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Old 10-13-2018, 03:55 AM #831
BongFu
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Originally Posted by stewart169 View Post
A tiger doesn’t lose sleep over the opinions of sheep.
Well you cerainly have tabs on yourself don't you tiger (meeeeoww) ? - have you anything intelligent and/or insightful to add to the thread.. ?
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Old 10-13-2018, 06:54 AM #832
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Originally Posted by Absolem View Post
Post #51 is very informative. Read what YosemiteSam says starting on page five.

From my own experience I wanted to see how low I could push P. In veg I was around 27-30 ppm and starting 12/12 I increased P to 40 ppm. Around week 5 1/2 into 12/12 the plant leaves didn't look as lush as they should. I didn't see any difference in flower size or appearance. At that point I upped the p to around 80 ppm for a couple weeks then reduced my EC the final 10-14 days till chop.


@ OMalley
Great job learning how to break down nutrient profiles. There are several Dept of Ag sites from various states that randomly test fertilizer and post the results online. I'm glad no one was around telling me that breaking down nutrients is just a waste of time. It's given me the ability to tailor my nutrient profile as I see fit. For 40$ you can send in any fertilizer to a lab and have them test it for macro and micro nutrients.

Cheers

No one said you are wasting your time breaking down nutrient profiles. Certainly if you run lab analysis it is worth doing to establish given ppm in solution from any fertilizer product. What though is an utter waste of time is using the data from nutrient labels which list guaranteed minimums and are generally miles away from what a lab analysis would provide. BTW DBs such as the CDFA DB are also highly unreliable; however, sometimes as you point out compliance testing is done and if you can get your hands on the stated minimums to lab findings the lab findings provide you with a reliable road map to establish ppm in solution.
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Old 10-14-2018, 01:58 AM #833
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BongFu View Post
No one said you are wasting your time breaking down nutrient profiles. Certainly if you run lab analysis it is worth doing to establish given ppm in solution from any fertilizer product. What though is an utter waste of time is using the data from nutrient labels which list guaranteed minimums and are generally miles away from what a lab analysis would provide. BTW DBs such as the CDFA DB are also highly unreliable; however, sometimes as you point out compliance testing is done and if you can get your hands on the stated minimums to lab findings the lab findings provide you with a reliable road map to establish ppm in solution.

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Originally Posted by BongFu View Post
What though is an utter waste of time is using the data from nutrient labels which list guaranteed minimums and are generally miles away from what a lab analysis would provide.
BULLSHIT!

Here's some of the labels from the fertilizer products I use and their guaranteed minimum analysis.


These are products from Yara Fertilizer and Hafia Fertilizer. These products are used by farmers who farm 100s if not 1000s acres. They can't risk losing a crop because the manufacturer lied about the NPK's to keep their formula secret. If the manufacturer's lied about their NPK"s to these farmers they will be out of business very quickly.

The products in the pictures when lab tested are almost an exact match to the guaranteed minimum analysis. The lab tests I have on Canna nutrients are a match to the GMA. Same for GH. Why would a company lie about their NPK's to growers who have no clue how to make nutrients or understand what's in them? Most company's whose NPK's don't meet the GMA usually have poor quality control. These companies can't keep their formula's secret from people who know how to make nutrients because for $40.00 you can have a lab analyze them so lying about their NPK"s is pointless.

Yes there are some shady nutrient companies mainly catering to the cannabis community as you stated. Wow. Thanks for that great insight Captain Obvious.

What is a waste is your "advice" to people on this site. Instead of telling OMalley to double check the GMA with lab tests available online and pointing him to those tests you belittle him. Your advice is nothing more then a buzzkill to a grower whose trying to improve their skills. Why do you feel the need to discourage people instead of sending them on the right path? Make ya feel like you know something they don't?

Back to this thread about low P. YosemiteSam grew in coco coir. The reasoning behind limiting p is to keep the stretch in plants to a minimum. The stretch in plants the first two weeks of 12/12 is caused by phosphorous NOT nitrogen. Limiting the the P during the first two weeks of flower will keep the stretch down big time.
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Old 10-14-2018, 09:09 AM #834
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Originally Posted by Absolem View Post
BULLSHIT!

Here's some of the labels from the fertilizer products I use and their guaranteed minimum analysis.
View Image View Image View Image View Image

These are products from Yara Fertilizer and Hafia Fertilizer. These products are used by farmers who farm 100s if not 1000s acres. They can't risk losing a crop because the manufacturer lied about the NPK's to keep their formula secret. If the manufacturer's lied about their NPK"s to these farmers they will be out of business very quickly.

The products in the pictures when lab tested are almost an exact match to the guaranteed minimum analysis. The lab tests I have on Canna nutrients are a match to the GMA. Same for GH. Why would a company lie about their NPK's to growers who have no clue how to make nutrients or understand what's in them? Most company's whose NPK's don't meet the GMA usually have poor quality control. These companies can't keep their formula's secret from people who know how to make nutrients because for $40.00 you can have a lab analyze them so lying about their NPK"s is pointless.

Yes there are some shady nutrient companies mainly catering to the cannabis community as you stated. Wow. Thanks for that great insight Captain Obvious.

What is a waste is your "advice" to people on this site. Instead of telling OMalley to double check the GMA with lab tests available online and pointing him to those tests you belittle him. Your advice is nothing more then a buzzkill to a grower whose trying to improve their skills. Why do you feel the need to discourage people instead of sending them on the right path? Make ya feel like you know something they don't?

Back to this thread about low P. YosemiteSam grew in coco coir. The reasoning behind limiting p is to keep the stretch in plants to a minimum. The stretch in plants the first two weeks of 12/12 is caused by phosphorous NOT nitrogen. Limiting the the P during the first two weeks of flower will keep the stretch down big time.

Don't say bullshit without posting the lab analysis to prove your point champ. Oh geez do tell on P causing stretch - that's old old news now. However, all nutrient ions need to be kept within their respective ranges and ratios. A deficiency will result in reduced growth as will excess due to excess of any one nutrient antagonising other important nutrient ions (see Mulders chart). I know you think you sound clever but you really really arent. Now rather than tossing off about your lab analysis matching the guaranteed minimums try posting it to demo the point or its just more BS.
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Old 10-14-2018, 09:22 AM #835
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Old 10-14-2018, 09:29 AM #836
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Example of mislabeled products and how common it is

https://www.oregon.gov/ODA/programs/...StopSales.aspx


Stop sales between 2016 - 18 = 849


Fertilizer violations and penalties = 284

Go figure :-)
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