RM - aquagrower
Active member
damn, spent the last hour typing and lost it.
-
Happy Birthday ICMag! Been 20 years since Gypsy Nirvana created the forum! We are celebrating with a 4/20 Giveaway and by launching a new Patreon tier called "420club". You can read more here.
-
Important notice: ICMag's T.O.U. has been updated. Please review it here. For your convenience, it is also available in the main forum menu, under 'Quick Links"!
RM - aquagrower
Active member
THS,
no worries dude, temps are great (it's still cold here). canopy is 78 deg F, under canopy is 70, and water temp is 68. couldn't be better. did add another circulation fan above the canopy the help keep the air moving. it's getting pretty thick in there.
before giving the plants the pure blend, i first checked it with the fish. i added an oz to a 10 gal feeder tank (with about 30 1-2" goldies) with no ill effects, so 3 oz ain't gonna hurt nothing.
BB,
having grown up in a "state that borders mexico", i can't imagine being able to conquer the heat. it's a hell of a lot easier to heat than it is to cool.
if ya can maintain absolute control over the ambient temps and humidity levels, i can picture a greenhouse consisting of a bunch of "sub-systems".
each sub-system would consist of a small fish pond, and a "grow channel" about 3' wide running the length of the green house and back. ya could have "grow slabs" that sit in the channel with the water being pumped from the fish pond, thru the channels, and back. more than likely including a large swamp cooler to help w/ the temps.
could combine a swamp cooler type AC unit w/ a trickle style bio filter, all in one unit. but that's another subject.
no worries dude, temps are great (it's still cold here). canopy is 78 deg F, under canopy is 70, and water temp is 68. couldn't be better. did add another circulation fan above the canopy the help keep the air moving. it's getting pretty thick in there.
before giving the plants the pure blend, i first checked it with the fish. i added an oz to a 10 gal feeder tank (with about 30 1-2" goldies) with no ill effects, so 3 oz ain't gonna hurt nothing.
BB,
having grown up in a "state that borders mexico", i can't imagine being able to conquer the heat. it's a hell of a lot easier to heat than it is to cool.
if ya can maintain absolute control over the ambient temps and humidity levels, i can picture a greenhouse consisting of a bunch of "sub-systems".
each sub-system would consist of a small fish pond, and a "grow channel" about 3' wide running the length of the green house and back. ya could have "grow slabs" that sit in the channel with the water being pumped from the fish pond, thru the channels, and back. more than likely including a large swamp cooler to help w/ the temps.
could combine a swamp cooler type AC unit w/ a trickle style bio filter, all in one unit. but that's another subject.
Last edited:
BakedBeans
Member
Yeah, heat's gonna be a problem. It's not a desert here though, I think it's doable.
If Home Depot can have a huge outside greenhouse and make it all year, so can I.
I think this is where the geothermal cooling could come in handy. By having a large outdoor pond that is deep, I can pretty much insure temps on the bottom are going to be in the 70's around the hottest part of the year. By having coils running through that and then buried 6 feet underground running to the greenhouse (or down a well, and then to the greenhouse), I think it would be much more feasible to cool down, especially if I combine it with a large, efficient swamp cooler.
I'm starting to re-think the "Fish under Veggies" theory. The only thing I'm hung up on is access to the fish. I would need decent access to the tanks to pull fish out or put them in. I don't know how I could do that if I had a long row with a long tank.
Man, I need to get started getting an aquarium together. Any suggestions on a couple of fish just to run some experiments? Should I just start with plain goldfish for now? Has there been a rough formula decided on plants to fish? I want to grow a small tray of strawberries and a tray of blueberries. Probably no more than a dozen plants or so.
I was thinking about just going ahead and getting a 25 gallon tank. My kiddo would like it.
If Home Depot can have a huge outside greenhouse and make it all year, so can I.
