this season i've a field of dreams @ my disposal & working with native soil , but i fear to amend to ur specs would be physically impossible ??? i want to learn how to feed my crop the best within my framework of abilities

Click to expand...

Crash,

I do this on thousands upon thousands of acres, mostly sugar cane. Wanna talk about a low budget per acre? LMAO.

Those growers that have chosen to learn, do their analysis and dial in their grows are killing it. Greenhands13 Sunset Sherbert CO2 extract won the Emerald Cup. Terps were off the chart. His flower amazing.

Easygoings' outdoor at the Emerald Cup and his concentrates were show stoppers. CritiCal was selling his Diamonds on the premium menu at $120/GRM!

Read my thread, you will see the same discussions over and over. Using real science is 1. less expensive, 2. more productive, 3. allows you to reach another level.

Without high Ca, balanced Fe/Mn rations, and everything else balanced, you can't convert simple sugars into complex ones. That means genetic expression is going to be a fraction of what is the real capacity of the plant. This is all about genetic expression.

i'm over at ur thread

1 Bag Happy Frog

1 Bag CoCo Coir

1 Bag Worm Castings

1/2 bag perlite ( 2 cubic feet )

4 cup dolomite lime

4 cup bone meal

2 cup kelp meal

1.25 cup blood meal

1 cup azomite


Basic, easy, typically common amendments. Its a slightly tweaked version of Blazeoneup's soil recipe. Has enough fertilizer for a short veg and flower in it, as long as the pot is large enough for the size of the plant. Although a little top dress or some feeding won't hurt, and should be used as needed.

I typically use it or something close as a starter mix for seedlings, clones, or to do a quick breeding cycle indoors. Blazeoneup had really simple, clean, productive rooms. Not sure if you can find his threads anymore, iirc he eventually got busted.

Could always be dialed in further, but it will get you headed in the right direction.

Soil can have a bit more of a learning curve than Coco/Hydro imo. Getting the watering right is more crucial. Pure Coco is almost foolproof as far as irrigation cycles go.

Gl,

Mr^^

Gonna suggest Coot's mix as well.

My mix consists of:
1/3 Premier Peat (Lowes/Home Depot)
1/3 Compost (50/50 mix of fresh worm castings and Malibu Compost)
1/3 Aeration (Rice hulls, Pumice, and 10% bio-char per cubic foot)

Amendments (all per cubic foot):
Kelp meal(1/2 cup)
Neem/Karanja meal (1/2 cup)
Crab meal (1/2 cup)
Milled Malted Barley (1/2 cup)
Fish Bone Meal (1/2 cup)
Alfalfa Meal (1/4 cup)

Minerals (4 cups/cubic foot):
Gypsum (1 cup)
Basalt (1 cup)
Glacial Rock Dust (1 cup)
Oyster Shell Flour (1 cup)

Barley straw for mulch, handful of worms, and your good to go.

Once a week for the first 6-7 weeks of flower the girls will receive some sort of brew. Not nearly as intensive as the BAS schedule, but similar. I use the following as I see necessary:

Kelp/Alfalfa (once or twice within first 4 weeks of bloom)
Aloe/Ful-Power/Agisil solution (as often as possible, replacing aloe with coconut late bloom)
Sul-po-mag (once or twice within first 4 weeks of bloom)
Compost tea (usually week before bloom, and once mid-bloom)

All components are fairly inexpensive, with the exception of the Aloe flakes and Ful-power. Truth be told, you could probably get away with plain water throughout the grow, and without the alfalfa, and malted barley, and glacial rock dust. I have definitely seen the benefit of using them, but was still beyond impressed with the results without them. This is my 3rd and 4th run with this mix, and it has only gotten better.

All girls are in 10 gallon pots, and new girls are transplanted directly into the pots. Pull the straw back, lightly till the top layer, add an inch or so of fresh compost/amendment mix (scaled down slightly from the original mix above), water in with compost tea, and you're good to go. I have been lightly top-dressing with the same mix 2-3 times during flower, but not sure how necessary it is.