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Old 03-13-2018, 12:19 PM #41
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Absolem do those post # refer to the h34d goes coco thread? Trying to read all them but post number doesn't seem to match...
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Old 03-13-2018, 02:35 PM #42
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https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=55683


the numbers are on his first post
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Old 03-13-2018, 03:29 PM #43
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thanks siftedunity... yes that'ís the same thread I was using. But my trick to "make up" the straight URL for the post (like this one for #11) doesn't work the way I thought... will locate them it by hand

BTW I switched to Canna A + B today. 2ml/L on 20% tap 80% rain water (0.015 EC, around PH8) set me to 1.4EC, and nailed out PH to 5.8 which puzzled me... didn't have to use a single drop of PH down for the first time in my life!?!

I'm scratching my head regarding the analysis I posted. The first one specifies Ca, and Mag. But then there's that bicarbonates result... given the alkalinity (PH 8) I'm sure there's something more to Ca/Mag in this water than the 34-10mg/L the first analysis details, that screws the nutrient profile.

Natural water from wells has that same PH8 (nearer 9), here the underground is mainly comprised of a yellow limestone, Calcarenite (albero). So seems to do tap water. We had a serious drought last year than fixed itself with February snow and rain so possibly analysis will vary in a short future.

Won't be short on rain water for a while, but will run out in less than a month. Maybe having a RO filter will be the solution, at least I'll be positive regarding the water analysis is close to nill with regards of dissolved salts.

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Old 03-14-2018, 01:37 AM #44
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man I just switched to an ro filter. so glad I took the jump because I got sick of trying to figure out issues and having to assume the water was fine. and in all fairness it definitely wasn't consistent, even in smell and taste.
the only downside is the wastage . but tbh I think it will pay for itself.


as for your water analysis, im really not the person to ask. maybe someone else can chime in on that..
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Old 03-15-2018, 12:14 AM #45
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Quote:
Originally Posted by repuk View Post
thanks siftedunity... yes that'ís the same thread I was using. But my trick to "make up" the straight URL for the post (like this one for #11) doesn't work the way I thought... will locate them it by hand

BTW I switched to Canna A + B today. 2ml/L on 20% tap 80% rain water (0.015 EC, around PH8) set me to 1.4EC, and nailed out PH to 5.8 which puzzled me... didn't have to use a single drop of PH down for the first time in my life!?!

I'm scratching my head regarding the analysis I posted. The first one specifies Ca, and Mag. But then there's that bicarbonates result... given the alkalinity (PH 8) I'm sure there's something more to Ca/Mag in this water than the 34-10mg/L the first analysis details, that screws the nutrient profile.

Natural water from wells has that same PH8 (nearer 9), here the underground is mainly comprised of a yellow limestone, Calcarenite (albero). So seems to do tap water. We had a serious drought last year than fixed itself with February snow and rain so possibly analysis will vary in a short future.

Won't be short on rain water for a while, but will run out in less than a month. Maybe having a RO filter will be the solution, at least I'll be positive regarding the water analysis is close to nill with regards of dissolved salts.

Good looking water report. Very friendly for growing. Those are the total ppm's for Ca and Mg. They list the bicarbonates separate from Ca and Mg to give the viewer the actual mg/l for each element. If they listed Ca as CaCO3 the ppm's would be listed higher and need to be converted to Ca. To convert CaCO3 ppm's to Ca multiply by .400. CaCO3 ppm x .400= Ca ppm.


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Originally Posted by siftedunity View Post
wow thanks for your advice. yes I will try what you said for sure! is it cool to use regular food grade Epsom salts?
Yup on the Epsom. The Epsom you buy in stores is the same salt used by nutrient companies. It's one of the main ingredients in bloom boosters and bloom formulas. Just make sure on the label Mg is listed at 9.8% and sulfur at 12.9%.

https://www.gileschemical.com/our-pr...griculture.php

A few things I found growing in coco.
Feed the coco at least 75% nutrient strength for the first week then go full strength till the final 10 days. We feed the coco to feed the plant. Unless the cation exchange (CEC) is filled in coco the plants will look overfed/underfed. I found clones with spaghetti roots will get purple stems while clones with thick roots won't after transplanting. When my plants under perform the answer usually lies in a weak root system. Without a good root ball it doesn't matter how dialed your environment or nutrient profile is the plants just suffer.
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Old 03-15-2018, 11:25 PM #46
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thank you man.. I will try what you said
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Old 03-16-2018, 07:07 PM #47
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Absolem View Post
Good looking water report. Very friendly for growing. Those are the total ppm's for Ca and Mg. They list the bicarbonates separate from Ca and Mg to give the viewer the actual mg/l for each element. If they listed Ca as CaCO3 the ppm's would be listed higher and need to be converted to Ca. To convert CaCO3 ppm's to Ca multiply by .400. CaCO3 ppm x .400= Ca ppm.
Thanks!


