High Ambient CO2.

Howdy.

I have a CO2 monitor - doesn’t control anything. I questioned its accuracy. The readings just seemed too high. Even after recalibrating it a few times. I wrote it off as junk. Especially without a point of comparison, I didn’t want to trust it. Saturday I got a CO2 controller with digital PPM readout. It seems that I should not have questioned the smaller one’s accuracy:



This is ambient CO2. Surely something’s up. Right? The only possible suspect I have - as of now - is improper venting from the hot water heater. I just haven’t had time yet to investigate the cause. These reading don’t fluctuate a whole lot, throughout the house. But they do fluctuate between 200 and 300 PPMs. For example I’ve had readings as high as 1300+ but generally not below 1000 in the same area(s) over hours of time.

Thoughts, ideas, suggestions, advice — greatly appreciated.

Thanks.

thats an awesome problem to have, congrats.

The more plants you grow the lower it will go.

plutosmoke said:

thats an awesome problem to have, congrats.

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I got a good laugh out of this. Thanks.

You’re right, considering the shared interest/hobby/profession around here, my problem hardly seems like a problem. And I’ll likely be able to use this to my advantage in that area.

But I’m more concerned with whether this is a symptom of a greater problem. A quick look around online has these numbers indicated as high. And possibly a health concern.

But hell, it hasn’t killed me yet and for all I know these numbers have always been high... might explain why I’m so weird.

Smokin’ down while overdosing on CO2 ... Yo!

corky1968 said:

The more plants you grow the lower it will go.

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There is a plus side!

If nothing else it should prove to be a good mystery.

I think you are measuring your ability to exhale CO2, but that is a guess. What size room is this? Ambient re: in the grow room? Do you walk in and immediately see this reading?

Mikell said:

I think you are measuring your ability to exhale CO2, but that is a guess. What size room is this? Ambient re: in the grow room? Do you walk in and immediately see this reading?

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I’ve measured multiple rooms (areas) in the house.

Not much difference. This pic was taken immediately upon entering the room (roughly 800 cubic feet) after a bit more than an hour of having the filter running at slight negative pressure...



This is upstairs on a wall table in the dinning room:



I wondered about the high levels just being from me exhaling, but they're awful high to just be attributed to that, or so I'd think...

Thanks Mikell for taking the time!

You can take it outside to test if it is reading true, should be less than 400ppm outdoors!

moses wellfleet said:

You can take it outside to test if it is reading true, should be less than 400ppm outdoors!

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Thanks moses. I'm pretty sure if I do, I'll find a reading of around 400 ... because I’ve re-calibrated the smaller one three times. It’s been taken outdoors to do this. It uses 400 PPM as a baseline. When spring finally broke and before I turned on the AC in the house I took some readings:



And over an hour later after having opened all the windows in the house:



A few days later after I turned the AC on:



The new one (controller) out of the box is matching the smaller one for readings. So I now believe it to be accurate. Whereas before I was thinking it must not be accurate to have readings like this. I've just been really busy lately and haven't had a chance to try to track this down... and maybe it's not anything to be concerned about (?) which is why I wanted to ask what y'all think!

Thanks.

Are you brewing alotta beer in there by any chance?

id be willing to bet that your furnace/hot water heater/gas stove are main contributors to that reading. if you have any of those it would be wise to look into seeing if you have a blocked exhaust/flue. a couple hundred ppm ive seen but thats pretty high and if you have any of those near by it could be a warning to check an make sure you cant get carbon monoxide poison.

Maybe they eat lots of pork & beans and fart all day long.

moses wellfleet said:

Are you brewing alotta beer in there by any chance?

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— I wish it were something so obvious.

Outside the possibility that a small cat and I could produce such an excess, I have only the hot water heater to suspect. I think it’s the only other possible thing producing CO2. Well, possibilities are probably many, but as far as the obvious goes...

zerocool21 said:

id be willing to bet that your furnace/hot water heater/gas stove are main contributors to that reading. if you have any of those it would be wise to look into seeing if you have a blocked exhaust/flue. a couple hundred ppm ive seen but thats pretty high and if you have any of those near by it could be a warning to check an make sure you cant get carbon monoxide poison.

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This is where I'm inclined to look. No gas stove. Electronic ignition on the furnace so no pilot there, nor function this time of year. Hot water heater burning natural gas, producing CO2... possibly some problem with exhausting it... this seems a likely path. But I'm also wondering if somehow the AC could contribute. The readings weren't as high during the winter months. But at that time the monitor was inside a 4X4 tent. Only after recalibrating once spring came did I place it upstairs... and once I saw nearly 1300 I concluded that the unit must not be doing its job correctly. But that no longer seems to be the problem.

Thanks.

Gonna take the new unit outdoors tomorrow to see what it reads.

Many chimeny and house exhausts are poorly installed. Excessive elbows, long runs, poor vent termination, etc. re: your original thinking.

Take cold showers for a few days?

Bonus, it's savage as fuck.

And to source a review from your lighter pocketbook, which do you prefer of the two monitors?

I've worked in 12 light veg/flower rooms for a few hours with the door closed and maintain enough CO2 to kaibash the unit. Varies on plant load.

like suggested, take a shower (hot) then turn the hot water heater off for a coupla 3 days stinky and see what its reading then.. personally I'd go with the it cant be good breathing that much co2 for any prolonged period and would, without hesitation, find and correct the problem. You are venting your grow to outside the house right?


EDIT: how old is the house? made of what? do you live alone?? you don't have a brother/sister growing schrooms in the basement do you?

