Real OLD SCHOOL - Cherry Oil

Hookahhead · Nov 26, 2019

I recently listened to the “Growing with fishes” episode with Breeder Steve. I don’t remember where it was in the episode, but he briefly mentions that red Lebanese was “old stock” and blond was “new”. He also said that the red is from degradation into CBN, which is why it was a 1 hit KO. It was an incredible episode and definitely worth listening to the whole thing just to catch that part.

https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/growing-with-fishes-podcast-175-breeder-steve/id1248057217?i=1000456187622

Douglas.Curtis · Nov 26, 2019

Awesome, thanks

Here's the youtube link https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GtQSPutSXY8

G.O. Joe · Nov 27, 2019

Isn't that like saying brown Mexican was old stock and green Mexican is new stock and the brown was degradation to CBN? CBN and CBNA are colorless - so technically, it's something else.

CannaRed · Nov 27, 2019

Farmer John said:
I remeber some article or some thread about making oil and such back in the day and someone pointed out that in afghanistan/and or lebanon they used to place a large chunk of hash in a cauldron and leave it in the desert sun for a while so that the resin started to melt and flow kinda like what happens when you make rosin and then this was collected etc. My memory is not what it used to be but it could be found somewhere here, the thread that is. Oh yeah and also the sand in Lebanon is very red if you search and have a look around old hippies said that the "pure" stuff was cut down with that fine red sand. Go tell, old hippies.

I've heard that before about color of hashish matches the color of it's adulterants. Black hand rubbed was from the oil in their hands. Red Leb was from the dust of Lebanon.
I believe I also heard it from Todd McCormick. Possibly on Talking Cannabis podcast.

axle2u · Nov 27, 2019

^^

very interesting....

thanks guys...

-ax

SolarLogos · Nov 27, 2019

CannaRed said:
I've heard that before about color of hashish matches the color of it's adulterants. Black hand rubbed was from the oil in their hands. Red Leb was from the dust of Lebanon.
I believe I also heard it from Todd McCormick. Possibly on Talking Cannabis podcast.

Greetings CR. I think what you have heard is valid and I don't doubt what is discussed here regarding adulterants in Cannabis, I've heard similar stories myself. I did want to point out the Afghani hashish, however, doesn't start out black, but does turn black after all the heating and pressure put on massaging the disc of hash. The disc of hash gets spayed with water, heated in a pan over fire, then pressed several times in the palm of the hands. This is repeated over and over. Over the course of the process, the hash does turn black.
Fermented hash does the same thing. I had several grades of Mexican bubble hash ranging from blonde to green. I don't chop my wet hash, but let it dry in a tight ball. After a few days in the curing cabinet, I put all the various balls into a vacuum sealed bag, while at around 85-90% RH. After a month, it is cured and almost black.

I had grown quite a bit of Mexican, but they lacked that spicy characteristic I grew up with. I thought it was environment, until I read a story about how they cured cannabis in central and south america back in the 60's and 70's. They put it in piles fresh, like they did their tobacco and when the center of the pile reaches about 150F, they turn the pile and repeat until it is cured.
Fermenting (Tangwena cob style) cannabis will bring out that spicy aroma I was missing in my Homegrown Mexican.
Just some extra thought.
Peace, God bless

axle2u · Nov 30, 2019

SolarLogos said:
Greetings CR. I think what you have heard is valid and I don't doubt what is discussed here regarding adulterants in Cannabis, I've heard similar stories myself. I did want to point out the Afghani hashish, however, doesn't start out black, but does turn black after all the heating and pressure put on massaging the disc of hash. The disc of hash gets spayed with water, heated in a pan over fire, then pressed several times in the palm of the hands. This is repeated over and over. Over the course of the process, the hash does turn black.
Fermented hash does the same thing. I had several grades of Mexican bubble hash ranging from blonde to green. I don't chop my wet hash, but let it dry in a tight ball. After a few days in the curing cabinet, I put all the various balls into a vacuum sealed bag, while at around 85-90% RH. After a month, it is cured and almost black.<a href="https://www.icmag.com/ic/picture.php?albumid=80780&pictureid=1961821" target="_blank">View Image

