BioBizz anyone.

ZiggyStardust · Mar 29, 2016

getbuck, biobloom is absolutely not enough N-strong for your plants... as soon as you flip they will need quite a bit of N for the stretch... i agree with ganjagav, make sure they don't get N-hungry at this point. if you feed the recomended dosage (1 ml/l) you can hardly give too much! but always threat each plant separately, different plant different needs even from same strain... sometimes even same cuttings behave differently...

ganjagav, i think you sould avoid those burnt tips at the end... i know it's really hard to find the right spot where you don't either under or overfeed, but over the years i have noticed buds taste (and burn if you smoke 'em

) a lot better without burnt tips. it's true you don't smoke the leaves, but they are the best indicator for what's in your buds. you basically smoke calyxes, or more precisely calixes' bracts where the resin forms mostly, along with the very small leaves surrounding buds... so you smoke plant's vegetal material. :tiphat:

ZiggyStardust · Mar 29, 2016

ganjygav said:
Yeah maybe it's for seedlings but by the time my plants start to get food they're about 4 weeks old,they ain't seedlings no more. They're adult plants so I feed them to biobizzs schedule.
I used grow all the way to flush and still had some yellowing. Thing is if I have a few leaves going yellow at the end of flower I see it as a good thing. I don't think a plant should be green and lush at the end of its life.

seedlings meaning "from seed" as opposed to clones.

yes and totally agree you should let plants go yellow at the end!

ganjygav · Mar 29, 2016

ZiggyStardust said:
getbuck, biobloom is absolutely not enough N-strong for your plants... as soon as you flip they will need quite a bit of N for the stretch... i agree with ganjagav, make sure they don't get N-hungry at this point. if you feed the recomended dosage (1 ml/l) you can hardly give too much! but always threat each plant separately, different plant different needs even from same strain... sometimes even same cuttings behave differently...

ganjagav, i think you sould avoid those burnt tips at the end... i know it's really hard to find the right spot where you don't either under or overfeed, but over the years i have noticed buds taste (and burn if you smoke 'em ) a lot better without burnt tips. it's true you don't smoke the leaves, but they are the best indicator for what's in your buds. you basically smoke calyxes, or more precisely calixes' bracts where the resin forms mostly, along with the very small leaves surrounding buds... so you smoke plant's vegetal material.

I've never noticed any negative effects on taste with burnt tips but I do flush for 2 weeks.... Well hold the food for final 2 weeks. I'm not trying to grow award winning weed or anything and my stuff is at least twice the quality I buy off the streets. So to me, I'm winning :biggrin:

ganjygav · Mar 29, 2016

ZiggyStardust said:
seedlings meaning "from seed" as opposed to clones.
yes and totally agree you should let plants go yellow at the end!

Well my plants did great from the biobizz schedule,even from seed. Obviously I don't go feeding them until they've eaten all the food in the soil after final transplant and by that time they're 4 weeks into veg, 15-18 inches high with stems thicker than any clone I've grown.
They're plenty ready for that schedule by then.

ZiggyStardust · Mar 29, 2016

ganjygav said:
I've never noticed any negative effects on taste with burnt tips but I do flush for 2 weeks.... Well hold the food for final 2 weeks. I'm not trying to grow award winning weed or anything and my stuff is at least twice the quality I buy off the streets. So to me, I'm winning

you're a winner for sure bro!

i noticed the difference some years ago at a tasting session with some seasoned growers... their weed was a lot better, smoking mine and theirs sida by side was incredible, i felt a sucker!

(i too was very satisfied of my product, compared to street one)...
Then i wanted to know everything, they told me it's really important to feed properly and avoid overfeeding. sometimes final flush doesn't really work, for plants are not eating that much anymore... less metabolism...
i too give plain water 2-4 weeks prior to harvest (after i stop feeding i do a couple of feeds with molasses and enzymes...).

ZiggyStardust · Mar 29, 2016

ganjygav said:
Well my plants did great from the biobizz schedule,even from seed. Obviously I don't go feeding them until they've eaten all the food in the soil after final transplant and by that time they're 4 weeks into veg, 15-18 inches high with stems thicker than any clone I've grown.
They're plenty ready for that schedule by then.

yes, i too have always followed biobizz schedule with some modifications (strain depending) i came up with in these 6 years... i was just curious to know if anyone had tried oldtimer's schedule, 'cause it's really different...

sallyforthDeleted member 75382 · Mar 29, 2016

^^just finished using old timers and loving bio bizz, an improvement from Oldtimers.

