30 Tons and a Tunnel

_Dude · Nov 10, 2010

Mexico is going to Shit. The most dangerous place in the world is spiraling out of what little control is left. The War On Drugs has turned Mexico into a Narco State run by the Cartels. When will this bubble burst???

It's easy to blame the WoD for Mexican violence, but it's not that simple. These guys are the worst kind of violent murderous thugs and no one's putting the machetes in their hands and forcing them to chop peoples heads off.

Consider what would happen if America stopped all pressure on Mexico to fight the cartels. Would that stop them from making enough money off the drug trade to challenge the Mexican government for supremacy, as they are now? So then lets pretend that the Mexican government decided to legalize the entire drug trade - the cartels would become the most powerful force in Mexico, more powerful than the government. Does anyone think they'd just roll over and let big pharma take over their business? Nope. Instead, they'd take over governing Mexico themselves.

The bottom line is that Americans don't want to legalize drugs in their country, any more than they want to invade a Mexico governed by drug cartels.

Close the border. Legalize drugs. Use CIA and NSA along with DEA to systematically destroy the cartels like we did with Escobar. End.

But Americans don't want to legalize drugs. And there will always be some substance that people want, but is off limits. Legalize them all today, pharmacists just cook up the next, worse drug.

I don't like the idea of kids being raised in a society that lets people buy heroin and crank over the counter.

Because the same people who want to legalize it will be screaming for me to pay for welfare for the junkies, for another thing.

Supposedly, Mexico's second highest source of income, after oil exports, is from illegal aliens here in the the US transferring funds back to Mexico.

No, that's Mexico's second biggest source of foreign income. But it's not really fair to pick on you for accuracy, when there's so much zany conspiracy theory bullshit being thrown around in this thread.

You make some good arguments about illegal immigration, but I say close down legal immigration as well. WHY are we importing people when our unemployment is sky high?

greentrich · Nov 10, 2010

we the people, need to say enough is enough, rally up, and head to washington. im afraid in this day and age and seeing stuff like this happen in mexico and NOTHING being done about it, means the very worst, the corporate take-over of america is complete.

THAT'S what I'm talking about!

I often wonder what would happen if every single grower, much less every person that enjoys cannabis to any degree, stood up and said enough is enough. The tables would turn and there wouldn't be a damn thing anyone could do about it. THEY know this, THEY are counting on our complacent compliance. Know what? It's working. We are all taking it up the ass without an ounce of lube or sphincter clenching.

Nothing will ever change until everyone gets involved and moves forward, without ever looking back.

I firmly believe that even if everyone from this particular site stood up and marched forward, a huge impact would be made. But the "nothing being done" about this latest Mexico fiasco is really making me nauseous.

I think the biggest misconception is the dividing line. This happened in Mexico right?? Well it happened, and is happening, to human beings. This isn't a territorial, national, international, political, financial issue. To me, this is a humanity issue. These are humans making these prohibition policies, and humans are suffering from these policies.

My belief is that these, and other issues, will only be solved by erasing the dividing line and coming together as people...not as citizens of their particular territory.

_Dude · Nov 10, 2010

The real problem is Mexico can't govern itself in a stable fashion. Let's use a best-case scenario. The Mexican government legalizes drugs. The cartels settle down and start acting like nice, civilized, fat capitalists. What happens next? You guessed it. The next crop of violent, murderous thugs overthrows the fat, weak, civilized capitalist cartels with violence and intimidation, and decides they won't let the same thing happen to them.

Or maybe the government takes over the drug trade? Sure, nice rosy scenario right? Nope. Because some group of violent thugs will overthrow THEM to get at all those drug profits, and they're now running Mexico.

Seems Mexico's real problem is Mexicans.

_Dude · Nov 10, 2010

Greentrich, that's a noble sentiment, but the bottom line of Americans making everyone's problems their problems is poverty. Plain and simple.

greentrich · Nov 10, 2010

Too true Dude, on all counts.

I'm noticing a pattern in the post before last (#23), violence. Seems violence not only rhymes with compliance, but goes hand in hand with it.

Where does that leave us? Nowhere. We will always be stuck where we are as humans, because even if civilized, rational people are in control, they will be overthrown by non civilized violent people.

There is nothing humane about humans anymore, if there ever was.

_Dude · Nov 11, 2010

My first wife was 'tarded...she's a pilot now

Lotsa tards go on to lead kick-ass lives.

Chief Rbud · Nov 11, 2010

_Dude said:
It's easy to blame the WoD for Mexican violence, but it's not that simple. These guys are the worst kind of violent murderous thugs and no one's putting the machetes in their hands and forcing them to chop peoples heads off.

