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Old 09-12-2015, 09:15 AM #101
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Good questions, especially the second "why aren't we publishing mineral content of the produce, etc... to confirm that the minerals ( including trace minerals) are actually getting to the plants and not just lying in the soil in an unavailable form?"

The last worthwhile study of soil mineral content vs mineral content of crops grown, that I know of, was "Variation in Mineral Composition of Vegetables" by Bear, Toth, and Prince. The year was 1948. [this study can be found online, and is reproduced, along with comments, starting on p140 of The Ideal Soil 2014] I do not know of a single other published study comparing a broad range of soil minerals with mineral content of crops grown. is that a little strange, or what? With all of the awareness, interest, and concern about nutrition over the past 77 years since 1948, with all of the articles and studies bemoaning the loss of mineral nutrients in food and mineral depletion in the soil, not one single agronomist or nutritionist or researcher has bothered to test the soil, then test the crops grown in that soil for minerals and mineral-associated nutrients? What's with that?

A few years back I made an attempt; I put together a volunteer group who agreed to have their soils tested and send the reports to me. I would write a soil Rx, they would amend the soil to my recommendations, grow a crop, and then have the crop analyzed for minerals. Out of fifty or sixty free soil Rx's I wrote, perhaps eight people followed through. Rather disappointing, but the little data gathered was quite interesting. For example, Detroit Dark Red beets grown in mineral-amended soil measured, in comparison to USDA averages, an increase of

Protein: +193%
Calcium: +931%
Phosphorus: +77%
Magnesium: +122%
Zinc: +151%
Copper: +140%

Those interested can read more at nutrientdenseproject.com
^ thumbs up m astera for being the "one and only" to reply on this question.

here's the reason why we are not testing for soil fertility:

'they' are poisoning our water, our air and our food.

"they' are bankrupting every sovereign nation with usury (interest) on debt based money called fiat currency.

'they' are destabilizing every place in the world; south America, middle east, Europe big time atm.

there is a group of individuals that comprise less than 1/10th of 1% of the global population that own and control most of the earth's resources, most of the national military, legal, academic, political, and news medias.

big pharma wants us sick so they can make more money treating us for our symptoms. healthy food, air and water are essential to good nutrition. good nutrition is essential to plant and animal health. every organic farmer reading this thread knows the #1 defense for plants against disease is proper nutrition yet no one is focusing on the fact that unless the plant nutrients are available the plant can't access them for nutritional reasons.

there is absolutely no value to discussing plant nutrients if we do not focus on availability of these nutrients.

the only way to confirm availability of the organic soil mineral supplements is to run mineral content analysis of the produce ( bud in this thread).
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Old 09-12-2015, 05:45 PM #102
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Being I have claimed myself Michael #1 fan.
Here is Michaels site "soil minerals"

https://www.soilminerals.com/Minerals...ertilizers.htm

They carry most of every kind of mineral and lots of organic matter stuff.
Myself I think his prices are more then reasonable.
The fact you can get MOST of everything at good prices at one place works big for me.
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Old 09-12-2015, 05:59 PM #103
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^ cool site. nice job Michael.
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Old 09-12-2015, 07:05 PM #104
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working past my previous faux pas on calcium (brain fart), this was what i was suggesting...that without (-) sites to hold cations availability decreases, roots are unable to exchange exudates for nutrients, limiting potential.
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Old 09-12-2015, 09:03 PM #105
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Originally Posted by trichrider View Post
working past my previous faux pas on calcium (brain fart), this was what i was suggesting...that without (-) sites to hold cations availability decreases, roots are unable to exchange exudates for nutrients, limiting potential.
In the soil minerals handbook they refer to negative sites to holding cations.
Its liken to how big of a bucket is your mix's CEC.
The more negative sites the bigger the bucket.
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Old 09-13-2015, 01:08 AM #106
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So this talk of cec leads me to another question.

I know out container "soil' weighs less the garden soil so I understand the decreasing of the recommendation s given by labs but with our high cec don't we have a bigger wearhouse to store nutrients.

Or does the soil test already take that into account?
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Old 09-13-2015, 01:57 PM #107
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This is the simplest explanation of the CEC.
From the soil minerals hand book.
https://www.soilminerals.com/Cation_E...Simplified.htm

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Old 09-13-2015, 08:00 PM #108
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Originally Posted by Ratzilla View Post
This is the simplest explanation of the CEC.
From the soil minerals hand book.
https://www.soilminerals.com/Cation_E...Simplified.htm

Ratz
The carbonic acids described are organic acids, of which there are many-many types, which are excreted/created by bacteria, archaea, fungi and plants.

(One might say hypothetically) The real beauty of this system is that the plant creates certain carbon molecules which feed specific bacterial/archaeal species which excrete (exudate) specific organic acids which release (trade for) specific and required (by the plant) nutrients.

The further genius and economics to this system is that specific species of flagellates and/or naked amoebae multiply in response to the bacterial/archaeal population to feed on them but as noted by Michael (et moi) in another thread, they utilize only a small portion of the specific nutrient while excreting the larger percentage as bio-available [ionic] to the roots. (e.g. avg, 30% - 70% respectively).
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Old 09-13-2015, 08:29 PM #109
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i'm still wanting microbeman and/or Michael to comment on the moringa leaf as an organic supplement. it looks to my naive, unskooled eye to be really special as an additional organic supplement:

https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?threadid=311411

here's a good scientific study with lots of data for a quick look:

Quote:

THE INTERNATIONAL JOURNAL OF
SCIENCE & TECHNOLEDGE
Contributions of Moringa (
Moringa Oleifera)

Tree Foliage for Enrichment of Soil Nutrient Status
https://theijst.com/april2014/61.ST1404-133.pdf
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Old 09-13-2015, 08:43 PM #110
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i would assume they are as new to moringa as you and i...but looks to have potential as an amendment.
have you sourced moringa yet?
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