I think this is where the geothermal cooling could come in handy. By having a large outdoor pond that is deep, I can pretty much insure temps on the bottom are going to be in the 70's around the hottest part of the year. By having coils running through that and then buried 6 feet underground running to the greenhouse (or down a well, and then to the greenhouse), I think it would be much more feasible to cool down, especially if I combine it with a large, efficient swamp cooler.
I'm starting to re-think the "Fish under Veggies" theory. The only thing I'm hung up on is access to the fish. I would need decent access to the tanks to pull fish out or put them in. I don't know how I could do that if I had a long row with a long tank.
Man, I need to get started getting an aquarium together. Any suggestions on a couple of fish just to run some experiments? Should I just start with plain goldfish for now? Has there been a rough formula decided on plants to fish? I want to grow a small tray of strawberries and a tray of blueberries. Probably no more than a dozen plants or so.
I was thinking about just going ahead and getting a 25 gallon tank. My kiddo would like it.
G
Guest
If you give fish lots of light you'll promote algae in high temps, much more than you want. Fish below plants is quite simple you don't need to cover the whole pond just cut the light back. you also want plants... And space efficiency in greenhousing is very important they are an expensive garden to set-up you want to utilise everything you can.
Yes there is a basic formula, it's here somewhere in this thread (my post) you may search save me the job. Berries are fruit and probably require denser stocking rates in an established system.
Start with goldfish and kitchen herbs, can't go wrong (touch wood).
I think the geo-thermal cooling is going to make all the difference for a desert dweller. I too, don't think it will do the whole job, but will make it that much easier by lightening the load.
Yes there is a basic formula, it's here somewhere in this thread (my post) you may search save me the job. Berries are fruit and probably require denser stocking rates in an established system.
Start with goldfish and kitchen herbs, can't go wrong (touch wood).
I think the geo-thermal cooling is going to make all the difference for a desert dweller. I too, don't think it will do the whole job, but will make it that much easier by lightening the load.
BakedBeans
Member
Heh. I'm not quite a desert dweller, it just gets hot here, but it's not that bad. 
Now I remember, yeah, going to back in this thread. I've read all of them (aqua).
I agree on the tray thing. You could really have a lot of fish that way. I think an ebb and flow system would probably be the easiest. You could also build coliseums too though, for the right plants.
Yay, fish store here I come.
Now I remember, yeah, going to back in this thread. I've read all of them (aqua).
I agree on the tray thing. You could really have a lot of fish that way. I think an ebb and flow system would probably be the easiest. You could also build coliseums too though, for the right plants.
Yay, fish store here I come.
G
Guest
Ebb and flow is 20% less effective than continuous feed.
BakedBeans
Member
Can you do a continuous feed setup in trays? I guess it could be a hybrid dwc setup or something. Maybe aero, though that seems it would be complicated to do on a large scale. You could certainly root cuttings easier that way, and less waste (rockwool, coir, etc). I dunno.
RM - aquagrower
Active member
it think that i would go with a swc in 3' wide by 1' deep channels that run the length of the greenhouse. picture a nft on steroids. could have different trays, that hold different age/type of plants, that sit in the channels. as a tray matured it could be harvested, and a new tray goes into it's place.
BakedBeans
Member
That's exactly what I had in mind. Removeable trays that are able to host any stage of growth. It could probably be done with lumber, poly sheeting ( a lot of it ), some generous water proofing on any exposed lumber (top cross pieces to hold trays in place), and then plastic trays with netpots in them. Trays would cut out any light to the roots, unless that's not a concern. I'm not familiar enough yet.
