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questions for Sam Skunkman on terpenes

Nirrity

Active member
hi Sam!

1. in one of hash church videos you have said that "the higher in the mountains, the better". you have also told you found no correlation between uv-b and potency of cannabis. my question is what do you suppose or know for sure make high altitude grown weed better?

on a side note, here are 2 reports on greenhouse and od grown buds which shows negligible differencies in terpenes, both ratio and total content. i guess unless uv-b transparent coverings were used for gh, it seems that confirms that uv-b doesn't affect terpenes.


*it is better to download the picture as browser doesn't show it at full res, it is big picture with all digits clearly visible



2. you said that you like how limonene affect thc the best, while you don't particularly like what myrcene, pinene or linalool do to thc.
did you try thc+terpinolene? what puzzles me is that you say you like sativas generally and limonene in particular while the majority of sativa/nld samples i've seen all have terpinolene as a hallmark terpene, with relatively little limonene.
i've seen only 1 original haze terpene test which is limonene dominant.
so do you have all your personal haze, thai, indian samples tested as limonene dominant? hybrids which are readily available on the market are all mostly terpinolene dominant. could it be you may actually like terpinolene as well?

on a side note, many samples at sclabs which are limonene dominant are not really sativas at all.

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3. could you please describe in short how do 5 major (pinenes, myrcene, limonene, linalool and terpinolene) terpenes affect thc the way you see it? i mean there are plenty of reports which says that - roughly - pinene is for focus, myrcene is for bodystone etc., but i'd like to hear what you'll say on that matter since you actually smoke thc+ many of those terpenes yourself so you know it first hand.

4. what's the metabolic cycle for terepene production, ie do they fill the glandular trichomes at any stage and then these trichomes become "sealed" and stay unchanged till harvest and plant "move on" to "filling" trichomes on newly developed offshoots, or it is a constant process and all trichomes' content being constantly "updated" up until harvest so both old and new trichomes have the same terpene composition? i am sorry i'm not educated guy so this is the best i can describe, i hope you get my gist.


5. which terpenes cause weed to stink? or perhaps its not terpenes so better say which compounds do it?

for example, myrcene being described as "an yellow oily liquid with a pleasant odor", i suppose both limonene and linalool also have pleasantly scented odors, so how come for example karma's headbanger with the terpenes' ratio of 2:3:1 for myrcene:limonene:linalool ends up being described as stinky, putrid, "dirty diapers" etc. sort of smells? is it too high of a terpenes content which make low concentration pleasant odors start to stink at higher concetration?





6. besides providing plants with soil microorganisms and allowing them to develop fine root system what else can be done to improve terpene production and reduce terpene loss during flowering stage? i would assume less heat and no negative pressure (strong centrifugal fans with passive intake), is it correct? what about ventilation? does too much air movement help evaporate terpenes?

7. last but not least, could you please recommend how to best dry/cure buds to preserve terpenes?

i apologize if you have answered some of these questions already.
 
hi Sam!

1. in one of hash church videos you have said that "the higher in the mountains, the better". you have also told you found no correlation between uv-b and potency of cannabis. my question is what do you suppose or know for sure make high altitude grown weed better?

on a side note, here are 2 reports on greenhouse and od grown buds which shows negligible differencies in terpenes, both ratio and total content. i guess unless uv-b transparent coverings were used for gh, it seems that confirms that uv-b doesn't affect terpenes.

[URL=https://thumb.ibb.co/jUaeZH/OD_vs_GH.jpg]View Image[/url]
*it is better to download the picture as browser doesn't show it at full res, it is big picture with all digits clearly visible



2. you said that you like how limonene affect thc the best, while you don't particularly like what myrcene, pinene or linalool do to thc.
did you try thc+terpinolene? what puzzles me is that you say you like sativas generally and limonene in particular while the majority of sativa/nld samples i've seen all have terpinolene as a hallmark terpene, with relatively little limonene.
i've seen only 1 original haze terpene test which is limonene dominant.
so do you have all your personal haze, thai, indian samples tested as limonene dominant? hybrids which are readily available on the market are all mostly terpinolene dominant. could it be you may actually like terpinolene as well?

on a side note, many samples at sclabs which are limonene dominant are not really sativas at all.

[URL=https://thumb.ibb.co/d4cREH/limonene.jpg]View Image[/url] | [URL=https://thumb.ibb.co/kPDcMx/common_sativas.jpg]View Image[/url]



3. could you please describe in short how do 5 major (pinenes, myrcene, limonene, linalool and terpinolene) terpenes affect thc the way you see it? i mean there are plenty of reports which says that - roughly - pinene is for focus, myrcene is for bodystone etc., but i'd like to hear what you'll say on that matter since you actually smoke thc+ many of those terpenes yourself so you know it first hand.

