1st 2 pulls from passive MkIII purging.. WTF am I doing?

toohighmf · Oct 21, 2016

Yooooooo

Just got everything to run passive for now to get my feet wet. I have a 450g spool and 6x12 collection pot. No dewax.

I aquired some older dry super blue cookie trim, and some older frozen Skywalker OG live stuff
1st batch of the dry netted me a nice yield of some very dark thick bubbly stuff that didn't get introduced to heat for 12 hours. Since then, it has been burped a few times at a constant 90f, but at full vac for the last 3 days, And has stayed 1/4'' thick and full of micro bubbles.

When it came out of the platter, it was already very thick and "dry" like cotton candy or caramel, and started turning very light color with every whip around the platter. After sitting under full vac for 12 hours (because I left the vac pump and heat pad at the lab) it got darker and stayed a muffin the whole time til I could get back to the shop to drop it and raise periodically. I think I pulled too much tane in recovery, as I waited until it was almost completely not bubbling anymore.

The next batch, was the live resin run, and it was super hot outside, and my bro was lagging hard. We melted through most of our dry ice way too fast. I feel like we didn't run cold enough at all, but recovered with a lil more tane left in the pot, as it bubbled when I opened it, but still couldn't get it to "pour" and had to scrape. I got less than half of what I did the previous run.

Based on what you see and read.
Am I correct to say that I recovered too much tane, and that the live resin batch yielded less because of the temps lot being subzero?
Is it my purging technique of accidentally leaving at full vac without heat overnight what caused the microbubbling and darkness?

Someone please help me make good shatter!!

toohighmf · Oct 21, 2016

better shot

better shot

Here's a better pic of my 2nd pull with a little more butane left in it prior to opening the platter.

Gray Wolf · Oct 21, 2016

toohighmf said:
Yooooooo

Just got everything to run passive for now to get my feet wet. I have a 450g spool and 6x12 collection pot. No dewax.

I aquired some older dry super blue cookie trim, and some older frozen Skywalker OG live stuff
1st batch of the dry netted me a nice yield of some very dark thick bubbly stuff that didn't get introduced to heat for 12 hours. Since then, it has been burped a few times at a constant 90f, but at full vac for the last 3 days, And has stayed 1/4'' thick and full of micro bubbles.

When it came out of the platter, it was already very thick and "dry" like cotton candy or caramel, and started turning very light color with every whip around the platter. After sitting under full vac for 12 hours (because I left the vac pump and heat pad at the lab) it got darker and stayed a muffin the whole time til I could get back to the shop to drop it and raise periodically. I think I pulled too much tane in recovery, as I waited until it was almost completely not bubbling anymore.

The next batch, was the live resin run, and it was super hot outside, and my bro was lagging hard. We melted through most of our dry ice way too fast. I feel like we didn't run cold enough at all, but recovered with a lil more tane left in the pot, as it bubbled when I opened it, but still couldn't get it to "pour" and had to scrape. I got less than half of what I did the previous run.

Based on what you see and read.
Am I correct to say that I recovered too much tane, and that the live resin batch yielded less because of the temps lot being subzero?
Is it my purging technique of accidentally leaving at full vac without heat overnight what caused the microbubbling and darkness?

Someone please help me make good shatter!!

When/if you switch to active recovery, use a smaller column, or get a bigger lower tank to protect your pump.

Yield per run from fresh cut and frozen material is always lower than cured material because of the added weight and bulk of the water, with the rosin content about the same.

killa12345 · Oct 21, 2016

My slabs look like that sometimes when i leave the temps too low in the oven. I work in temperature outside which rarely get under 90F. Im always working in the heat. I have a tent set up in my backyard which significantly reduces the temps under it. I cant stress to people enough when running passive....dont cheap out on the dry ice. Find coolers which snug spools tightly.. and use coolers...it keeps your dry ice cold longer.

I just higher the temps in the oven till they get flat and give me the appearance im looking for.

pic one is 24hrs in the oven at 100F...pic 2 is 24hrs more in the oven at 105F...think that finished at 108F in my oven with another 8 hours....not a bubble or nucleation.

Josh@Summit · Oct 21, 2016

How long is the butane soaking the plant material? The longer you let it soak, the more chlorophyll is extracted with the oils making it dark. 5-7 minutes has worked well for me in terms of yield.

montroller · Oct 21, 2016

Like killa said I think you should gradually raise temps in the oven until you find the lowest temp where the muffin actually collapses... Then flip often, like every time the muffin drops and bubbles aren't easily popping. Every time you flip it will stabilize more and you might find a situation where you have to raise temps again to get it fully bubble free. Sometimes if I know the purging is done and I am just trying to get the last bubbles out I will just flip a couple times with only heat and no vac, just makes everything pretty.

You can see the small indents in the texture in this pic... Those used to be tiny bubbles that would have taken hours to pull out in vac but finished in 30 minutes in the oven with no vac and 1 flip.

toohighmf · Oct 21, 2016

It's a pretty quick flood. Pretty much as long as it takes the tane to make its way to the pot. No real soak time except the 10 minutes it takes to get through all the material and down.

Josh@Summit said:
How long is the butane soaking the plant material? The longer you let it soak, the more chlorophyll is extracted with the oils making it dark. 5-7 minutes has worked well for me in terms of yield.

toohighmf · Oct 21, 2016

Yesterday I upped the temps to 98 under vac and things flattened more and definitely evapped most the bubbles. I worried about boiling out terpenes so I lowered it to 94 under vacAfter reading the above statements, I'm up to 100 and killed vac again. Starting to flatten out. Thanks to all who contributed. I'm listening!