RM - aquagrower
Active member
in my system i use 10 gal tubs for every grow station. that way i can keep an assortment of lids with different plant site configurations. i have 4 plant lids, 2 plant lids, and 1 plant lids.
i would not use wood anywhere it could possably come into contact with water. no telling what may leach out, plus rot is bad!
for the grow trays, i would use something similar to my grow lids. something that could snap into place, holding holding net cups. altho a little light getting to the roots isn't terminal, it's best if avoided.
picture these "grow flumes" with some sort of plastic lip, into which your grow lids lock into, providing both plant stability, and a bit of light proofing to the root zone. rood zone being the inside of the grow flume.
i would not use wood anywhere it could possably come into contact with water. no telling what may leach out, plus rot is bad!
for the grow trays, i would use something similar to my grow lids. something that could snap into place, holding holding net cups. altho a little light getting to the roots isn't terminal, it's best if avoided.
picture these "grow flumes" with some sort of plastic lip, into which your grow lids lock into, providing both plant stability, and a bit of light proofing to the root zone. rood zone being the inside of the grow flume.
Last edited:
BakedBeans
Member
Yep, exactly what I was picturing, except I don't know how to make the plastic.
I figured I could somehow seal up wood (with poly + sealant) and make it work without worrying about rot.
I dunno though.
I figured I could somehow seal up wood (with poly + sealant) and make it work without worrying about rot.
I dunno though.
RM - aquagrower
Active member
maybe something like a water slide?
BakedBeans
Member
Oooooh. Fibreglass. Totally doable and I could actually hire someone, or just suck it up and do it myself (would learn a lot that way, like how to make a speaker box for my car or my boat, I suppose).
You could have the entire plume made out of lumber, but with several layers of thick black poly sheeting. Say, some 6x12's to make up the sides with 3/4" plywood on the bottom. You design a tray that is as wide as the entire unit with little lips at each end, about 1 1/2" wide. You could easily set the fibreglass shape that way with a wooden jig (sealed to not adhere to fibreglass, of course). Make it like:
--|___________________________|--
Gel coat on the glass. Net pots holes in different configurations. You could create a hybrid aeroponic or drip/swc in the plume so that you can grow from clone on up, and do it for any plant (even ones without large root structures, ala the aero/drip).
Totally doable.
You could have the entire plume made out of lumber, but with several layers of thick black poly sheeting. Say, some 6x12's to make up the sides with 3/4" plywood on the bottom. You design a tray that is as wide as the entire unit with little lips at each end, about 1 1/2" wide. You could easily set the fibreglass shape that way with a wooden jig (sealed to not adhere to fibreglass, of course). Make it like:
--|___________________________|--
Gel coat on the glass. Net pots holes in different configurations. You could create a hybrid aeroponic or drip/swc in the plume so that you can grow from clone on up, and do it for any plant (even ones without large root structures, ala the aero/drip).
Totally doable.
BakedBeans
Member
Fish tanks could be under the plume at the far end where the water would fall into the tank (waterfall is good for the O2). Have as many tanks going towards the other end and then house the pump, sucking water out of the tank and transferring to the start of the plume. Would have to figure out an efficient way to spread the water across the entire plume. Maybe by creating a depression in the bottom and letting it fill up and overflow onto the base of the plume.
Would have to be a pretty decent sized pump. Could do other filtering there too, or whatever. This way each plume (100's of feet long, potentially) would be self contained with fish and equipment. This has the advantage of not having horizontal running pipes so you can walk and work the entire length of the bed.
Would have to be a pretty decent sized pump. Could do other filtering there too, or whatever. This way each plume (100's of feet long, potentially) would be self contained with fish and equipment. This has the advantage of not having horizontal running pipes so you can walk and work the entire length of the bed.
BakedBeans
Member
This would work if it was modified for coliseum use too, or perhaps a bucket system for peach trees. Instead of a long tray for the plume, run the appropriately sized pvc tubing with stands for the buckets. Do spray/dwc/whatever for each of them. Drain to the other side to run back to the tank(s).
G
Guest
Drip doesn't work in Aqua so I'd imagine Aero is even harder. FLOW. It can be a light flow, but flow. Anything else will clog with bio-film.
Polythene is horribly unreliable for water storage and in a commercial operation would be folly indeed. Pond liner perhaps?
Europe has made clean burning oil from cress. Worth googling...
