I no longer believe Broad Mites cause DUDDING

didn't use to be like that...it sucks, competitiveness will only increase in the industry as things shift more towards legalization.

Lux: Thanks for the info. In spite of the 'dick measuring', there's alot of good info here.

stasis said:

https://www.icmag.com/ic/picture.php?albumid=60673&pictureid=1425520View Image GG4
https://www.icmag.com/ic/picture.php?albumid=59763&pictureid=1402312View Image Triple Diesel

Broad mites are the #1 cause of dudding. Getting rid of them entirely is a dream. It becomes a preventative situation every run. And I am very careful. Once they are in. ya better control them. But complete eradication ain't gonna happen.

Sooooo many peoples' gardens are suffering around here, and people blame it on the genetics (in the case of the gorilla glue clone, i.e - tossing a certain percentage of flowering plants every run) or specific nutrients such as Gravity.

Ignore BM/Cyclamen/Russet Mites at your peril. After 70 indoor runs, and 8 years of greenies in Nor Cal, they wiped me out. And they are here in the Midwest MMJ state I reside in now, as well. Big Time.

The recovery from the BM's was difficult, expensive, and infuriating.

Click to expand...

I know someone who is having duding in select plants all in the same beds, are these pests selective?

Have experienced this problem the last few rounds. Recently switched to LOS, however had it minorly in my last 2 liquid fed organic rounds.

The thing that I dont understand about this issue, is that I have plants that are affected, but only some of their branches. The branches that are effected look so much different than the other branches right around it. The unaffected ones are fat, chunky and coated in resin, have awesome smell. The effected ones I dont even want to smoke. They have maybe 30% of the resin content of the others.

Since noticing this problem, I have noticed lots of soil mites in my soil surface. I think this is related, but not positive. I know the soil mites come in from the worm castings.

they also come in when there is lots of dead root material. root diseases cause a build up of dead material in soil which soil mites just seem to find and multiply like mad when they do.

xxxstr8edgexxx said:

they also come in when there is lots of dead root material. root diseases cause a build up of dead material in soil which soil mites just seem to find and multiply like mad when they do.

Click to expand...

Yah I understand they gotta be eating something, but I dont understand from what. We transplant regularly (in veg), and the plants are performing great in veg, I dont notice any problems aside from chemd showing her variagation.

The roots at chop still look healthy, not complete bright white, but not yellow or dead,.

Not completely bright white can indicate something. You seem like you've been here a while. You know your plants. But if you've noticed them lots brighter white or even a little while than you are notice another sign of hopefully just needs a minor amount of attention to correct. Maybe not. You can take a clump of dirt and roots to an extension service as hops nursery stock. No one will blink. They'll tell you if you have anything pathological going on.

I sent some samples today to allcropsolutions and should be getting results soon. Overnight shipping was $111.00 from Southern Cali. 3 samples @ $75 each + tmv test is $80 setup fee and $20 per test. I bagged small branches from several plants for one sample. The other two samples are individual plants, roots and crown and a couple dud branches. So $436.00 plus a $4 blue gel icepack, and I lined the box with polystyrene (Styrofoam) from home depot, which was like $8.

Nematodes, inc test is $325 and he's going to check for the todes and also other critters and pathogens. Not sure exactly what, but I'll find out tomorrow when I call again. He mentioned it would take 2-3 weeks because they're going to put in in a dish and see what grows. Interestingly enough, it's $62 to overnight it to Selma Ca, which is only half the cost of shipping to Vacaville (near Napa), which is where allcropsolutions is located.

So I'm looking @ $860. For this round of testing. No wonder more people aren't doing this. I'll post the results as they come in.

StudenTeacher said:

I sent some samples today to allcropsolutions and should be getting results soon. Overnight shipping was $111.00 from Southern Cali. 3 samples @ $75 each + tmv test is $80 setup fee and $20 per test. I bagged small branches from several plants for one sample. The other two samples are individual plants, roots and crown and a couple dud branches. So $436.00 plus a $4 blue gel icepack, and I lined the box with polystyrene (Styrofoam) from home depot, which was like $8.

Nematodes, inc test is $325 and he's going to check for the todes and also other critters and pathogens. Not sure exactly what, but I'll find out tomorrow when I call again. He mentioned it would take 2-3 weeks because they're going to put in in a dish and see what grows. Interestingly enough, it's $62 to overnight it to Selma Ca, which is only half the cost of shipping to Vacaville (near Napa), which is where allcropsolutions is located.

So I'm looking @ $860. For this round of testing. No wonder more people aren't doing this. I'll post the results as they come in.

Click to expand...

You can ship regular three day priority usps flat rate and get nice healthy material to arrive. I bet you could send it that way and it would be in good enough shape for them to clone it if they wanted to.
Did they say they firmly required that shipping method. Someone who isn't me ships fresh snips on the regular all over the world and they come out ready to clone.
I mean how do you think these diseases get spread. lol.

lol@ swim

thanks foir going through the lengths to hopefully get a bit more clarity on the issue StudentTeacher! hope everything's going well with you man...gotta link up sometime!

xxxstr8edgexxx said:

You can ship regular three day priority usps flat rate and get nice healthy material to arrive. I bet you could send it that way and it would be in good enough shape for them to clone it if they wanted to.
Did they say they firmly required that shipping method. Someone who isn't me ships fresh snips on the regular all over the world and they come out ready to clone.
I mean how do you think these diseases get spread. lol.