Gray Wolf · Oct 22, 2016

toohighmf said:
It's a pretty quick flood. Pretty much as long as it takes the tane to make its way to the pot. No real soak time except the 10 minutes it takes to get through all the material and down.

I usually flood from the bottom and time how long it takes to spill out the top and through the sight glass (one column volume). On a 4" X 36" column, that is typically about 1:15 to 1:30 minutes/sec on a WolfWurx Terpenator, at the density I pack.

I typically continue to flood at that same rate, for that same amount of time (2:30 to 3.0 total), or until I note the "timing of now" as the color falls off in the sight glass.

Likewise, if the color hasn't begun to fall off at the double volume bottom flood, I continue to flood from the bottom until it does, or I start to be concerned about space in the lower tank for another rinse volume from the top. I monitor lower tank level through the lid sight glass and stay at least 4" away from my pump intake.

I then switch to flooding from the top for the same amount of time (1:15 to 1:30 m/s), for a total flood time of 3:45 to 4:30 min/sec total.

Not at any time am I soaking the material, though it is all fully submerged after the first volume and remains so until the lower dump valve is opened.

It is also moving, which is key to keeping boundary layers swept clean with fresh solvent, so a to maximize desolution rates,

toohighmf · Oct 24, 2016

Maybe I'm packing my 2"x24" column too tight. It's taking about 7-10 minutes to pass down to the pot.

killa12345 · Oct 25, 2016

toohighmf said:
Maybe I'm packing my 2"x24" column too tight. It's taking about 7-10 minutes to pass down to the pot.

Then im packing way to tight cause it seems like my extraction can take up to 30 mins to run 7lbs of nbutane passive. im usually trying to get 500-600g in my 3x24 tube. Im sure my butane is like sludge though as my valves can freeze over....and almost every run.....I like to run just on the brink of freezing. Start way below and try to finish off right at 32F maybe a tad higher to pressurize my tank and push the last bit of butane threw.

I seem to get better yields and always a better product going with a tight pack over a not so tight pack...I find when you dont get a good even pack....it butane will find the easiest path threw leaving behind tricomes in the process. I get anywhere from 8-16% on trim and 10-27% on nug runs.

Im fine with that with straight pass threw passive extraction...no soak...just dry ice/hot water...no ethanol

toohighmf · Oct 26, 2016

Killa thank you for your insight. I heated shit up a little bit and got the darker stuff to smooth out & shatter up. The live resin I kept flipping under the same heat at 105, and got some brown sugar budder that smells & tastes incredible!

As far as the extraction goes, how cold are you getting your tane & collection pot prior to extraction? Obviously the speed of cold material and tane will slow. I'm stuffing 450g in a 2x24" column pretty tight, and it filled the tube to the top.

toohighmf · Oct 28, 2016

I just did the weigh in, and I'm only pulling about 5%. I think I'm sucking a bunch in my recovery tank. I'm having a difficult time deciphering through the sight glass of where/when to stop recovery. Any suggestions?

montroller · Oct 28, 2016

Don't figure out when to stop with the sight glass... figure out how much can go In your collection tank and only fill it half way using a scale to weigh the butane. You can safely go as high as 80% but you're risk getting oil sucked into the lines and god forbid the pump or tank if your passive. Also 5% is in the ballpark for leafy trim

toohighmf · Oct 28, 2016

Thank you Montroller. I've been instructed to run 4.9lbs of tane through my 2x24 column and 6x12 col. Pot. I see a lot of people able to actually pour off from their cls, where I'm actually having to scrape it all out. I assume this due to me recovering most my butane. Is my assumption correct? What is the benefit to stopping recovery with more solvent, aside from the pour off being easier?

toohighmf · Oct 31, 2016

montroller · Oct 31, 2016

4.9 lbs puts you at ~66% full in your chamber... It should be fine but I wouldn't go much higher than that.

As far as the scraping thing I have found it to be sort of strain/grower specific if I can get a good pour or not. Some people only recover to 0 PSI to ensure a good pour but I feel like that is a bad practice and should be avoided. You'll notice some strains will start to nucleate if you scrape that's why people swear by the pour tech. I wouldn't worry about trying to pour unless you are seeing nucleation and have eliminated other possibilities of that.

kwikness · Oct 31, 2016

toohighmf said:
The next batch, was the live resin run, and it was super hot outside, and my bro was lagging hard. We melted through most of our dry ice way too fast. I feel like we didn't run cold enough at all, but recovered with a lil more tane left in the pot, as it bubbled when I opened it, but still couldn't get it to "pour" and had to scrape. I got less than half of what I did the previous run.

As GW said, this is typical of running fresher material. Water in your material will make the solvent's job much more difficult.

toohighmf · Oct 31, 2016

montroller said:
4.9 lbs puts you at ~66% full in your chamber... It should be fine but I wouldn't go much higher than that.

As far as the scraping thing I have found it to be sort of strain/grower specific if I can get a good pour or not. Some people only recover to 0 PSI to ensure a good pour but I feel like that is a bad practice and should be avoided. You'll notice some strains will start to nucleate if you scrape that's why people swear by the pour tech. I wouldn't worry about trying to pour unless you are seeing nucleation and have eliminated other possibilities of that.

I should be returning to negative pressure correct? Like -5 to -15hg, correct?

montroller · Nov 1, 2016

-5 to -10 is where I like to keep it... usually closer to -5 but honestly I'm curious to see what others have decided on.

1st 2 pulls from passive MkIII purging.. WTF am I doing?

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