Quote:
Originally Posted by Absolem View Post
Yup on the Epsom. The Epsom you buy in stores is the same salt used by nutrient companies. It's one of the main ingredients in bloom boosters and bloom formulas. Just make sure on the label Mg is listed at 9.8% and sulfur at 12.9%.

https://www.gileschemical.com/our-pr...griculture.php
Damn, now I remember... I used Epsom salt too on my last grow... for goods results I'm realizing! completely forgot I also had deficiencies back then (secondary effects on memory!). A look at my fert box and there it was...

But... lists analysis as 16,6% Magnesium, and 32.5% Ca? epsom salt from VDL Systems brand. What!?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Absolem View Post
A few things I found growing in coco.
Feed the coco at least 75% nutrient strength for the first week then go full strength till the final 10 days. We feed the coco to feed the plant. Unless the cation exchange (CEC) is filled in coco the plants will look overfed/underfed. I found clones with spaghetti roots will get purple stems while clones with thick roots won't after transplanting. When my plants under perform the answer usually lies in a weak root system. Without a good root ball it doesn't matter how dialed your environment or nutrient profile is the plants just suffer.
You mean 75% at repotting time, of the final target EC? i.e. If targetting for 1,5EC, when repotting using fresh coco, EC shouldn't be higher than 1.1EC?

Today I repotted, I think an indicator that the switch to rain+Canna was for good is girls are throwing about one inch of tap roots per day.

But still, I feel there's something missing. Some strains display slight signs of def, while others don't, e.g. from my current seedlings: Zamaldelica, Nepal Jam, Guawi, Kali China and Tai Chi, only the two Zamaldelicas show odd leaf coloration "inconsistencies".

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Old 03-16-2018, 07:18 PM #48
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Quote:
Originally Posted by absolem
Let's look at Canna a different way that will get us much closer to H3ad solution profile.

Canna Coco 8ml/gal. Yara SOP 52(potassium sulfate) @ 1/2 gram to a gallon. Total
N.............121............. ....................0......... .............................. ...................121
P..............42............. ......................0....... .............................. .....................42
K.............60.............. ....................57........ .............................. ...................107
Ca...........98............... ....................0......... .............................. ....................98
Mg..........33................ ...................0.......... .............................. ...................33
S.............15.............. ....................24........ .............................. ....................39


Absolem's Canna Profile with Yara SOP 52.......... H3ads 6/9
N........121.................. .............................. .......97
P.........42.................. .............................. ........60
K.......107................... .............................. ......105
Ca......98.................... .............................. .......97
Mg.....33..................... .............................. ......41
S.......39.................... .............................. .......27

These are the numbers I gave my Canna friends before they switched to Jacks. They would run this till the end of week one of 12/12 to help reduce the stretch. Then drop the Yara SOP 52 down to 1/4 gram/gallon and add Pk 13/14 at rate of 2.5mls/gallon for a P=37 and K=77 through weeks 2-5 of 12/12.
I don't get that... Doesn't Canna Coco A+B already have P=42? Won't adding P/K increase P higher than 42?
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Old 03-17-2018, 12:19 AM #49
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well spotted.. maybe he forgot to add the total for that.
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Old 03-17-2018, 01:06 AM #50
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Quote:
Originally Posted by repuk View Post
You mean 75% at repotting time, of the final target EC? i.e. If targetting for 1,5EC, when repotting using fresh coco, EC shouldn't be higher than 1.1EC?
Yes. If your full nutrient strength is 1.5 EC feed around 1.1 EC for the first week after transplant.


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Originally Posted by repuk View Post
I don't get that... Doesn't Canna Coco A+B already have P=42? Won't adding P/K increase P higher than 42?

Yeah, I should have noted that adding Canna P/K 13 during flowering weeks 2-5 will increase the total P to 79 ppm and K=165 ppm. I only gave how many ppm's Canna P/K 13 would add.

12/12 Weeks 2-5
Canna A/B 8 ml/gallon...Yara SOP 52 1/4 g/gal.....P/K 13.....Total
N..........121................ ...........0.................. ...........0.........121
P............42............... ............0................. ............37........79
K...........60................ ...........28................. ...........77.......165
Ca.........98................. ...........0.................. ............0.........98
Mg........33.................. ..........0................... ............0.........33
S..........15................. ..........12.................. ............0.........27

A lot of good info on P in this thread.

https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread....th+high&page=6

Quote:
Originally Posted by repuk View Post
But still, I feel there's something missing. Some strains display slight signs of def, while others don't, e.g. from my current seedlings: Zamaldelica, Nepal Jam, Guawi, Kali China and Tai Chi, only the two Zamaldelicas show odd leaf coloration "inconsistencies".
Canna by itself has really low K. When I ran Canna's nutrient profile I had some problems too. I added more K and the problem went away. That's why I recommend adding the Yara SOP 52 to correct the low K in Canna.
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