The Compound...

star crash said:

Keep it coming .....I'm lurking

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Definitely bro.... I know there's not much to see or talk about at this stage lol... I have been spoiled for the last 10 years or so growing from clone-only and I had forgotten how slow growing from seed is... haha I am just keeping track here more than anything... people will talk when there's something to talk about....lol. "If you build it, they will come."

Swap

That`s more like it.....Pic`s public now.....Hey it`s great to have some kind of effort goin down here in nowhere`s ville since DE `s and Gavita`s hit the scene and upped the yields on flat grows.....and now it`s LED`s for all the rage , and I kinda dig em too so I`m proud ta see some new vert setups happening.....

I`ll be over here on my bucket , so carry on and keep up the good work.....Thanks for your time and Good luck.....

Peace.....DHF..... …….

DunHav`nFun said:

That`s more like it.....Pic`s public now.....Hey it`s great to have some kind of effort goin down here in nowhere`s ville since DE `s and Gavita`s hit the scene and upped the yields on flat grows.....and now it`s LED`s for all the rage , and I kinda dig em too so I`m proud ta see some new vert setups happening.....

I`ll be over here on my bucket , so carry on and keep up the good work.....Thanks for your time and Good luck.....

Peace.....DHF..... …….

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Hi there Freds,

I have a few double ended HPS 600 lights that I am going to try and run vertically, and I am going to try out these CMH lights, and see what I can do vertically there too.

I have believed that LED lighting was the future since I bought my first one in 2010... and someday I will likely evolve into that, but for now I am going vertical...Aero mentioned in his sticky that he was considering another vert run, so perhaps we can spice things up down here a little...

Swap

Somewhere round here I saw Hayday with some vertical LED arrays in his thread , and Ichabod Crane did a run with his LED`s up and down fairly recently I think.....maybe since wintertime`s settin in we can get him to start a thread since his yankee ass `ll be snowed in most likely soon.....lol.....also......

Waaaay back when LED`s first surfaced there was a guy here nicked Thrillspan that did a thread with some wild ass vertical LED arrays that were 5 sided If memory serves and actual 600 watters at the outlets …...again....

I`m floatin on old ass memory , I`m fairly sure there were 5 lights hangin with 6 Sensi Star bushes , and I was amazed at the size plants those lights put out....but.....the damn lights were $ 2500 each and I almost shit myself , although I think he pulled somethin in the 12 lb range ….again if my old ass remembers correctly.....but damn.....$12500 for fuckin lights....anyways.....

I`m waiting on all my old Eye horti 600`s to burn out and then I`ll get Icky to build me a few of his LED units for my lil headies closet , although a good setup would be 4 of his hangin in the middle of a small area with buncha smaller plants on racks up the walls like my old stacked 600 setups back in the day.....aight.....Get to work and thanks for the thread.....

Peace.....DHF..... …….

DunHav`nFun said:

Somewhere round here I saw Hayday with some vertical LED arrays in his thread , and Ichabod Crane did a run with his LED`s up and down fairly recently I think.....maybe since wintertime`s settin in we can get him to start a thread since his yankee ass `ll be snowed in most likely soon.....lol.....also......

Waaaay back when LED`s first surfaced there was a guy here nicked Thrillspan that did a thread with some wild ass vertical LED arrays that were 5 sided If memory serves and actual 600 watters at the outlets …...again....

I`m floatin on old ass memory , I`m fairly sure there were 5 lights hangin with 6 Sensi Star bushes , and I was amazed at the size plants those lights put out....but.....the damn lights were $ 2500 each and I almost shit myself , although I think he pulled somethin in the 12 lb range ….again if my old ass remembers correctly.....but damn.....$12500 for fuckin lights....anyways.....

I`m waiting on all my old Eye horti 600`s to burn out and then I`ll get Icky to build me a few of his LED units for my lil headies closet , although a good setup would be 4 of his hangin in the middle of a small area with buncha smaller plants on racks up the walls like my old stacked 600 setups back in the day.....aight.....Get to work and thanks for the thread.....

Peace.....DHF..... …….