Click to expand...

The dude at nematodes inc said two day was OK. Allcropsolutions wanted overnight. Hopefully there is no 'next time', but if there is, I'll ask about two day air to allcropsolutions. Seems like three day air would be worth a try for those short on cash (like me, lol). If it shows up in bad shape, just send another sample. I have 6kw of samples this time. Too late for me, but maybe it'll work for someone else. Three day is probably like $12.

Also, to save money, one sample can consist of more than one plant. Both labs told me to put a few plants together in the same bag to be tested as one sample. I mentioned I did this with branches in my earlier post, but it's also OK to do with the rootballs and crowns. I opted for the extra couple of tests because I think a few of my got pythium and didn't dud. I had fungus gnats for the first time in a great while, and I killed the bastards with gnatrol. Around that same time, the pump attached to my watering hose died. I hand water with a big ass pump and a drinking water safe garden hose, from a 55 gallon drum. There was maybe 3 inches of water in it when i found the dead pump and the water felt like a jacuzzi. How long the pump was plugged in I have no idea, it could have been several days. Sometimes I forget to unplug it, but I've never felt warm water, let alone hot. To make a long story short, dead fungus gnats larvae+hot ass water, coincidentally on the same day, made the plants not so thirsty all of the sudden. I use bcuzz bloom, and on occasion floralicious bloom(not at same time), and chitosan in the res, and the organic material I'm sure played a role in the scenario. Two days later the plants started sagging. This happened to some duds and some non duds, and is not dud related as far as symptoms go, though they may have already had a compromised immune system. The duds are duds:-/ So, that's why I went with more tests.

After so many years, I've been getting lazy I guess, and making quite avoidable mistakes. Time to step up my game. My first ten years were near perfect, powdery mildew twice and spider mites in veg one time. The last five have been quite a different story, with all the funky shit being passed around. No more 'home grower' mentality, not with these kind of pests.

-- Thanks for the kind words Deezy, way to go on the container! I've been checking out the thread

I forgot to mention, anyone that doesn't want to take the time to cut the polystyrene sheets from the box stores can likely get a polystyrene lined box from a UPS store, but they are $15. If you're like me and at home depot 8 days a week, no big deal. Not sure that gas money + time would be worth saving the $7 if I had to go out of my way at all.

Eagerly awaiting your lab test results Studenteacher. Props on doing this for the community.

Peace

big ups student teacher on tests. im sorry that you had a 6 pack of duds though,. that sucks man. i hope you never see them again.

Thanks for the support everyone
Allcropsolutions received the package sept 2, about 17 hours after I sent it from SoCal When the testing is complete they will notify me, at which point I pay for for their services.
I was anxious and called earlier today, having not heard from them yet. I thought I would get an email with a PayPal Addy or something, right when they got the goods, but, based on the convo, I'm assuming the tests we're already underway, so no worries. When they're finished up, they said they prefer a check. I'm sure a money order would be fine, though I didn't ask.
I'm sending out the package to Nematodes, inc on Monday, so still no progress on that. The nematode situation piqued my curiosity to the max. Might they really be the cause of this madness??? Or is it good 'ol fusarium? Something new and exotic??? Stay tuned and find out
I was unfortunately a bit too baked to ask when the tests would be completed, so looks like we're in the dark on that one. Sorry 'bout that.

Subbed

I have been keeping up on this discussion. I found some branches on the wifi that didn't look right. I have been talking to others growing this cut. They do not have the same health issues my cut has.. I can't say with any certainty what I saw was dudding. I'm leaning more towards a health issue. To be safe I will be making some changes...

I was using just Crab shell mixed into the soil. I will start using insect frass added to my compost teas. From what I have read there is nothing that is available to control Nematodes. The only thing that is ever discussed is Chitin. Can anyone verify the right kind of Chitosan before I buy what I found. This stuff is not very cheap.

Bestchitosan. Com product cop1, chitosan oligosaccaride lactate.

I only used it for a month, then ran out. Shortly after problems started to occur. I've had 3 runs with no signs of any dud activity, but I took in some clones from a friend, so I wanted to incorporate it into the nutrient regimen just in case. He hasn't had duds, though he mentioned the vigor of the j1 was not what it used to be, and dropped from 2lb a kW to 1.75lb. The J1 is the first plant that showed signs. I know he does a root soak in bennies after clones are cut and before they're planted into starter plugs. Also uses great White. I don't use these products. He also uses eagle20 at flip. I did notice a few weird leaves last time in was at his place but his rooms are doing great and he's pulling quality still. Makes me think it's a fungus or pathogen that is kept in check by these products. He might be using pesticides as well so maybe that theory isn't so sound. I'm getting more excited every second to find out the test results.

Purple Frostbyte said:

I have been keeping up on this discussion. I found some branches on the wifi that didn't look right. I have been talking to others growing this cut. They do not have the same health issues my cut has.. I can't say with any certainty what I saw was dudding. I'm leaning more towards a health issue. To be safe I will be making some changes...

I was using just Crab shell mixed into the soil. I will start using Chitosan 90% Powdered Extract and insect frass added to my compost teas. From what I have read there is nothing that is available to control Nematodes. The only thing that is ever discussed is Chitin. Can anyone verify the right kind of Chitosan before I buy what I found. This stuff is not very cheap.

Click to expand...

Any pics of the WiFi?

i've seen duds when eagle is part of the preventative regiment fwiw

can't wait to see your lab results ST!