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Cloning Fruit Trees... no grafting allowed!

MJPassion

MJPassion

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Hello ladies n gents of IC Mag.

I've been looking at cloning some of the fruit trees (especially apples) around my area and was wondering if any of yall have any experience doing such?
No grafting allowed!
I'm interested in pure stock only since I don't have any root stock to graft to.

I think it's already too late to get cuttings. I read that cuts need to be taken from dormant trees and the ones at my place have already began budding out. The apricots are swarming with bees. (Hope the blossoms don't freeze!)
If anybody tells me they've experienced anything different I might go take a few cuts anyway.

So lets hear some of yalls experiences and/or thoughts.
 
Budley Doright

Budley Doright

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It sounds to me like air layering is what you need to do....and its not too late for that....

Apples airlayer quite easily.......

Plenty of info on Youtube......


You need to realize..... when you air layer a plant..... there is no rootstock....

the plant is back on its own roots.....


just sayin

I plan a bunch of air layers myself but......Ive still got a little snow on the ground.....
 
S

summitoker

Member
I am interested in this. I have several old apple trees on my land that were grafted to crab apple root stock. Is that because the crab apple roots can take the cold or other reasons?
 
B

Betterhaff

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Native rootstocks tend to be more hardy and more resistant to soil born diseases and pests. That’s why they’re used. Taking cuttings of existing trees can be done yet because they will be using their own root system they may be susceptible and not as vigorous as grafted types.

It is best to take cuttings before bud break. Make sure they are from new wood, growth from the previous season that has over wintered. You want to have cuts with a couple buds that will be put in the substrate and a few buds that will be above. Carefully strip some of the bark at the to be rooted end trying not to disturb the cambium layer (what you’re trying to do is expose it), dip in rooting hormone and put in substrate. A substrate with a higher percentage sand is best. Water thoroughly, dome and keep in a warm place, keeping everything moist (not wet) throughout. If they root, it will take 4 – 6 weeks. I’ve done this with Japanese Maples.
 
Budley Doright

Budley Doright

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summitoker said:
I am interested in this. I have several old apple trees on my land that were grafted to crab apple root stock. Is that because the crab apple roots can take the cold or other reasons?
Click to expand...

Im pretty sure thats a cost thing.....

but the resulting trees will not be very consistant in size....compared to the clonal rootstocks......


There are zillions of crabapples..... its really not a very definitive word......


One of my favorite youtube videos was of this guy....that went around grafting trees ...not on his property......


He would graft them over into a good variety and nobody was the wiser....... I thought it was a very clever approach .....
 
B

Betterhaff

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Somebody did that with a crabapple tree in my area, must have grafted a branch or 2 of a commercial cultivar to it when young. When in fruit about a quarter of the tree has regular apples and the rest are crabbies. The apples aren’t great for eating out of hand, the tree doesn’t get any attention care wise. But they make the best applesauce, I usually pick and make a couple batches every year.
 
MJPassion

MJPassion

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summitoker said:
I am interested in this. I have several old apple trees on my land that were grafted to crab apple root stock. Is that because the crab apple roots can take the cold or other reasons?
Click to expand...

I think your on the right track w your thinking.

By my understanding, normal trees are grafted to root stocks for disease resistances of the root stock as well as for "dwarfing", for lack of a better term, the trees for easy harvesting of the fruit.

One of the trees I'm interested in is an heirloom apple tree that's been growing in town for a few decades. It's about 40-50 feet tall so harvesting any fruit is a difficult task.
It makes some damn fine pick n eat apples as well. Small fruits, perfect for a kids lunch box... & tasty sweet.
 
MJPassion

MJPassion

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@Burnt Rope.
What is your experience using the air layering method?

@Betterhaff
Thanks for the detailed info.
It jives well with what I've read thus far.

I've got a few containers designed specifically for tree stock. Some are 2 inches around by about 10 inches deep & some others are 4x4 square by about 10-12 inches deep.

Any other input is appreciated.
Thanks for looking yall.
:D
 
stoned-trout

stoned-trout

if it smells like fish
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get moss wrap around branch that has been prepared...cover with saran wrap..make sure its moist...if it ever gets dry add water..i use a needle...cant get easier...yeehaw
 
Budley Doright

Budley Doright

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MJPassion said:
@Burnt Rope.
What is your experience using the air layering method?


:D
Click to expand...

Its not difficult is works pretty consistantly.....


Just a couple things in addition to what my friend stoned trout had to say.....


To prepare you must remove a one inch wide ring around your branch.... be anal.... make sure all brown and green is removed....

down to the white....


The traditional medium is moss..... but I understand coco will also work..... something that will absorb lots of warer....


I use plastic bread wrappers....

Make sure the bundle is tighly sealed.... with strips from bread wrapper.....

The idea is to not let any water out.....

I then use aluminum foil.....to keep the light out.... but the foil should be easily removed to check for roots......

If you need to remoisten.... a syringe works well......


Lots of videos out there......
 
B

Betterhaff

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MJPassion said:
Anybody with experience trying to root cuts in a clone machine?
Click to expand...
No experience but I would be afraid of rotting. Woody types tend to take longer to root, that is why a sandy type substrate is recommended. It stays moist but drains well, not soggy so to speak.

Since you’re talking about trees you could give it a try, it’s not like you don’t have enough cuttings to play with.

I agree with stoned trout but I’ve never air layered outdoors. You may have to support the branch somehow to prevent damage from the elements…mainly wind. Done it plenty of times with house plants and use a meat injector to supply water. With air-layering the branch is still getting some water and nutrients from the plant until roots form.

edit: In reference to what Burnt Rope said, when I air layer I usually cut thru the stem about half way with a couple of cuts and remove the material between the cuts leaving the opposite side intact. I then put a piece of wood in the gap to keep it from collapsing on itself. This allows the branch to continue to get water and nutrients but also exposes meristem tissue to form roots. (lol, we posted on top of each other).
 
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Budley Doright

Budley Doright

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The reason why air layering works....its because the flow from vegetation to roots has been interupted by ringing the branch.....

that stuff builds up and roots form on the vegetation side of the ring......
 
B

blastfrompast

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It will work, but they graft for a reason...keep that in mind.

Has anyone tried piercing the outter bark with a syringe of rooting homone, and just "pricking" the bark and injecting a touch in the wound vs cutting the whole ring off, applying hormone and wrapping?

Some people do this for MJ with great success, pre-gaming the rooting on the plant....but in the case of apple, it might help out your survival rates?

Course I'm baked so what do I know.
 
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