4. what's the metabolic cycle for terepene production, ie do they fill the glandular trichomes at any stage and then these trichomes become "sealed" and stay unchanged till harvest and plant "move on" to "filling" trichomes on newly developed offshoots, or it is a constant process and all trichomes' content being constantly "updated" up until harvest so both old and new trichomes have the same terpene composition? i am sorry i'm not educated guy so this is the best i can describe, i hope you get my gist.


5. which terpenes cause weed to stink? or perhaps its not terpenes so better say which compounds do it?

for example, myrcene being described as "an yellow oily liquid with a pleasant odor", i suppose both limonene and linalool also have pleasantly scented odors, so how come for example karma's headbanger with the terpenes' ratio of 2:3:1 for myrcene:limonene:linalool ends up being described as stinky, putrid, "dirty diapers" etc. sort of smells? is it too high of a terpenes content which make low concentration pleasant odors start to stink at higher concetration?

[URL=https://thumb.ibb.co/mkyzZH/head_banger.jpg]View Image[/url]



6. besides providing plants with soil microorganisms and allowing them to develop fine root system what else can be done to improve terpene production and reduce terpene loss during flowering stage? i would assume less heat and no negative pressure (strong centrifugal fans with passive intake), is it correct? what about ventilation? does too much air movement help evaporate terpenes?

7. last but not least, could you please recommend how to best dry/cure buds to preserve terpenes?

i apologize if you have answered some of these questions already.


great questions, for number 7, i find letting buds dry in a cardboard box helps every so slightly in preserving terpenes. The more HEAT, airflow/time you have on your buds, the less terpenes in general, its like they are "air soluble".

The basic goal is to provide them with al little airflow as possible - while still keeping them cool, dry, mold free etc.

A TRUE SLOW DRY AND CURE PROBABLY HELPS TOO.
 
Last edited:

DenverJim

Active member
There is a good article by Russo in the British journal of pharmacology “Taking THC: cannabis synergy and phyttocannabinoid-terpenoids entourage effects. Has a lot of info on this topic.
 

WaterFarmFan

Active member
Veteran
4. what's the metabolic cycle for terepene production, ie do they fill the glandular trichomes at any stage and then these trichomes become "sealed" and stay unchanged till harvest and plant "move on" to "filling" trichomes on newly developed offshoots, or it is a constant process and all trichomes' content being constantly "updated" up until harvest so both old and new trichomes have the same terpene composition? i am sorry i'm not educated guy so this is the best i can describe, i hope you get my gist.

I am sure there is a more technical response, but I will provide a few of my observations from looking at lots of terpene lab analysis. Some terpenes are the building blocks (precursors) for other terpenes. So, as the trichomes mature (clear, cloudy to amber), the composition of the terpenes change as well. If you cut a plant too early, terpene profile is not fully developed and effect is not as desired. Also, it seems that plants with mostly clear trichomes have a higher % of total terpenes (maybe 3% when cut), while same plant with amber trichomes might have 2.5% when cut, 2% when initially dried and same bud if properly cured will have 1.5%. These are just examples, but most people prefer to smoke/vape bud that has been cured, why is that (as it relates to terpenes)?
 

gaiusmarius

me
Veteran
interesting thread.

i think smoking terps with pure thc is what Sam meant when he said which terps effect he likes. doesn't mean it has to be in his favorite bud. just my guess anyway.
 

Nirrity

Active member
hi Sam in case you see it do you think terpinolene and limonene can have very similar effects or the fact limonene is chiral molecule make them different? otherwise they look very similar.

 

Douglas.Curtis

Autistic Diplomat in Training
In reference to altitude, my personal experience says UV is not the variable to focus on.

As far as I can tell, I've been growing high altitude cannabis for 15+ years. In reality, I've only been at altitude for 7 years. What I mean by high altitude cannabis is the type of conditions you find there. In the mountains, arguably the source of the finest hash from several parts of the world, the flowering temperatures are cool and the humidity is low.

The plants are more resinous and terpene rich, the oil:plant-matter ratio being higher, and the quality is stunning. The downside is you have to veg longer for the same yield, since there is no tropical explosion of plant matter growth. The end result is a smaller flower structure, which appears much more trichome dense. Plants simply do not grow as tall/large in the dry/cool climates you find in mountain regions.