3 beds to one pond doesn't require overground pipes at all, just good design. The pump sits above ground drawing water from central pond. One line goes straight up to growbed above. Two lines go underground to beds on either side. All have check valves. Return lines the same. One directly down, two underground. The water surface in the pond itself is 1 foot below ground level. Returns are just on ground level so you get a good waterfall going for aeration.
Water out is at opposite end of pond to water returrned, - gauranteed circulation. Ply can be used to cover underground lines for ease of access for maintenance if ever needed. Good sized plumbing!
The beds themselves I'm still trying to figure out. 5 degree slope to let water flow with gravity. I want a central bed that houses smaller (manageable) trays of plants. This for ease of use when harvesting planting etc. Harvested trays need the medium rinsed of root matter etc.
It's the watering system I'm trying to figure out. How to keep a continuous flow into beds without wetting the actual surface (water in at 1 inch = much less algae and no need to cover medium as the surface is dry)
This coupled with wanting smaller trays presents problems. How to hook them to a water supply below the surface that is easy and fast.
Polythene is horribly unreliable for water storage and in a commercial operation would be folly indeed. Pond liner perhaps?
Europe has made clean burning oil from cress. Worth googling...
3 beds to one pond doesn't require overground pipes at all, just good design. The pump sits above ground drawing water from central pond. One line goes straight up to growbed above. Two lines go underground to beds on either side. All have check valves. Return lines the same. One directly down, two underground. The water surface in the pond itself is 1 foot below ground level. Returns are just on ground level so you get a good waterfall going for aeration.
Water out is at opposite end of pond to water returrned, - gauranteed circulation. Ply can be used to cover underground lines for ease of access for maintenance if ever needed. Good sized plumbing!
The beds themselves I'm still trying to figure out. 5 degree slope to let water flow with gravity. I want a central bed that houses smaller (manageable) trays of plants. This for ease of use when harvesting planting etc. Harvested trays need the medium rinsed of root matter etc.
It's the watering system I'm trying to figure out. How to keep a continuous flow into beds without wetting the actual surface (water in at 1 inch = much less algae and no need to cover medium as the surface is dry)
This coupled with wanting smaller trays presents problems. How to hook them to a water supply below the surface that is easy and fast.
RM - aquagrower
Active member
hey fellas, time for the weekly update. we're at 7 weeks now.
i also got the new veg systems plumbing done
3/4" supply lines that feed thru 1/2" ball valves at each tub. drains are the same type of 2" shower drains that i used in the flower room. i'll slap an undergravel filter over the draind to keep the roots out.
just got to wait 'till the current grow finishes up to hook it to the pump rez.
i also got the new veg systems plumbing done
3/4" supply lines that feed thru 1/2" ball valves at each tub. drains are the same type of 2" shower drains that i used in the flower room. i'll slap an undergravel filter over the draind to keep the roots out.
just got to wait 'till the current grow finishes up to hook it to the pump rez.
BakedBeans
Member
Wow, those are nice resevoirs. Clean job.
Are you going to build a stand or something to hold the tubs up?
Are you going to build a stand or something to hold the tubs up?
RM - aquagrower
Active member
i've already built a "table" to hold it the at the same level as the rest of the system. i'll just cut a slot for the drain lines to go thru and they'll run under the table (out of sight) to the pump rez.
when i built my external bio filter, i installed 2 additional 3/4" outlets. i'll hook a hose to one of them and run it to the valve in the center of the feed manifold.
like THS said, you must maintain continuse flow thru the system.
when i built my external bio filter, i installed 2 additional 3/4" outlets. i'll hook a hose to one of them and run it to the valve in the center of the feed manifold.
like THS said, you must maintain continuse flow thru the system.
BakedBeans
Member
So is your setup a complete DWC or are you going to have top feeding as well? Just wondering since this was a veg setup with, I'm assuming, younger plants which wouldn't have the proper root structure. Or are you relying on splashing water to moisten your medium? Just trying to see how that would work because I want to do it too.
