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Seed size

midwestkid

midwestkid

Well-known member
Veteran
I recently made a cross with KC Brains mango as the mother and Karma Ghostrider OG as the father.
While sorting through the seeds I noticed 2 distinct size differences.
When I purchased the Ghostrider I was surprised to see how tiny the seeds were.
Now sorting the cross I see tiny fully developed seeds and similarly colored seeds that are double in size. Both fully dark and mature.
So my question is this... is there anyone out there that has been able to pedictively sort phenotypes based on the characteristics of the seed. Color, size, shape, markings, etc.
I'm inclined to believe the tiny seeds would be ghostrider dominant...?
I know someone will say "grow them and find out" and I will. Just wondering if anyone has any input on this subject.
I thought it was surprising to see the size differences of the seeds assuming there was only one pollen source.
And go......
 
Douglas.Curtis

Douglas.Curtis

Autistic Diplomat in Training
midwestkid said:
I thought it was surprising to see the size differences of the seeds assuming there was only one pollen source.
And go......
Click to expand...
This is where I would start, with my first question being "which size are there the most of?"

(Edit: The following would only be true if different pollen can determine seed size)
Absolutely no sign of even a single male flower on the female? HEPA filtered grow, so definitely no stray pollen? If your air is unfiltered and/or you find a single male flower, I would consider the smaller number of seeds to be intruder or hermi.
 
midwestkid

midwestkid

Well-known member
Veteran
So if I'm reading this right. You are implying that given one pollen donor alone all seeds should be relatively identical?
 
WelderDan

WelderDan

Well-known member
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This may sound weird, but if you pollinate a preflower, the seed will be larger than seeds from a pollinated bud on the same plant.

I don't know why this is, but I have experienced this several times. My guess is that a preflower is just a single seed bract, so all the energy goes into producing that single seed, unlike a bud that is expending energy to grow the bud, which has multiple seed bracts. But that's just my hypothesis.
 
Dropped Cat

Dropped Cat

Six Gummi Bears and Some Scotch
Veteran
I have only seen uniformity with my seeded plants.

My thought is if the plant is fully dusted, then all the seeds will be
roughly the same size.

I haven't yet harvested a plant that had big and small seeds.

Good thread.
 
midwestkid

midwestkid

Well-known member
Veteran
I will attempt to post a picture of these seeds. Bare with me this will be my first photo on here.
 
midwestkid

midwestkid

Well-known member
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midwestkid

midwestkid

Well-known member
Veteran
Wow I think I did it? Sorry about the picture quality.
So both sizes of seeds shown. Same plant. And I'm pretty confident there was only one pollen donor as it was intentionally dusted by qtip.
 
Fitzera

Fitzera

Active member
I'm going to be pollinating a variety of plants selectively with a variety of pollen. I'll report back with my findings. We shall see if one plant, pollinated by different donors produces the same size or differing sizes of seed. I've found slight variations in size but not like you have.

I find it interesting what you've found. I've never heard of this so I dont know what to make of it other than maybe some seeds just didnt get the same energy for production for some reason. The fact that they're all mature points to just the one pollen donor (you via qtip). Maybe it's a trait of the mother. Let us know what you find when growing some of these out!
 
Shmavis

Shmavis

Being-in-the-world
Dropped Cat said:
I have only seen uniformity with my seeded plants.

My thought is if the plant is fully dusted, then all the seeds will be
roughly the same size.

I haven't yet harvested a plant that had big and small seeds.

Good thread.
Click to expand...

Me either. But always a few outliers.

midwestkid said:
[URL=https://www.icmag.com/ic/picture.php?albumid=82422&pictureid=2010598&thumb=1]View Image[/url]
Click to expand...

I have never seen a difference that great. Here's one of my recent seed harvests before cleaning. Even with multiple pollen donors from the same var, the difference isn't that great. Upfront center does show one that looks smaller in comparison to the majority, or may just be the big one to the right is the outlier.

picture.php
 
NEED 4 SEED

NEED 4 SEED

Well-known member
Hi, I am posting my answer from another thread with the same discussion:

https://www.icmag.com/ic/showpost.php?p=8523644&postcount=95


NEED 4 SEED said:
I made the observation last year that calyx size is not the main (or not the only) determining factor for the seed size. I used 2 types of pollen on one plant. The mother plant was sensi skunk, pollen came from herself selfed and from chimera cookies feminized. After the harvest I separated the seeds and grew some out. After testing it was clear to me that not only there were two seed sizes in one mother plant but also that the bigger ones were from the selfing pollen and the smaller ones were from the sensi skunk/chimera cookies fem hybrid. That leads me to the conclusion that hybrid seeds aren't always bigger too. ( I was thinking this before too). My SSH x BB seeds are really tiny too, smaller than the parent seeds. So atm there is no generalizing about seed sizes in my opinion. At least not with the polyhybrid stuff we all are growing.
I posted the pic before, here are the seeds:


View Image
Click to expand...




picture.php
 
midwestkid

midwestkid

Well-known member
Veteran
Thanks for the feedback everyone. I will report back here with my findings as well.
I will grow a plant from the mother seeds next to one each of these offspring. One big seed, one small seed, and one mother seed.
Maybe I will learn something.
I personally haven't observed such significant size differences from a single pollen cross before.
My initial question was whether I could assume the smaller seeds would be ghostrider dominant as the seeds from my ghostrider pack were very small.
But the more we pick at this, the more questions arise.
I have always assumed that a different seed size would be produced by each pollen donor but after thinking further on this it seemed the structure and size of the mother plants anatomy would dictate the final size she could accommodate ?
 
Fitzera

Fitzera

Active member
midwestkid said:
Thanks for the feedback everyone. I will report back here with my findings as well.
I will grow a plant from the mother seeds next to one each of these offspring. One big seed, one small seed, and one mother seed.
Maybe I will learn something.
I personally haven't observed such significant size differences from a single pollen cross before.
My initial question was whether I could assume the smaller seeds would be ghostrider dominant as the seeds from my ghostrider pack were very small.
But the more we pick at this, the more questions arise.
I have always assumed that a different seed size would be produced by each pollen donor but after thinking further on this it seemed the structure and size of the mother plants anatomy would dictate the final size she could accommodate ?
Click to expand...

Just doing one of each size and the "control" (mother) seed wont give you the full picture, but a picture none the less. Over time of trying these seeds you'll have a better idea, you need numbers to come to a proper conclusion. I look forward to seeing what you find regardless!
 
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