Consider what would happen if America stopped all pressure on Mexico to fight the cartels. Would that stop them from making enough money off the drug trade to challenge the Mexican government for supremacy, as they are now? So then lets pretend that the Mexican government decided to legalize the entire drug trade - the cartels would become the most powerful force in Mexico, more powerful than the government. Does anyone think they'd just roll over and let big pharma take over their business? Nope. Instead, they'd take over governing Mexico themselves.

The bottom line is that Americans don't want to legalize drugs in their country, any more than they want to invade a Mexico governed by drug cartels.

But Americans don't want to legalize drugs. And there will always be some substance that people want, but is off limits. Legalize them all today, pharmacists just cook up the next, worse drug.

I don't like the idea of kids being raised in a society that lets people buy heroin and crank over the counter.

Because the same people who want to legalize it will be screaming for me to pay for welfare for the junkies, for another thing.

No, that's Mexico's second biggest source of foreign income. But it's not really fair to pick on you for accuracy, when there's so much zany conspiracy theory bullshit being thrown around in this thread.

You make some good arguments about illegal immigration, but I say close down legal immigration as well. WHY are we importing people when our unemployment is sky high?

im just curious, what exactly are you referring to as zany conspiracy theory bullshit, i havent seen a thing in this thread that isn't factual and can't be verified if you feel like doing some research. what i stated isn't a conspiracy theory but was reported by a government insider who used to be one of the regulators of the stock exchanges. if you think this is a conspiracy theory you are sadly mistaken. it is factual. take your head out the sand and wake the hell up. maybe we dont know exactly how they are doing it, but the fact is they are.

Iraganji · Nov 11, 2010

There is nothing humane about humans anymore, if there ever was.

Quite the definition of oxymoron isn't it, I agree.

Not too hard for our captors to divide and conquer us when we are genetically predisposed to fight amongst ourselves for the scraps. They have us fighting each other, but never them.

Lots of pawns in this game.

Chief Rbud · Nov 11, 2010

Iraganji said:
Quite the definition of oxymoron isn't it, I agree.

Not too hard for our captors to divide and conquer us when we are genetically predisposed to fight amongst ourselves for the scraps. They have us fighting each other, but never them.

Lots of pawns in this game.

YEPP!!!

binaryfission · Nov 11, 2010

_Dude said:
These guys are the worst kind of violent murderous thugs and no one's putting the machetes in their hands and forcing them to chop peoples heads off.

These guys...? getting awfully close to bigotry...

Consider what would happen if America stopped all pressure on Mexico to fight the cartels. Would that stop them from making enough money off the drug trade to challenge the Mexican government for supremacy, as they are now? So then lets pretend that the Mexican government decided to legalize the entire drug trade - the cartels would become the most powerful force in Mexico, more powerful than the government. Does anyone think they'd just roll over and let big pharma take over their business? Nope. Instead, they'd take over governing Mexico themselves.

You are delusional if you think that the cartels aren't already in charge. Do the slightest bit of research and you can prove this yourself. No, offense but you seem to be talking out of your ass. Its a 60 billion dollar drug economy, financed with our money and fought with our guns and bullets.

Lets get real, we might not be able to stop ALL the drugs but we can stop the guns. Who lets all those bullets and AR-15 go south? We do.

Did you know that within 25 miles of the border in texas, there is a gun store for every mile of border. Hundreds off places to buy weapons just miles from the border.

More than 6,700 licensed gun dealers have set up shop within a short drive of the 2,000-mile border, from the Gulf Coast of Texas to San Diego -- which amounts to more than three dealers for every mile of border territory. Law enforcement has come to call the region an "iron river of guns."

We let all this happen. We know it. We know the consequences and we let it happen.

But Americans don't want to legalize drugs. And there will always be some substance that people want, but is off limits. Legalize them all today, pharmacists just cook up the next, worse drug.

I'm not so sure. They have gotten so desperate as to be smoking plant fertilizer. Legalize drugs and use typically goes down. Repression doesn't work and it never has with drugs. (Politics of Heroin. Atleast five examples of massive government repression efforts and all that happened was more land and more people became dedicated to the heroin trade. Same with cocaine in Columbia. Every time they spray they just increase the land mass occupied by the growers.

They severely stemmed the precursors for Meth, making it too expensive for the average person. This works becasue you can't grow it. Same for MDMA. They all but eliminated that economically.

But you can't stop the sun. People will grow weed, coca, opium. They are natural and part of people's cultures. California, Andes mountains, Golden Triangle Hill tribes.

I don't like the idea of kids being raised in a society that lets people buy heroin and crank over the counter.

Because the same people who want to legalize it will be screaming for me to pay for welfare for the junkies, for another thing.

You could always move? :tiphat:

No, that's Mexico's second biggest source of foreign income. But it's not really fair to pick on you for accuracy, when there's so much zany conspiracy theory bullshit being thrown around in this thread.