I had grown quite a bit of Mexican, but they lacked that spicy characteristic I grew up with. I thought it was environment, until I read a story about how they cured cannabis in central and south america back in the 60's and 70's. They put it in piles fresh, like they did their tobacco and when the center of the pile reaches about 150F, they turn the pile and repeat until it is cured.
Fermenting (Tangwena cob style) cannabis will bring out that spicy aroma I was missing in my Homegrown Mexican.
Just some extra thought.
Peace, God bless

hello my friend, thank you for this post...

have you ever encountered, panama red ?
ive heard that for a time, it moved in on the Mexican weed market in the US....Im curious about that strain...
about the same era....late 70s early 80s

:tiphat:

-axle

SolarLogos · Dec 1, 2019

axle2u said:
hello my friend, thank you for this post...

have you ever encountered, panama red ?
ive heard that for a time, it moved in on the Mexican weed market in the US....Im curious about that strain...
about the same era....late 70s early 80s

-axle

I only saw panama red once in our area around 79. About the only thing I remember was it was strong sativa, much stronger than most colombian or mexicans that came through. Sorry, can't be too much help. I grew up in a very small town, practically everyone, cops, judge (so I was told), teachers smoked and grew so homegrown was so plentiful, we really didn't have a market for imports. It was usually more of a novelty.
Peace, God bless

axle2u · Dec 1, 2019

SolarLogos said:
I only saw panama red once in our area around 79. About the only thing I remember was it was strong sativa, much stronger than most colombian or mexicans that came through. Sorry, can't be too much help. I grew up in a very small town, practically everyone, cops, judge (so I was told), teachers smoked and grew so homegrown was so plentiful, we really didn't have a market for imports. It was usually more of a novelty.
Peace, God bless

once again, thank you for the info....1979 is approx. the era im looking for....
as potential material used in the manufacture of cherry oil of the time

red lebanese, pakistani chitral kush, panama red, and perhaps some type afghani strain, are also potential source materials used back in the day by some tricked out chemist.....(recipe is just as important). The source materials would have been a landrace, not a hybrid of todays breeders.

im also going to guess, that the material was in huge abundance
was cheap, and the chemist preferred methods of extraction/recipe was also extremely cheap as well....
it was manufactured in huge abundance in a remote overseas area, and imported as finished product through major hubs....
one is inclined to speculate further ...BOEL

of course, this is all speculation.

the oil (original cherry oil) has been confirmed, in NYC and Toronto (major hubs) at the same timeline....
that in itself is suggestive of a major organization capable of such tasks

again speculation,

cheers mate,

-axle

SolarLogos · Dec 1, 2019

axle2u said:
once again, thank you for the info....1979 is approx. the era im looking for....
as potential material used in the manufacture of cherry oil of the time

red lebanese, pakistani chitral kush, panama red, and perhaps some type afghani strain, are also potential source materials used back in the day by some tricked out chemist.....(recipe is just as important). The source materials would have been a landrace, not a hybrid of todays breeders.

im also going to guess, that the material was in huge abundance
was cheap, and the chemist preferred methods of extraction/recipe was also extremely cheap as well....
it was manufactured in huge abundance in a remote overseas area, and imported as finished product through major hubs....
one is inclined to speculate further ...BOEL

of course, this is all speculation.

the oil (original cherry oil) has been confirmed, in NYC and Toronto (major hubs) at the same timeline....
that in itself is suggestive of a major organization capable of such tasks

again speculation,

cheers mate,

-axle

You are very welcomed my friend. I believe at that time, they may have had Purple Zacatecas in Mexico on one side, big sur holy weed on the other side so that could have been a supply at one time. There is also purple oaxaca and neplalese. I think I mentioned it before, Vermontman's 79 oaxaca x nepalese is purple and said to smell like cherries. Mine were all oaxaca phenos so I can't verify the cherry smell, but I might be inclined to look towards the nepalese. If I'm not mistaken, both the Oaxacan and nepalese were purple in his purple satellite.
SL