GoatCheese · Mar 29, 2016

Feb. 2019 EDIT:
BIOBIZZ HAS APPARENLTLY CHANGED THE N-P-K RATIOS OF THEIR GROW AND BLOOM ...AGAIN ...SO THIS FEED SCHEDULE BELOW WON'T PROBABLY WORK WITH THE NEW VERSION OF THEIR GROW AND BLOOM NUTRIENTS.

But in short; what you want is abit more N in your nutes during first weeks of 12/12 while lower level of N during later bloom before the "flushing" starts; So you go lower with the N level as the blooming progresses and higher with P and K.

New Biobizz NPK levels
Biobizz Grow 3 - 0 - 8
Biobizz Bloom 1 - 2 - 2

ZiggyStardust said:
thanks for replying guys!
i've been using biobizz for 5-6 years in and outdoor, always with nice results.
but i always take into consideration different inputs: in this thread somewhere, a few growers said they don't ph-dow with biobizz for that reason, and they got this advice from biobizz.
i've always ph downe'ed as well...
actually goatcheese i don't think it makes a huge difference if you put ph-down or nutes first... i put nutes first just for a pratical matter: it would be impossible to guess the right amount of ph-down to use before putting the nutes. some nutes make ph go up (like rootjuice) some other make it go down (like biobloom), and my tap water is not at the same ph every day.
years ago i was using the nitric acid/phosphoric acid combo for ph-down (canna), after a while i switched to the "organic acid" ph-down, also by canna (i think it's basically citric acid... lemon juice!).

google "oldtimer's biobizz feed schedule". it's an interesting schedule, very different from what i use and from biobizz chart. oldtimer says biobizz chart is made for cuttings pushed to the max, while his chart is for seedlings... the strangest thing to me, he never cuts biogrow down, on the contrary he doubles the dosage at the end of flowering before the plain water ending period...
actually i usually stop feeding biogrow after the stretch... i got curious towards this opposite view...
what you guys think?

Yea, i'm not watching the PH-level at all, on day-to-day basis, i mean. I have measured the PH level of my nutrient solution once when i moved to my new place (in the same town) and then use PH-down accordingly after that.

..most of the times i give plain water for my plants , i don't ph-adjust it at all. When i'm really lazy, i don't even use PH-down with the nutes. :biggrin:

And i have seen no issues at all over the years i have grown like this.

But sure, if the PH-level go all over the place where you live, it might be problematic.

-----------------
On PH-level in general, i'm not much of a hydro-grower, but some years ago i asked a dude i know how he adjusts the PH-level of his bubbler/drip-feed, and he went "Huh, PH-level?"

He or his mates never adjusted PH-levels and got normal results, and i bet the water PH-was litlle over 7, as it usually is in my country.
..so i'm not sure if the PH-level is so, so important, as many claim it is, when the PH-level is close to normal.

I'm not much of a coco-grower either, but i read some years ago, that some coco-growers allow the PH-level drift from the optimal PH 5.6-5.8 close to 7.0 before adjusting it back to the optimal level, cause plants absorb different nutrients from the medium at different PH-levels.
But i have grown in coco only once, so can't comment which is better= always at optimal PH-level or allowing the PH-level to drift abit.

On BioBizz feeding schedule:
I don't look into it that much nowadays cause some nute-sensitive plants don't like the full load anyway, so i try to read the plants and how much they can take/need. = Some landrace/sensitive-plants do not like high levels of nutrients and can hermie because of this. But when you grow the same plant with less nutes, you might not see nanners anymore.

For veg plants i give them 2ml of GROW / 1 litre of water and this seems to be ok for most of the plants i have grown.

InBloom:
2 ml of Grow is the most i give them during flowering, at around week 5 (of 11 week total), then i start to give them even less; 1 ml of Grow at last week before the flushing starts. And at this point i give them around 3-4 ml of BLOOM / litre of water

For an 11-week strain (medium nute strength-plant) my feeding is something like:
+ plain water 1-2 times a week

(EDIT: I have started using Plagron PK13/14 to replce some of the BioBizz Grow starting at 5th week so i can cut Nitrogen out abit sooner to get smoother smoking product, and BioBizz Grow has too much Nitrogen in it BUT also most of the Kalium so you can't just replace the Grow with more BioBizz Bloom which is lacking Kalium.