Your post seems the farthest out of touch with reality. I won't call it "zany" but...

You make some good arguments about illegal immigration, but I say close down legal immigration as well. WHY are we importing people when our unemployment is sky high?

Statue of Liberty much? Again why can't you move? You don't seem to understand the founding of America or what it stands for.

BrnCow · Nov 11, 2010

Crook Politicians - Not The Government

Crook Politicians - Not The Government

The thing that keeps these big loads flowing into the US is the crooks, crook politicians, and other assorted rich people financing ship loads of drugs. Without the money, nothing would move. And, IMHO, I think we have lawmakers being secret law breakers profiteering off of these transactions. I have even heard of customs officers overlooking trainloads concealed in rail tanker cars and trucks driving through the border with no inspections. If you think about it, every small town in America has drugs for sale every day. Even the rural towns.And the cities are a given. The sheer mass quantities required to supply such a venture would require planes, trains, trucks, warehousing, and a nationwide distribution network like Wal Mart. It appears that the politicians have subverted the government to supply this dope network. I say vote them all out. The average American citizen has no idea what these crooked politicians are doing to others under the guise of the government. We do not knowingly support this type of subterfuge and if it became well known with proof all hell would break lose...

_Dude · Nov 11, 2010

binaryfission said:
These guys...? getting awfully close to bigotry...

How would you put it?

You're getting awfully close to douchery.

You are delusional if you think that the cartels aren't already in charge.

Oh, so what are we even talking about if the Mexican military's just another cartel?

What's your solution to what's going on in Mahico?

Do the slightest bit of research and you can prove this yourself. No, offense but you seem to be talking out of your ass. Its a 60 billion dollar drug economy, financed with our money and fought with our guns and bullets.

What's with this "our" shit? You're getting dangerously close to bigotry.

Like they won't buy kalashnikovs if they can't get "our" AR-15s, lol.

Mexican fingers on those triggers, bub. Mexican hands on those machetes.

Lets get real, we might not be able to stop ALL the drugs but we can stop the guns. Who lets all those bullets and AR-15 go south? We do.

Again, what's with the "we" shit, Mr. Bigot?

Did you know that within 25 miles of the border in texas, there is a gun store for every mile of border.

What's your solution? Restrict our constitutional rights because Mexicans can't govern themselves?

We let all this happen. We know it. We know the consequences and we let it happen.

"We," "we" "we," leave me out of this. Speak for yourself. YOU let this happen. And you call me a bigot, heh.

And what does that mean, anyway? What does "we let it happen" mean? Somebody murders someone a hundred miles away and "I let it happen," too.

Legalize drugs and use typically goes down.

That makes no sense at all.

Repression doesn't work and it never has with drugs.

When has legalizing drugs worked? If you're going empirical, I think you're going to have to present an example for your side of the case.

You could always move?

So could you. Try and find your legal narcotics paradise elsewhere? :tiphat:

Not sure why I should move when you're the one dissatisfied with current policy, lol.

Statue of Liberty much? Again why can't you move? You don't seem to understand the founding of America or what it stands for.

Lol. My liberal bigot detector's going off.

The statue of liberty is a statue. What's it got to do with the price of tea in China? The founding of America has nothing to do with importing people into a recession and 25% unemployment.

The right to bear arms IS pretty fundamental to what America stands for. And I'm not the one implying it should be infringed.

David762 · Nov 12, 2010

Noriega was the CIA's "Man in Panama"

Noriega was the CIA's "Man in Panama"

right up to the point that he nationalized Panama's banks, seizing not only the drug cartels' funds, but also the CIA's covert drug trafficking profits.

And yep, George HW Bush had been involved with the CIA long before he became the head of the CIA, all the way back to before the Cuban Revolution, Bay of Pigs Invasion and JFK assassination. George Sr. was a useful CIA asset since he was deeply involved in the oil business in Central and South America from the 1950's.

binaryfission said:
Great Reporting and nice link VTA.

I hope we can see more of this type of reporting, Shine some light on whats happening down there.

FYI, Bush Sr. took Noriega's money. Look it up.
Jeb did the same thing in Florida, during the early "Cocaine Cowboys Era."

Think big money. Drugs keep the populace dumb AND large amounts of cash just a SWAT team way. Its like what the top .05% use as an atm. Plus all the prison complex kickbacks.

oh shit, short on cash? lets rob Noriega.

Chief Rbud · Nov 12, 2010

David762 said:
right up to the point that he nationalized Panama's banks, seizing not only the drug cartels' funds, but also the CIA's covert drug trafficking profits.