I definitely prefer the quality. ;)
 

gaiusmarius

me
Veteran
the trick is to give them a tropical climate for the veg phase and the first 4 weeks of 12/12, then go to cold and dry for the rest of the flowering.
 

wutwut

Well-known member
Veteran
if final 48 hours of darkness in cold and dry climate makes more trichomes, what does it do for terpenes?

how about flushing?
 

Dog Star

Active member
Veteran
Am thinking..,Sam is not interested in giving you any answer.. am judge this by what date you started this thread and still nothing happends.. ;D


Maybe he use recently more Myrcene in his smoke,i dont know.. :chin: :biggrin:
 

Douglas.Curtis

Autistic Diplomat in Training
if final 48 hours of darkness in cold and dry climate makes more trichomes
It does not. I'm personally not aware of anything which will "make more trichomes" appear in the last 2 days, let alone fill them with fully developed cannabinoids and terpenes.

Cool and dry for at least the majority of the flowering period. (As I see Gaiusmarius has already pointed out. :) )

Whether Sam participates or not, it's an interesting set of questions. :) lol
 

mexcurandero420

See the world through a puff of smoke
Veteran
Altitude and light - The lower the altitude at which the thyme plant is grown the more pronounced are the following

effects:

■ The essential oil becomes more aggressive – more phenolic and antiseptic.

■ The colour of the essential oil also changes, from a light straw to a deeper hue.

■ The structure of the main component molecule changes from an open chain to a monocyclic chain to an aromatic ring base.

These effects are due in part to the quality of light available to the plant. At high altitudes (above 1000 metres) there is a relatively high

amount of free ultraviolet, while at low altitudes there is less ultraviolet and a proportional increase in the more penetrating infrared frequencies. The plant responds to the quality of light falling on it (and to other growing conditions) and produces different chemicals accordingly. Another influencing factor is the latitude of the country of origin. The further north the plant grows, the more phenols are produced – for instance Thymus vulgaris grown in Finland produces up to 89% phenol (von Schantz et al 1987).

More changes may be expected in oil-bearing plants in the future because of chlorofluorocarbon damage to the ozone layer. Higher levels of ultraviolet radiation are expected to reach the

surface of the earth, and research carried out to test the possible effects of this on plant growth suggests that alpine species will be least affected by increased ultraviolet radiation. These tests

involved Aquilegia canadensis and A. caerulea. The first normally grows at low altitude, and showed less growth during the test, but the second, alpine, plant was not affected in this way: it even grew

extra leaves (Gates 1991).

Aromatherapy for Health Professionals - Shirley Price 
 

Sam_Skunkman

"RESIN BREEDER"
Moderator
Veteran
I never saw this thread, thus I did not respond.
Some of the questions I spent years and a lot of $ finding the answers, I am not so sure I want to just give the info away.
I will answer any I feel are not info that cost me so much time and effort and $.
I do love the right terpenes, I also prefer the terpenes intact in the Bud, resin, like in dry sift.
-SamS
 

Dog Star

Active member
Veteran
Hehehehehehe... thats why i tought you dont wish to answer..

knowledge is not for free,i know for that fact..


Am didnt wish to insult no body tough i addmit i was a bit provocative to pull Sam
out..


Kind regards Sam
 

Nirrity

Active member
...
Some of the questions I spent years and a lot of $ finding the answers, I am not so sure I want to just give the info away.
I will answer any I feel are not info that cost me so much time and effort and $.
sounds fair. Sam i'll be grateful for any info you can share.
 

mexcurandero420

See the world through a puff of smoke
Veteran
Thyme is definitely not cannabis. ;) It looks like it responds to cool temps with increased phenol production, which is similar to cannabis.

You're kidding thyme is not Cannabis, but Cannabis has never been researched on the terpene profile in an environment with a high UV-index (>12) and in a low UV index environment (5-7).
Would be interesting to see the difference between e.g Amnesia hyprocut from Spain and Amnesia hyprocut grown under HPS light.
 

Douglas.Curtis

Autistic Diplomat in Training
You're kidding thyme is not Cannabis, but Cannabis has never been researched on the terpene profile in an environment with a high UV-index (>12) and in a low UV index environment (5-7).
In the last 15+ years of reading cannabis information online, I've seen quite a few tests. Go look them up yourself, but the only real effect UV has been repeatedly stated to have works best when used on plants when exposed to it as seeds on up. The effect has been tested as negligible, with the higher amounts leading to damage.

(Edit: I went and refreshed my info on this. Though not all genetics responded the same (sativas doing better), a test in 1985 was done with UV and cannabis plants. With genetics which could handle it, UV levels up to equatorial levels created higher levels of THC... when the exposure was there from sprout to harvest.)

Believe me, I've been reading up on UV from the very beginning of my research on basic growing.
 
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