Ratio: 1ml of PK13/14 replaces 1ml of BioBizz Grow)

NPK
BioBizz Grow 4-3-6
BioBizz Bloom 2-7-4

Week 1: Grow 1,5-2 ml - Bloom 0,2-0,5 ml

Week2: Grow 1,5-1,8 ml - Bloom 0.5-0,8 ml

Week 3: Grow 1,5-1,8 ml - Bloom 1- 1.5 ml

Week 4: Grow 1,3-1,5ml - Bloom 1,3-1.5 ml

Week 5: Grow 1ml (..or Grow 0,5 ml + 0,5 PK13/14) - Bloom 1,8- 2.5 ml

Week 6: Grow 1ml (..or Grow 0,5 ml + 0,5 PK13/14) - Bloom 2-2.5ml

Week 7: Grow 0.5 -1ml- Bloom 2,5- 3ml (..or Grow 0,5 ml + 1ml PK13/14 - Bloom 2ml)

...Leeching/flushing starts

GoatCheese · Mar 29, 2016

ZiggyStardust said:
..actually goatcheese i don't think it makes a huge difference if you put ph-down or nutes first.

There is huge difference. Chemical reactions start happening @ extreme PH-levels. This happens all over Universe and without it life would not be possible.
My ph-down solution is ph 1. As low as it can get, right. When you insert/drop raw ph-down (ph 1) on nutrient solution, there is a good chance chemical reactions taking place, atleast in the region close to the raw ph-down "droplets", and this is why the manufactures warn about it.
But..
If you want put in the ph-down AFTER the nutrients, i suggest you dilute it first to a small amount of water and mixing it well before adding it in, and it should be abit easier on your nutes, i imagine.

I doubt i have to worry about the chemical reaction issue, because i mix my ph-down into the water before adding the nutes and additives into it. This adjusts the water to 6.5-7 and i find it hard to believe this would be harmful to the nutrients cause it's the level they should perform anyways.

NewAgeGenetics · Mar 29, 2016

you should give plus 1 ml/liter topmax in flowering! thats a very good stuff. I also give them in veg (biogrow+topmax ...works great)

maybe we should use algamic instead of biogrow in veg!? maybe not... lol

Ez Rider · Mar 29, 2016

I was wondering if anyone has experience running biobizz with blumats?

ZiggyStardust · Mar 29, 2016

GoatCheese said:
There is huge difference. Chemical reactions start happening @ extreme PH-levels. This happens all over Universe and without it life would not be possible.
My ph-down solution is ph 1. As low as it can get, right. When you insert/drop raw ph-down (ph 1) on nutrient solution, there is a good chance chemical reactions taking place, atleast in the region close to the raw ph-down "droplets", and this is why the manufactures warn about it.
But..
If you want put in the ph-down AFTER the nutrients, i suggest you dilute it first to a small amount of water and mixing it well before adding it in, and it should be abit easier on your nutes, i imagine.

I doubt i have to worry about the chemical reaction issue, because i mix my ph-down into the water before adding the nutes and additives into it. This adjusts the water to 6.5-7 and i find it hard to believe this would be harmful to the nutrients cause it's the level they should perform anyways.

i have to think about this but you're making definetely sense! ph is related to the concentration of H+ ions in water... i have to think what kind of chemical reaction takes place when inserting the ph-down (acid)... i know a lot of people are doing my same process, but i would follow your advice, doesn't change my routine too much!

your feeding schedule is kinda like mine but i never use that much grow - i also use bioheaven, algamic, topmax and rootjuice.

NewAgeGenetics said:
you should give plus 1 ml/liter topmax in flowering! thats a very good stuff. I also give them in veg (biogrow+topmax ...works great)

maybe we should use algamic instead of biogrow in veg!? maybe not... lol

fishmix can substitute biogrow, algamic is more of a stimulant, a microelement-booster (its NPK is 0.1-0-0.2). topmax is basically fulvic acids, never tried to feed topmax in veg!

ZiggyStardust · Mar 29, 2016

Ez Rider said:
I was wondering if anyone has experience running biobizz with blumats?

i did about 3 years ago... it works except for biogrow it's a little too dense drippers got dirty preatty fast...

ZiggyStardust · Mar 29, 2016

skunkfunk said:
^^just finished using old timers and loving bio bizz, an improvement from Oldtimers.

i missed your post! i don't mean "old timers" the fert brand, but on another forum there's this grower named "oldtimers1" who suggested a much different feeding schedule. someone earlier on this thread adviced to check his feeding chart out... i googled it and found it, so i was curious to know if anyone had tried it or if it makes sense to anyone... there's a lot of grow at the end with reduced bloom to lower P levels: should improve taste, he says...

Piff Rhys Jones · Mar 29, 2016

ZiggyStardust said:
i read an old thread on another forum where this grower (oldtimer1) adviced to cut the bloom (from 3-4 ml/l to 1) and double the grow (from 1 to 2) as soon as pistils start change colour. This should improve taste lowering P and have a better NPK ratio towards the end...
Does this make sense for anyone?

