Mealworm poop?

I don't yet have a worm bin for my garden, but what I do have is a mealworm bin for my hedgehog, who enjoys the little things more than anything in the world. Does anyone possibly have any experience with mealworm poop? I've about five gallons of the stuff right now, a very fine grey powdery material, and I'm wondering what the hell to do with it.

UPDATE: I did some digging! Insect poop is called "frass" - and according to wikipedia http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Frass - "It causes plants to excrete chitinase due to high chitin levels, it is a natural bloom stimulant, and has high nutrient levels. Frass is known to have abundant amoeba, beneficial bacteria, and fungi content. Frass is a microbial inoculant, also known as a soil inoculant, that promotes plant health using beneficial microbes. It is a large nutrient contributor to the rainforest, and it can often be seen in leaf mines."

-From a site on setting up mealworm bins for your birds - "Mealworm frass is an exquisite plant fertilizer – indoors and out. We do, however, recommend not having it on the top of the soil for indoor plants as watering it will enhance its odor. Otherwise, we’ve not met any kind of plant – leafing, flowering, or fruiting - that doesn’t love mealworm frass."

-Someone did an article about it over at another growing site, but I'm not sure on IC's rules about posting links to other grow forums, is it allowed?

-I've found frass for sale from hydrostores online. It's suggested that frass A)Kills fungus gnats, B)kills root-feeding nematodes, and C)It contains, and I don't know how believable this one is, I hope microbeman stops by "6+ TRILLION cfu/gm(Is gm a typo there? Do they mean g?); no other biologic source comes close - 100 Billion Fungi spores per gram"

If any of those claims are true I've some awesome stuff on my hands!

Since the mealworm bin needed cleaning anyway, I might as well save the frass. Apparently frass is made up of eggs and poop, so I will have to save it for a couple weeks with some oats, let the larvae hatch, and then sift them out. After that though I should have a bucketful of frass!

Unfortunately I'm not growing that wonderful good green(for a variety of reasons) right now, but I'm going to try a side-by-side with some tomatoes indoors, and then a side-by-side out in the main garden. It's a start to figuring out the effect this stuff will have. The worms will be here regardless, but if I can get a fertilizer out of them as well they're paying their way twice.

- Mr. S

haven't got a hedgehog, they aren't in this country ... but can't see how mealworm poop could possibly be bad for organic growing.

give it a try. you could become the worlds leading expert on mealworm poop. think of that!

cheers

Ive got a friend with next to unlimited access to various types of frass. Ive been amending my soil beds, topdressing, and making foliar from mealworm, superworm, and somehting I think called green dragon something or other. There are various grades & npk of the stuff, which seems to be indicated by depth of color. really good stuff.

got pics? must be a cool pet. add it to compost pile the poo that is

if it causes plants to excrete chitinase, don't compost it! could be a great natural anti fungal

That's what I'm thinking mad. Use it as a base soil mix or on top as a dressing. Especially if the talk of microbe and fungal life is true.

When we had the leopard gecko I would use the cricket bedding and gecko poop for my plants, which they LOVED. Even better was when I would clean out the gecko tank completely to change out his sand, give the same to some plants and OHMYGOD.

Use the mealworm poo.

I'd imagine plants loved insect poo, that is, both poo from insects, and poo from animals that eat insects.

What kind of gecko did you have?

I had a Tokay Gecko for quite a few years. Sat along side the scorpions, snakes, and tarantulas. My dad brought em home, gifts from coworkers.

I would use this crap.

ixnay007 said:

I'd imagine plants loved insect poo, that is, both poo from insects, and poo from animals that eat insects.

What kind of gecko did you have?

I had a Tokay Gecko for quite a few years. Sat along side the scorpions, snakes, and tarantulas. My dad brought em home, gifts from coworkers.

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I'm familiar with Tokays, they can pack quite a nasty bite. Incredibly beautiful and that croak is just completely bizarre. I used to work aquatic/exotic import & export when I lived in the LA area, then again in San Diego when Petschmo tried to centralize their animal distribution network, instead of having vendors ship direct to store.

We had a leopard gecko, left over from when my stepson joined the Navy. Yoshi finally died two years ago. Just stopped eating, so he was put out of his misery instead of starving to death (I hate force feeding, and the animal was at least 15yo, seemed he'd lived his life).

Folks with fish can feed them insects as well, which will improve their health as well as subsequent waste. Obviously, be sure they're getting animals that absolutely have not been exposed to any kind of "cides", and that they can physically handle the bug in question. My favorite is to give cockroaches to oscars and other large cichlids, as well as pacu. They go nucking FUTS and it's much better than feeding them goldfish. Some fish have to be taught to take live food, though.

The organic section is like some weird family. I like it here. Leopard geckos are fun!

I wonder if there is some other bug that creates good excrement similar to this and that does not turn into a beetle? I was thinking about building a two-part box, with the top filled with plant wastes from flowering plants and then the bugs to eat them. All that on top of a screen they can't get through, but the frass can at least somewhat. That would probably keep their habitat more clean, and neatly collect the frass. This stuff is EXPENSIVE to buy... wow... just looked it up.... wow....

Before you use it though, I would caution you read this article and consider composting it a bit first. At least put it in a mix of 25% frass and 75% coir, and then treat it with AACT once a week in a container with really good drainage(put a screen or landscaping fabric out of it, keep the bugs out!). There's probably better methods, but that's how I treat new manures if I haven't already had them sitting around for a year or two. I know not everyone has the room to do that though.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/19389288

The bugs can transmit things based on what they eat. This is common in nature, it's part of the natural selection process, but obviously that won't work for us. I'm guessing at minimum a process like I suggested above might stop it, but I'd wait for an expert to weigh in on if hot compost is required.....

Crickets do *not* turn into beetles in my experience.

magiccannabus said:

I wonder if there is some other bug that creates good excrement similar to this and that does not turn into a beetle?

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Is there a reason to avoid beetles? I think mealworms are so good because they are a catterpillarish larval stage. They are designed to eat and excrete. And the adults don't fly, nor scamper like crickets. They aren't escape artists. It's easy to feed them grain year round. Anything eating green vegetation is going to be more difficult to keep during the winter months.

The frass sifted from a mealworm colony should contain a lot of shed larval skin material.

Very cool. Grown many mealworms in my time, never thought to use the frass on my plants. Let us know how it goes.

I have nothing against the beetles, but where do they go after they become beetles? Do they continue to eat and poop and lay eggs, or do I need to throw them outside or something?

All the commercial products I have seen just say "derived from herbivore insect frass", but they do not specify what type of insects.

magiccannabus said:

I have nothing against the beetles, but where do they go after they become beetles? Do they continue to eat and poop and lay eggs, or do I need to throw them outside or something?

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Commercial mealworm farmers raise these things in trays. As a kid I had a colony in the bottom of a five gallon metal tub that went for many years. The adult beetles don't ever fly to my knowledge (they have wings though). The beetles can be predatory on the pupae and larvae, so some recommend trying to keep them separate. Keeping a moisture source like a piece of potato or cactus in there helps lessen the beetle's motivation for cannibalism.

These things have evolved to get into granary containers and then just eat and reproduce.

magiccannabus said:

I wonder if there is some other bug that creates good excrement similar to this and that does not turn into a beetle?

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The Black Soldier Fly larvae can make some serious poop but does not become a beetle.

https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=135093

Thanks for the info. Those fly larvae look really great! I don't think they make the same frass as the mealworms though. I wonder if a system could combine them somehow, or use wastes from one for the other? Or is the poop fairly similar?