That’s it. I’m going full-hippie this weekend. I’ll kill the hot water heater Friday and see where I’m at in comparison come Sunday night. Wow. This dumb old stoner hadn’t even thought of that. I was gonna call someone in to have a look-see. This should be a simple way to include or exclude the heater. Yeah... like, thanks, and stuff...

Mikell said:

Many chimeny and house exhausts are poorly installed. Excessive elbows, long runs, poor vent termination, etc. re: your original thinking.

Take cold showers for a few days?

Bonus, it's savage as fuck.

And to source a review from your lighter pocketbook, which do you prefer of the two monitors?

I've worked in 12 light veg/flower rooms for a few hours with the door closed and maintain enough CO2 to kaibash the unit. Varies on plant load.

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For a straight-up monitor the iCeeO2 seems nice. Prominent PPM readout. It can also create a trend chart if you want to track one of the three: RH, Temp, or PPM. I’m especially more favorable to it now that I have reason to think it accurate. And actually I almost feel bad about the way I treated the little guy. Should probably give it a pat on the back and apologize for all the f-bombs I threw at it.

The other one is more of a controller. I never would’ve bought it if not for Drop That Sound’s link to it — thanks DTS! A controller with digital readout that also allows for the setting of high low trigger points for less than $200? I was sold. But I haven’t even had it trigger the generator yet. I’m still surprised that it’s reading so close to the monitor (wasn't expecting it). So I haven’t really even looked into its other features yet. But for the money it definitely has the feel of quality. I’d prefer instead of measuring air pressure it would do RH. But that’s probably me just being picky; and maybe I’ll come to find the pressure reading useful...

I’ll try to forgo the savage part but if it comes to that - I’m ready.

Snook said:

like suggested, take a shower (hot) then turn the hot water heater off for a coupla 3 days stinky and see what its reading then.. personally I'd go with the it cant be good breathing that much co2 for any prolonged period and would, without hesitation, find and correct the problem. You are venting your grow to outside the house right?


EDIT: how old is the house? made of what? do you live alone?? you don't have a brother/sister growing schrooms in the basement do you?

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Agreed. I can't imagine it's a good thing and need to find and address the issue.

Snook said:

..growing schrooms in the basement do you?

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Hey now, c’mon man, I paid good money for my instructional video:



But nah, no Golden Teacher these days... hey, Snook, I think you just got me thinking... this old DVD is looking a bit dusty...

Small (1100 sqft) brick ranch. Just me and a small cat. 1960. No current grow to vent. But when I do it will not be to outside, just into the basement.

Had the new one outside today for about an hour and a half. This was the lowest reading I found:



Should have a much better idea what's going on come Sunday. Thanks!

Stinky! its 2 weeks later, you can turn the hot water heater back on..
What happened??

Hiya Snook.

The water heater has been ruled-out. Much to my surprise. But hey, there’s an upside - I’m back to stink free! Well, not completely

Check this out, it’s almost 24hrs after killing the heater:



So I opened all the windows (basement too) and in less than an hour:




I then closed everything back up and left to tend to things elsewhere. I was gone almost five hours and returned to find PPMs climbing... this is [last] Sunday morning, nearly 48hrs after killing the heater:



Right now, Sunday, it’s one week after the heater was turned back on; and right now I’m reading 1220.

So... at this point I’m thinking it’s a combination of Mikell’s first line of thought (my ability to exhale CO2) and the house’s HVAC sytem exchanging at a less than ideal rate. I plan on getting some smoke candles and then seal up leaky ducting to the best of my ability. And then see if there’s a difference. The furnace has an inspection tag on it from ’98, so it's almost twenty-years-old now. And the system’s ducting original.

The water heater may be contributing, but it’s not the sole source. And somewhere along the way I read that indoor levels should be less than the outside measurement plus 600, so, since my outdoor measurements averaged out to be about 400, I should be below 1000 indoors.

I’m hoping that by sealing up the ducting and thereby, hopefully, improving the exchange rate, I’ll see the numbers drop.

Thoughts?

trying to think outside the box.. how old is the house? is anything rotting (does rotting off gas co2?)? could the house be built on some co2 producing ??? stuff? outside is good, right?


you been fighting this for some time, right?

I have wondered if somehow CO2 is coming up through the floor drains... there’s two in the basement.

Nothing rotting that I’m aware of. Outside measures fine. House was built in 1960. I don’t know how long the numbers have been high. I’ve only had the monitor for about a year and a half - and have questioned its readings since day one. Only very recently confirmed its readings with the new controller.

Not sure at this point what could be going on. Really surprised it wasn’t the hot water heater. Reading 1440 right now...

Mikell said:

I've worked in 12 light veg/flower rooms for a few hours with the door closed and maintain enough CO2 to kaibash the unit. Varies on plant load.

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How about this. No plant load. Me breathing deeply and exhaling (not blowing) toward the CO2 sensor from about a foot away raised levels to the 2200 range. I also spent a good deal of time in the room - more than an hour.. thinking and planning... found readings staring around 1100 climbing above 1800.

I wouldn’t have thought it in my power to raise the numbers like this. But the fact that I did so seems to give credence to your thinking and experience.

But with all that said, numbers this high don’t seem to check-out with what’s considered normal.

On the other hand, the positive side of all this is that if it’s not detrimental to my health, then that’s less heat added, and potentially more room for additional light wattage. Since the generator will be engaging so infrequently.

Probably should've just subscribed to the old line of, 'if it ain't broke don't fix it'...