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Short Path Distillation

Jvckguar

New member
It seems like if you kept everything warm but the receiving flask you would be pulling thc vapor into your vacuum pump? Or would even 110f cause all the thc to condense?
 

Gray Wolf

A Posse ad Esse. From Possibility to realization.
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GW can you please go into more detail about Eden's product and how it is being used?

I infer you are referring to their short path still.

It is essentially a large boiling flask sitting in a heating mantle and utilizing a magnetic stir bar inside the flask, to provide the thin film and reduce bumping.

It is under vacuum and discharges to a chilled collection flask also under vacuum.

They originally built if for alcohol recovery and then discovered that under lower vacuum levels, they could also fractionally distill the terpenes.

Here is a picture of one on display, without a chilled bath.
 

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snake11

Member
Rember the 22L heating mantel from Eden Labs included in their short path still is on the watched supplies list. It's is actually the only piece of equipment listed according to the AG. This is just one of many reasons I would stay far away from eden labs. They are overpriced and have poor craftsmanship.
 
GW,
is that glassware rated for high vacuum? It is a very large glass vessel to be puling that hard. hoping you checked before recommending it...

I bet we are going to start seeing a bunch of implosions/explosions with all these amateur non-chemists playing with cheap glassware at high vacuum.

lets be safe about this
 

G.O. Joe

Active member
Veteran
It should be OK for vacuum, I'm not saying it's a short path system or capable of much THC distillation, though. Flat parts, defects, and glass abuse is what causes implosions.
 

A6 Grower

Member
Veteran
GW,
is that glassware rated for high vacuum? It is a very large glass vessel to be puling that hard. hoping you checked before recommending it...

I bet we are going to start seeing a bunch of implosions/explosions with all these amateur non-chemists playing with cheap glassware at high vacuum.

lets be safe about this

I worry about this with my cheap laboy setup. Im in the middle of building a bast cabinet and hood for everything to go into. For the mean time, i always have googles, always wear a thick apprion and i have an emergency power cut off switch that shuts that whole corner of the shop down. Along with proper ventilation and airflow of the whole area. I like my skin, im gonna try and keep it the way it is.
 

A6 Grower

Member
Veteran
Thank Joe! I bet they don't get ransacked as much as laboy lol. Decently cheaper, about 30% average.

For the moment my ventilation is all on a separate circuit, so if i throw the emergency shutoff all the bad stuff shuts down, like the freezer, pumps, heater, the 2 fans i have on the floor(not the best place but i like the air movement down there) and any other little things like the mantle, rotavap, hotplate, etc(lab stuff is all in one place, kinda sectioned off.. The main ventilation stays on and i have a huge bay door i can throw up within a couple seconds if i needed too. I run through emergency procedures in my head all the time. Also, every few weeks I make sure my assistant knows what to do to in that situation too. Preparing for the worst and hoping it never happens is usually how i roll.
 

Gray Wolf

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GW,
is that glassware rated for high vacuum? It is a very large glass vessel to be puling that hard. hoping you checked before recommending it...

I bet we are going to start seeing a bunch of implosions/explosions with all these amateur non-chemists playing with cheap glassware at high vacuum.

lets be safe about this

Eden Labs says it is suitable for high vacuum. I didn't bother with the calculations myself, because I trust Fritz to do his homework.

You might be right about the cheap glass implosion thing, but Eden Labs system isn't remotely close to cheap at $6500, so most of the implosions probably won't be one of their units.

They have noted that it is easily damaged where the connections come off, and they are investigating building it in stainless.

As GJ notes, it will separate the monoterpenes from the diterpenes and both from the triterpenes and longer molecules, but not separate the different diterpenes.
 

G.O. Joe

Active member
Veteran
Eden Labs system isn't remotely close to cheap at $6500

For that? Run away. The custom flask is an unnecessary expense for most uses and I don't know why they would make it like that. The mantle doesn't allow stirring. You could make a centrifugal molecular still for $6500 couldn't you? Doesn't it feel like your mission in life to start a benchtop molecular distillation business, that everything up to now has been preparation for this?

Oh, stirring Glas-Col mantles look like their usual mantles. Maybe it stirs after all, with the controller at lower left. Sorry Eden!

Here's the book on molecular distillation, if anyone wants their distillation complicated instead of simple.
http://babel.hathitrust.org/cgi/pt?id=coo.31924002978769
 
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MEMED

Member
Just gotta note here, there is a difference btween molecular and short path. Its basically degrees of vacuum.
 

G.O. Joe

Active member
Veteran
Technically, it's degrees of short, with molecular distillations being the shortest path, like half an inch to the condenser. This becomes more and more important at pressures less than 1000 and especially 50 microns. Falling film stills don't look too hard to make.
 

PDXPureMind

New member
I infer you are referring to their short path still.

It is essentially a large boiling flask sitting in a heating mantle and utilizing a magnetic stir bar inside the flask, to provide the thin film and reduce bumping.

It is under vacuum and discharges to a chilled collection flask also under vacuum.

They originally built if for alcohol recovery and then discovered that under lower vacuum levels, they could also fractionally distill the terpenes.

Here is a picture of one on display, without a chilled bath.


GW Thank you for your prompt reply, I'd assume to achieve separating the terpenes you need a vacuum controller in addition to the materials there kit provides?

As this was originally designed as an alcohol recovery still and in my basic understanding refining to an absolute would in turn destroy the terpenes? would one first add freshly extracted oil to recover the terpenes with the collection flask in an ice bath? From there one would add a co-solvet (i.e. ethanol) winterize and filter and add it back to the eden still to further refine to an absolute thus removing and remaining lipids, fats, waxes, and chlorophyl (i.e. Clear?).

Thanks Again!
 

Gray Wolf

A Posse ad Esse. From Possibility to realization.
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GW Thank you for your prompt reply, I'd assume to achieve separating the terpenes you need a vacuum controller in addition to the materials there kit provides?

As this was originally designed as an alcohol recovery still and in my basic understanding refining to an absolute would in turn destroy the terpenes? would one first add freshly extracted oil to recover the terpenes with the collection flask in an ice bath? From there one would add a co-solvet (i.e. ethanol) winterize and filter and add it back to the eden still to further refine to an absolute thus removing and remaining lipids, fats, waxes, and chlorophyl (i.e. Clear?).

Thanks Again!

Typically we winterize first and then remove the mono through diterpenes and leave the rest in the boiling flask.

The monoterpenes come over first, but I've seen techniques bringing the monoterpenes through the diterpenes over at the same time, where they separate in the condensing bulb.

The monoterpenes are then poured off and the diterpenes chased out with a heat gun.
 

Gray Wolf

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Doesn't it feel like your mission in life to start a benchtop molecular distillation business, that everything up to now has been preparation for this?

It does seem like there is no end to equipment and process opportunities for sure. I did design a molecular distillation roller assy system for partners, and they are building a prototype for testing.

Neither a centrifugal, nor a wiped film, but more along those lines than a boiling flask with magnetic stir bar. More info when we have tangible results.
 
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HG23

Member
The path is still too long and not shaped right. You will get distillate coating that curved neck and will have to heat and insulate the condenser.
 

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