And yep, George HW Bush had been involved with the CIA long before he became the head of the CIA, all the way back to before the Cuban Revolution, Bay of Pigs Invasion and JFK assassination. George Sr. was a useful CIA asset since he was deeply involved in the oil business in Central and South America from the 1950's.

you are oh so correct, since the day he got out of the military he has been a cia asset. mostly owning offshore front companies and such, we will never know what else he did. many are starting to say he was in dallas the day kennedy was shot, he was in charge of the operation and had to see with his own eyes that it was done.

GL_Guerilla · Nov 12, 2010

since it's america's insatiable thirst for drugs, and americas bad drug policies that have created this narco-terrorist state in mexico, it is america's job to step in and end it, for once, we should be intervening, and not just "attempting" to stop drugs at our border.
The way i see it, legalizing cannabis would cut off alot of money coming into the cartels, which weakens them, and thus, the violence would go down, but that still doesnt solve the problem, the CIA needs to send in special ops teams, and take down these cartels, one by one. and they could too....they have the power to do what they want, which is exactly why i KNOW the CIA has their big greedy hands in the drug trade, they have no moral restraints, they dont care who lives and who dies, as long is its not them...
amassing power and wealth is all that drives the corporate-owned government, and the terribly backwards agencys that operate without constraints under its power.
again, the only answer in this age, is to fight our government, and take back whats ours...

I don't like the idea of kids being raised in a society that lets people buy heroin and crank over the counter.

Because the same people who want to legalize it will be screaming for me to pay for welfare for the junkies, for another thing.

if our government cared, it WOULD be all legal, and i can tell you, the system would be set up in such a way that if you WERE a person using heroin, or any socially damaging drug, that you WOULD NOT receive benfits if you were receiving hard drugs legally...
all legalizing drugs would do, IMO, is turn incarceration into treatment....
prescription medications are legal, and abused all the time, no problem there...
people on serious drugs need help, not to be thrown in a cage and taxpayers made to foot the bill....thats bullshit.

if ALL drugs were made legal tomorrow, i would not try any of them....i could already get them if i wanted, but i dont feel like ruining my life.....if our government educated the populace on the REAL danger of drugs, people would smoke weed, and thats it, because they would know that its the only drug that can be used and abused your entire life without any real damages....

greentrich · Nov 12, 2010

again, the only answer in this age, is to fight our government, and take back whats ours...

That was really the point I was trying to make. So how do we do this??? Set a date a year from now to march the the white house lawn?? Maybe a new thread should start to gain followers to take an active stance on taking back what should have never been taken away. I know this thread is really intended for reporting the news, so maybe this idea needs it's own thread. But I do believe it will have to be TAKEN back....not given, not voted in, no fucking committee on the matter....taken.

Block2TheFuture · Nov 13, 2010

zenoonez said:
Close the border. Legalize drugs. Use CIA and NSA along with DEA to systematically destroy the cartels like we did with Escobar. End.

That isn't going to happen as long as the CIA and other "aphabet agencies" we are not aware of, are making billions of dollars a year on cocaine and heroin. It is a fact that CIA "rendition planes" are used to smuggle tons of drugs worldwide. There was this well known instance of a CIA owned plane crashing in south america with dozens of official government suitcases that were packed with cocaine. 3.2 tons of it in fact.

http://djd.newsvine.com/_news/2007/...rashes-in-yucatan-carrying-32-tons-of-cocaine

Fact is, the war on drugs is really the war to maintain market share of world drug sales. American and British governments raise most of the "black budget" money through cocaine and heroin. Everything makes sense about the current state of drugs in the world when you look at it through this point of view.

Legalizing will not happen because there is too much money being made. I cannot imagine how fundamentally things would have to change, before it could happen.

_Dude · Nov 13, 2010

Nope, no zany conspiracy theories here...

Hydrosun · Nov 13, 2010

zenoonez said:
Close the border. Legalize drugs. Use CIA and NSA along with DEA to systematically destroy the cartels like we did with Escobar. End.

Don't you mean Legalize drugs and FIRE every employee of the DEA and cut about 50% of all other government jobs?

Why would we ever need to destroy foreign producers of now legal substances?

:joint:

growshopfrank · Nov 13, 2010

greentrich said:
Other than little maggots making millions off prohibition, this is the other problem:

Other than the fact that this is a complete lie (nothing will keep cannabis "off our streets and out of our neighborhoods").

This was stated openly and with great pride. So unfortunately this is what the general public thinks. Now it's just reinforced to most that cannabis is a VERY dangerous drug, and to me, is going to make legalization even harder. Compound the fact of Leonhart's position and status, I believe his statement will be more heard than any other person that goes into mass media trying to explain the benefits of legalization.

I hope to Horace I'm wrong.

I'm not arguing that the dea ain't full of shit its the general public that is buying and smoking bud so I would have to believe that a lot of folks don't buy the shit that the dea has to say ether thank god

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