axle2u · Dec 12, 2019

SolarLogos said:
You are very welcomed my friend. I believe at that time, they may have had Purple Zacatecas in Mexico on one side, big sur holy weed on the other side so that could have been a supply at one time. There is also purple oaxaca and neplalese. I think I mentioned it before, Vermontman's 79 oaxaca x nepalese is purple and said to smell like cherries. Mine were all oaxaca phenos so I can't verify the cherry smell, but I might be inclined to look towards the nepalese. If I'm not mistaken, both the Oaxacan and nepalese were purple in his purple satellite.
SL

"Vermontman's 79 oaxaca x Nepalese"

do you know anything more on this strain...??
curious now.....lol

-axle b square

SolarLogos · Dec 12, 2019

axle2u said:
"Vermontman's 79 oaxaca x Nepalese"

do you know anything more on this strain...??
curious now.....lol

-axle b square

Greetings Axle,

Here is what the description is on Ace's website:
"Upright classic sativa long spears, very self supporting, always sporting some pink to fuchsia pistils, some seasons darker than others.
The taste is extremely smooth. Slight pine cedar, hash, hint of berry syrup. From mid to late flower strong cherry fragrance." (Emphasis added)
https://www.aceseeds.org/en/strains/standard/purplesatellitestd.html
When you see the red and purple in the hybrid, your eyes may light up :biggrin:

. I suspect it is close to the color you are looking at.

The purple comes from both sides of the cross, but the early flowering traits come from the Nepalese side. Otherwise, it's not a long stretch to assume that if the purple Oaxaca finished in early November/late October, lower temps near the end of flower (50-53F should work) you may get the color you are looking for. Either one of those could have actually been used in the original oil. I will send you a PM.
SL

Elmer Bud · Dec 12, 2019

G `day SL

The red oil that Axle is looking for is from the colour of the trichchomes .
Red , purple or black leaves should not be a factor as they don`t get extracted into the oil . Only the trichome heads .

Reading a while back that in Afghanistan they harvest very late Oct / Nov / Dec .
Would mean lots of amber trichomes .

norcal_sourD · Dec 13, 2019

https://www.reddit.com/r/CannabisExtracts/comments/a6iu6h/red_hash_oil/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web2x

Beaker984. His work is preserved on a few other sites. I think this is the holy Grail you've been searching for.
" This red oil is obviously a breakdown product(s) from the acid forms of CBN and THC and through THC Delta 8 THC. I stumbled on this in an old archive. In some ways this red oil is much better at symptom relief than isolated THC which is a big cognitive high."

SolarLogos · Dec 13, 2019

Elmer Bud said:
G `day SL

The red oil that Axle is looking for is from the colour of the trichchomes .
Red , purple or black leaves should not be a factor as they don`t get extracted into the oil . Only the trichome heads .

Reading a while back that in Afghanistan they harvest very late Oct / Nov / Dec .
Would mean lots of amber trichomes .

I don't disagree with you EB, good points. However, looking at trichomes on purple buds, it's not uncommon to see the purple go right up the stalk of the trichome and fill the head with purple. I honestly have no idea how they the oil back then and didn't come across it personally, but this is the only strains I could think of that fit the cherry smell and color. Thanks friend :tiphat:

@Axel: I can't remember if you explained, it wasn't a WLD stone was it, it was an up sativa high? I'm just trying to think of what other strains would have been used.
SL

axle2u · Dec 13, 2019

SolarLogos said:
I don't disagree with you EB, good points. However, looking at trichomes on purple buds, it's not uncommon to see the purple go right up the stalk of the trichome and fill the head with purple. I honestly have no idea how they the oil back then and didn't come across it personally, but this is the only strains I could think of that fit the cherry smell and color. Thanks friend

@Axel: I can't remember if you explained, it wasn't a WLD stone was it, it was an up sativa high? I'm just trying to think of what other strains would have been used.
SL

thank you for the post, friend...

