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Old 01-17-2021, 05:09 PM #11
thailer
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i agree with weird and bushed. most people experience a yield loss when switching from coco to soil and i think it is more than what bushed experienced but i think that is due in part to weird's comments in that it all depends on the skill level. watering plants is gonna probably be the biggest difference because wet dry cycles IMO aren't the best for yield compared to a consistent moisture level with organic soil, especially if you're gonna use a bed compared to smaller containers.

generally yield goes up the more soil you give them and the more soil you use also means you need to be good at not over or under watering because it more difficult to dry out or rehydrate the larger the soil amount. when i grew in 20 gallon fabric pots, i had plants 3 feet in height/width producing 150 grams and when i switched to SIPs the same cut i ran for years immediately gained an additional 100 grams in weight. everything else the same and i use the basic coot mix as well but i didn't use chicken manure or leaf mold fed worms. this was all first round soil as well. i didn't defoliate, prune, or anything to the plants themselves back then. just au natural but today, i am starting to do more things to play around with yield.

i can say for sure that everyone who switched over has had nothing but positive things to say about it even if some things aren't equal. i think it would be rare to meet someone who didn't think it was a good choice to make.
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Old 01-17-2021, 07:55 PM #12
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Industry extractors must not have a clue what theyre doing, or have never even seen good organic bud ran through their facility. Otherwise the secret would be out: hydro is good for growing plant matter, that's about it. I think everyone would rather have buds with a deadened thump to their resonance, even when bone dry. Put a bud in my hand I'll tell you your rosin returns. 25%? HYDRO MIDS.
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Old 01-18-2021, 11:49 PM #13
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.....when i grew in 20 gallon fabric pots, i had plants 3 feet in height/width producing 150 grams and when i switched to SIPs the same cut i ran for years immediately gained an additional 100 grams in weight. ....


What is a "SIP" ?





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Old 01-20-2021, 03:58 PM #14
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Sub irrigated planter. In other words, watered from the bottom.
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Old 01-23-2021, 06:13 AM #15
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i agree with weird and bushed. most people experience a yield loss when switching from coco to soil and i think it is more than what bushed experienced but i think that is due in part to weird's comments in that it all depends on the skill level. watering plants is gonna probably be the biggest difference because wet dry cycles IMO aren't the best for yield compared to a consistent moisture level with organic soil, especially if you're gonna use a bed compared to smaller containers.

generally yield goes up the more soil you give them and the more soil you use also means you need to be good at not over or under watering because it more difficult to dry out or rehydrate the larger the soil amount. when i grew in 20 gallon fabric pots, i had plants 3 feet in height/width producing 150 grams and when i switched to SIPs the same cut i ran for years immediately gained an additional 100 grams in weight. everything else the same and i use the basic coot mix as well but i didn't use chicken manure or leaf mold fed worms. this was all first round soil as well. i didn't defoliate, prune, or anything to the plants themselves back then. just au natural but today, i am starting to do more things to play around with yield.

i can say for sure that everyone who switched over has had nothing but positive things to say about it even if some things aren't equal. i think it would be rare to meet someone who didn't think it was a good choice to make.

There's me. I experimented with sip a bit. I'm not a fan at all. Water doesn't flow up. There is no way to control how wet the medium is. The bottom just stays soggy. I don't think stagnant water is cool. I personally like to control how much water a plant gets every day and how wet my medium is. I thought It's that top layer of soil that is the most biologically active. And the feeder roots are at the top. To me it's a cool science experiment to try. Its not ideal but it's cool that it works. I don't see why it would be someone's grow method of choice. I'm sure there is some theory that explains it, But i haven't heard it yet. Why would it be preferred over drip?
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Old 01-23-2021, 06:35 AM #16
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in my growing experience, I always had mediocore yields in promix with salts. I later tried some organics(seagull guano and such) but didnt like the outright smell of it. So i never did give it a fair chance as you would have it.either way, Many crops later, i decided on coco and like the yields and the growth without the plants going rootbound. But I will be damned if there isnt some sort of lockup with the pottasium that causes some nute deficiency. I decided f it, I will just run straight Hydro and thats what I did. There is def benefits to coco as the roots are in a media and the room can be run hotter and you can take advantage of co2 and such. where as hydro i have to keep my room cool to keep the rez cool.

anyway, getting back to yields in organics, I run my mom plants in organics and they seem to do pretty good. I dont have any fancy list like supersoil but what I do use seems to do the trick. Hard to compare yields at this present time because the soil plants are older and taller. my hydro plants of the same strain seem to grow quicker in the hydro tables and the last yield was 2105 grams from 1400 watts of leds. It would have been 3001 grams if not for the low yielding kush strain. I would really have to run soil organics with same number of plants to compare properly.
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Old 01-23-2021, 07:59 AM #17
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Originally Posted by CrushnYuba View Post
There's me. I experimented with sip a bit. I'm not a fan at all. Water doesn't flow up. There is no way to control how wet the medium is. The bottom just stays soggy. I don't think stagnant water is cool. I personally like to control how much water a plant gets every day and how wet my medium is. I thought It's that top layer of soil that is the most biologically active. And the feeder roots are at the top. To me it's a cool science experiment to try. Its not ideal but it's cool that it works. I don't see why it would be someone's grow method of choice. I'm sure there is some theory that explains it, But i haven't heard it yet. Why would it be preferred over drip?
This thread is all about Sips, If you can take the time would be interesting to know how your design differed and what went wrong?

https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=378414
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Old 01-23-2021, 10:47 AM #18
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It didn't go wrong. It just doesn't do as well as drip from the top and there were things i really didn't like about it. Its just kind of backwards. This festering mushy layer at the bottom. It seemed like a rot time bomb. I top dress. It has to be watered down. I need water flowing down in the amounts i need at the time i need. Having to put down so much mulch to keep the top layer from evaporating. I don't like smothering my soil with thick mulches like that. Its just very flawed. It just doesn't do as well as any type of drip from the top.
There are allot of different methods of growing i have tried. There is always some theory on what makes that method work better that made me try it. I tried sip just because it was an experiment.
I haven't heard the theory on sip.
Like what is the reason that I'm trying to fight physics? What am i going to get out of it?
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Old 01-23-2021, 11:36 AM #19
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It's all in the link I posted above. Thailer did a lot of work to explain everything in great detail.
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Old 01-24-2021, 06:05 AM #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CrushnYuba View Post
There's me. I experimented with sip a bit. I'm not a fan at all. Water doesn't flow up. There is no way to control how wet the medium is. The bottom just stays soggy. I don't think stagnant water is cool. I personally like to control how much water a plant gets every day and how wet my medium is. I thought It's that top layer of soil that is the most biologically active. And the feeder roots are at the top. To me it's a cool science experiment to try. Its not ideal but it's cool that it works. I don't see why it would be someone's grow method of choice. I'm sure there is some theory that explains it, But i haven't heard it yet. Why would it be preferred over drip?
water actually does flow upwards and it fights gravity up till a certain point. water flows upwards using capillary action. in a shallow container the soil gets pretty soggy like you mentioned and i saw several SIP users show their root balls of brown gross roots. i made some changes to the design to address a lot of the problems that made people shy away from SIPs like wet feet, soil being too saturated and how to keep your roots healthy. why i prefer it over drip is that plants dictate how much water they uptake with a SIP while in drip you control and have to adjust as plants grow. the peat moss keeps the soil saturation at a certain point when it is allowed to uptake the water as it needs it and isn't top watered. i was sold two years ago after getting an increase in weight that nearly doubled.

heres some bud that is the width of the palm of my hand and forearm.


here's some nice knockers too.

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