I've always wondered why OT1 suggests increasing N at the end of flowering. He also recommends feeding all the way to harvest. Sounds like a recipe for overfeeding, especially since plants are eating less when reaching maturity.

In my experience any excess N by harvest time makes the bud taste bad and burn black.

I feed 2ml/L fishmix for veg, then during flower 1ml/L fishmix for first 2 weeks, then just bloom gradually increasing throughout flower peaking at 3ml/L. Finally they get just plain water for last three weeks to deplete the medium. This way they're never overfed N during flower and will always burn clean and tasty.

Peace

NewAgeGenetics · Mar 29, 2016

try topmax. bloom faster and bigger. very easy to feed with the biobizz nutes.

Ez Rider · Mar 30, 2016

ZiggyStardust said:
i did about 3 years ago... it works except for biogrow it's a little too dense drippers got dirty preatty fast...

Were you running a gravity system, or pressurized? I had the same trouble with PBP when I was doing a gravity res, but the pressurized system seems to keep things "moving". I've been off biobizz for awhile, and I'd like to give it another shot. Just has to be blumat compatible. They're the one thing I can't give up.

ZiggyStardust · Mar 30, 2016

Ez Rider said:
Were you running a gravity system, or pressurized? I had the same trouble with PBP when I was doing a gravity res, but the pressurized system seems to keep things "moving". I've been off biobizz for awhile, and I'd like to give it another shot. Just has to be blumat compatible. They're the one thing I can't give up.

gravity. i understand you wanna go with blumats...

i think you can do that only with a more frequent cleaning...

maybe with the pressurized system you'll have no issues...

ZiggyStardust · Mar 30, 2016

Piff Rhys Jones said:
I've always wondered why OT1 suggests increasing N at the end of flowering. He also recommends feeding all the way to harvest. Sounds like a recipe for overfeeding, especially since plants are eating less when reaching maturity.

In my experience any excess N by harvest time makes the bud taste bad and burn black.

I feed 2ml/L fishmix for veg, then during flower 1ml/L fishmix for first 2 weeks, then just bloom gradually increasing throughout flower peaking at 3ml/L. Finally they get just plain water for last three weeks to deplete the medium. This way they're never overfed N during flower and will always burn clean and tasty.

Peace

exacty! but he guy seems to know growing and plant chemistry really well... he says that the increase in grow could somehow help reducing P and increasing K at the end which should help getting a cleaner tastier smoke... he goes preatty inside chemistry which would take long time for me to fully understand... basically saying biogrow is not just N and goes into looking what are the actual substances inside biogrow providing N ending up briefly explaining why raising biogrow at the end would help raise the potash levels and reduce the phosphorous and also get a "better NPK ratio"...
i was curious to see if anyone dared

to follow his schedule because i didn't really understand his explanations... maybe i'll do a side-by-side! i have 3 clones of my Goji OG keeper in veg, i've already stopped ph-ing one, now i will also try oldtimer's end flowering thing

in that thread (which however is preatty old, i think back from 2005...) some people (including him i think) were saying fishmix is a better more ready source of N... did you use biogrow and switched to fishmix? do you like it better? might get myself a bottle!

ZiggyStardust · Mar 30, 2016

GoatCheese said:
There is huge difference. Chemical reactions start happening @ extreme PH-levels. This happens all over Universe and without it life would not be possible.
My ph-down solution is ph 1. As low as it can get, right. When you insert/drop raw ph-down (ph 1) on nutrient solution, there is a good chance chemical reactions taking place, atleast in the region close to the raw ph-down "droplets", and this is why the manufactures warn about it.
But..
If you want put in the ph-down AFTER the nutrients, i suggest you dilute it first to a small amount of water and mixing it well before adding it in, and it should be abit easier on your nutes, i imagine.

I doubt i have to worry about the chemical reaction issue, because i mix my ph-down into the water before adding the nutes and additives into it. This adjusts the water to 6.5-7 and i find it hard to believe this would be harmful to the nutrients cause it's the level they should perform anyways.

i don't know if biobizz upgraded their site... i'm preatty sure i never saw this page about ph and ec values with biobizz...
http://www.biobizz.com/tips-tricks-2/alle-informatie-over-ph-en-ec-waarden
they basically say what you're saying: it's not important to adjust ph with biobizz, as long as soil ph remains in the right spot... and if your water gets far away optimal levels, adjust it roughly to 6.8/7.2 and AFTER add nutes.

so apparently i've been using these products the wrong way for 6 years

(thanks goatcheese)

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