so here is a pic of the strain I think you are referring to,
so others following this thread, can see what it is we are yapping about....lol

it is no doubt, a tasty looking little treat,

-axle b robot

axle2u · Dec 14, 2019

I came across this picture a few days ago, credit to norcal sourD....thanks mate

I checked his link, not much info as far as how to..
however, this IS the closest pic ive seen to date...in fact I can say that this IS the color
of authentic late 70s- early 80s cherry oil...red

look at bottom of beaker....that's the color or REAL cherry oil

not the shite all dispensaries will sell you as cherry oil....they don't know what real cherry oil looks like, been there-done that
they winterize and it has just a slight red hue to it, but a redish brown, but still brown.....dispensaries=not real cherry oil -period
they havnt a clue....trust me on that one

see for yourself -bottom of glass beaker
yup, I can tell you, that IS the color...ive had it early 80s...several times
absolute divine oil....heaven sent

I can recall, smooth smoke, great tasting, smells awesome (cherry when burnt)
tastes like cherry, good euphoric buzz....clean white smoke, these are all attributes I can recall....
on the scene, then gone forever...never to be seen or heard of again
38 or so years now....very very elusive .....so I bring my quest -to all of you on this site, this forum
in hope that somewhere in the world, someone will come forward and shed some light on the subject

is this cherry oil...I don't know
but I can say, it is the color.....aX

norcal_sourD · Dec 17, 2019

Glad you checked it out. He does however go into great detail on how he makes this. He refined others lower quality distillates into ultra pure distillate using a Coldfinger sublimator. Its all documented on other sites which would probably against TOS for me to name here. Just search Beaker984 or I think beaker1984. I think he was a member here too. Even has videos on his processes. "This red oil is obviously a breakdown product(s) from the acid forms of CBN and THC and through THC Delta 8 THC. I stumbled on this in an old archive. In some ways this red oil is much better at symptom relief than isolated THC which is a big cognitive high." Seems like he was a solid guy. Wish I couldve met him...

axle2u · Dec 18, 2019

norcal_sourD said:
Glad you checked it out. He does however go into great detail on how he makes this. He refined others lower quality distillates into ultra pure distillate using a Coldfinger sublimator. Its all documented on other sites which would probably against TOS for me to name here. Just search Beaker984 or I think beaker1984. I think he was a member here too. Even has videos on his processes. "This red oil is obviously a breakdown product(s) from the acid forms of CBN and THC and through THC Delta 8 THC. I stumbled on this in an old archive. In some ways this red oil is much better at symptom relief than isolated THC which is a big cognitive high." Seems like he was a solid guy. Wish I couldve met him...

interesting (spock)...lol

now if I understand correctly about a cold finger,
does that apparatus not work the same way a condenser works
or a reflux apparatus , same principle isn't it...? I dunno
I briefly looked it up, and read some on it, seen diagram ect.

a reflux tower, I would set up, wouldn't require a vacuum source tho, not at that point, you can rig up vacuum at the end of the distillation process, to help things along...reflux tower youd use cold water to coil and cool, then it condenses and drips back into the liquid and keeps repeating the process I think...
kinda like percolated coffee

havnt done any of it yet, but buying lab equipment
pieces here and there, and starting to build a small lab

I want to try isomerize with acid, and try that dual carbon higher chain thingie.... delta8 stuff...so I got 500ml separator funnel and stand....for rinse acid back out, neutralized with bicarbonate soda
havnt done it yet, read up on it, buying equipment, but not there quite yet....

I suspect, that this process, will alter color and taste (flavor)
at least that's what im hoping for....I got to get to a point to be able to make a red oil
then work on the flavor of it....

this beaker guy, and his process(s)
id love to read up more on him, but I didn't see anything much
then 11 comments on that link...
in fact id like to talk with this guy....lol

thanks my friend, appreciated

-axle

axle2u · Jan 13, 2020

going to try making an oil out of purple space cookies...
and see if that flavor is closer to cherry, in a resin oil...

it wont be red (nor a color thing)....
but more of a flavor experiment

weed is on the way....lol

-axle

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