What's new
  • Please note members who been with us for more than 10 years have been upgraded to "Veteran" status and will receive exclusive benefits. If you wish to find out more about this or support IcMag and get same benefits, check this thread here.
  • Important notice: ICMag's T.O.U. has been updated. Please review it here. For your convenience, it is also available in the main forum menu, under 'Quick Links"!

Soil mix

VerdantGreen

Genetics Facilitator
Boutique Breeder
Mentor
ICMag Donor
Veteran
i agree jay, the bark based mix that drains less well is actually soil-less and 60% bark and molar clay the water puddles on the surface for like 10 seconds before it drains away whereas the soil mix (20% topsoil, 20% compost, 30% peat 30% perlite) drains much faster.

i agree that you need a strong drainage component in pots and that is one thing that perlite is good for, as well as helping to dilute what otherwise would be a soil too rich for weed imo.

VG
 

jaykush

dirty black hands
ICMag Donor
Veteran
im personally a fan of lavarock and other mineral aeration amendments over perlite. heavier to move, but better in the long run when using a mix with real soil imo.

also the bark, bark aint the best material to be using. aged ramial wood chips(small branches chipped up) are far better, specially if they have the leaves on them still. bark will make any mix sloppy, soggy and poor draining imo. its would have to be some well aged shit for me to use it. and only in small amounts if any.

i would just up the aggregate materials in your experimental mix and try again. so where it drains very well and is extra light in texture. your plants and the soil biology should be much happier.
 

h.h.

Active member
Veteran
Good point on the fines. I've been assuming that they are adding silica as well as cal/mag, so I haven't really bothered with them. I didn't feel it was a problem. As I consume more bags, it very well could be.
My last bag all went in the worm bin anyway. The worms don't seem to mind, and the ants and cockroaches don't like it.
The DE is more durable than the perlite. I'm not happy when reusing soil with it a second or third time. I was looking for a replacement when Mad posted a thread on the DE.
My failure, this summer, was leaving pots out to cook in the sun. The ones with DE mixed in fared slightly better than the ones with perlite. They lived, while the others shriveled.
A good aggregate will add space by allowing an otherwise denser mix. They promote root division and give stability to the soil. They allow deeper pots with a lower PWT, taking up less real estate. They work to bring friendly bacteria deeper into the soil.
Don't put it off as a filler, just find the best one you can. The best mix anyway. Even a little perilite working it's way to the top isn't a bad thing.
 

VerdantGreen

Genetics Facilitator
Boutique Breeder
Mentor
ICMag Donor
Veteran
jay, again i agree, ive never been fond of bark as a soil/peat substitute - but i found some proper nursery grade aged bark chips that i felt i should try again with because of some of the good things i'd read here about it.

in the UK there are no big lava deposits and so no crushed lava product to replace perlite. calcined DE is impossible to get hold of too - the only real alternative is the danish molar clay which can be bought as certain types of kitty litter and seramis (for 3 times the price)

VG
 

jaykush

dirty black hands
ICMag Donor
Veteran
i would just be on the lookout for local materials that would be of good substitute for perlite on your daily doings. not liking the 3x the price thing, im sure your wallet wont either.
 

VerdantGreen

Genetics Facilitator
Boutique Breeder
Mentor
ICMag Donor
Veteran
sharp sand/grit would be an ok substitute but the lightweight nature of perlite is actually very useful to me as i have to lift heavy pots in a space i cant even stand up in!

i buy perlite from a wholesaler and get it for £20 for 100 litres -i guess thats about a dollar a gallon. not exactly cheep but much cheeper than buying small bags from the garden centre.

VG
 

jaykush

dirty black hands
ICMag Donor
Veteran
yea the moving heavy pots can be a bitch sometimes.

you never know though, i stopped into the dollar store one time for something and they had 15 lb bags of calcined DE cat litter for 1$. not something i would have went searching for or the place to look for it.

you also have to take into account that perlite breaks down and needs replacing, the lavarock, calcined DE, and other stuff is good to go for years of use. and cycle after cycle of crops.
 

h.h.

Active member
Veteran
The trouble with perlite is that when it breaks down you don't replace it, you add more. Your percentage goes up while it's effectiveness goes down. The fine bits of broken down perlite become counter productive.
It's great for nurseries. Commercially available, cheap, light, and they use it only 1 time. Then it's sold with the plant.
 

love2gro

Member
agreed i hate perlite, it crushes so easily in your fingers. Ive just recently found pumice in my area Im excited to never use perlite again. not to mention the nasty dust in the perlite sucks and very bad for u
 

gOurd^jr.

Active member
Biochar is my alternative to perlite, and I'll never go back. Curious about rice/grain hulls but have not found a good cheap source locally.

http://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=155997

I was fortunate to find some really nice biochar from a nearby company. Char that is pyrolisized at high temp resembles perlite very much in that it is very light and airy, yet it is internally porous so it holds moisture and hosts microbes. also very sustainable. it does seem to break down similar to perlite and end up with fines...
Lower temp char is not as light and airy but is still internally porous, just less so. It does not break apart as readily into fines either though.
Isn't there a whole thread for this discussion of perlite?
 
all i know about perlite is that over say the 30 percent verdant uses def makes things worse no matter how much u feed or water, its just something roots dont seem to like, i learned the hard way, i just add about 20 percent now, im curious about 90 perlite and ten percent worm shit, im gonna actually try that.
 

h.h.

Active member
Veteran
The MG Organic isn't bad or as bad anyway. While there are advantages to your own mix, many of us still depend on bagged soil. Some of us learned the hard way not to use pre nuted. Many of us reuse our soil to save money as well as the world. Hence we want a living soil, full of squiggles and wiggles. Pre nutes die in 3 months when the ferts are gone while the salts remain.Generally a poor quality soil to begin with, the nutes being the gimmick that makes it sellable. Adding ewc or anything else is like adding sugar to salt or mixing good weed with oregano to stretch it out.
Then, it's asked, what can be added to it? Not knowing what the nute count is, only knowing it's good for 90 days, how could one even venture to make a guess? It may be too overloaded already. EWC would be basically a waste of EWC.
A better question might be what you can mix the castings with. I'd start with the floor sweep (DE) that can be sourced at most any auto parts and you're close to halfway there. Maybe a little peat, if you can find the lime. I wonder if the sweep will help neutralize the peat? Peat comes pre nuted as well, so watch that. I really don't have experience with it.
Perhaps somebody can come up with an easy mix using only materials sourced only from one of our so called garden centers.
 

Latest posts

Latest posts

Top