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I was originally thinking about taking one of these 9 bulb fixtures apart and rearranging the t9s into a vertical cylinder that i could plop into the middle of a circle of plants for vegging....then I got a great deal on some 315s so I figured I could just put one of those in the middle of a veg donut so I could shape and train these bitches in the same system and light arrangement that they will be flowering in... Back when I was a mod over at Gardenscure I had a huge medical collective grow where I tried an LED light that was supposed to content with HID....it cost something close to 2k and performed about like a 6....except the footprint was like 2.8x2.8 so yields were shit.... That was back when they were just hitting the scene though, so I knew it would be a matter of time before they were the rage...

I appreciate your insight Freds, and I look forward to more as I try to maximize efficiency here and yield something nice to represent vertville... I may end up converting over to large numbers in stacked 600s on racks one day in the future, probably before I would consider going back horizontle, but I try and keep an open mind...

Thanks,

Swap

star crash said:

I'm an HPS guy (1000 watt bulbs).. i love the big flowers they produce ...If i'm growing big plants then sometimes i drop one down bare bulb (configure the plants doughnut style) in the middle of the grow hung vertically in combination with the horizontal hoods above ...that really baths them in light

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Up until this grow, I have always been a kw HPS guy. My last major grow was right around 10kw, ebb and grow x around 200 plants in flower, and 2 4x8 e and f tables also in the flower room. This grow is going to be all about efficiency yielding pretty good numbers. Back in the day JB showed us his little closet octagons with 8 plant donuts around a single 6... I think he ended up pulling the equivalent of 2 bows off a single 6 in like 3'x3' or something small like that.

Then Aero pulled 2.5 bows from one 6 plant donut around a stacked 4 and 6 in around 4'x4' or something like that. I figure if I can pull 1.5 off per donut, I can harvey 1.5 bows/week in my home grow room alone... over in the compound, slightly more than that, perhaps 10-12 bows per month. Perhaps in the next compound I will experiment with vert LED or things of that nature. Here, I will look to stack two 315 CMH vertical around an 8 plant donut and see what that result is.... Perhaps I will try stacking a 600 over a 315 too, and see how that works... time will answer those questions as will runs under my belt...

Swap

The first donut setup I ever saw online was my `ol buddy from Cross da Pond Heath Robinson with concentric circles and bare bulb Eye Horti 600`s hangin in his version of ebb and flow/"multi-flow" buckets growin his Black Rose purple plants , and this was 1 of the biggest setups of his I`d ever seen cuz he was known for growin single or at best double 600 watt setups perpetually in smaller areas for faster turnover......long story short.....

It was learned that the backsides of the plants suffered without light getting through once the bulbs were dropped down amongst the plants when stretch was over and they were so thick and healthy, and the reflectix on the walls helped , but for the most part the plants in the middle of the room caught overlap from the light configuration and yield increase was noted......so.....bottom line.....

Trade offs and learnin curves on all new setups , and I wish I could sway you toward DTW coco usin Dripclean with barely enough runoff to call it DTW if this is gonna be a production type setup for consistent returns , on top of being bulletproof from any type rootborn pathogens you could encounter with all your DWC and Undercurrent efforts , but far be it from me to say anything but good luck and hope for happy harveys ....and.....I will....

Good luck ....DHF.... .....

DunHav`nFun said:

The first donut setup I ever saw online was my `ol buddy from Cross da Pond Heath Robinson with concentric circles and bare bulb Eye Horti 600`s hangin in his version of ebb and flow/"multi-flow" buckets growin his Black Rose purple plants , and this was 1 of the biggest setups of his I`d ever seen cuz he was known for growin single or at best double 600 watt setups perpetually in smaller areas for faster turnover......long story short.....

It was learned that the backsides of the plants suffered without light getting through once the bulbs were dropped down amongst the plants when stretch was over and they were so thick and healthy, and the reflectix on the walls helped , but for the most part the plants in the middle of the room caught overlap from the light configuration and yield increase was noted......so.....bottom line.....

Trade offs and learnin curves on all new setups , and I wish I could sway you toward DTW coco usin Dripclean with barely enough runoff to call it DTW if this is gonna be a production type setup for consistent returns , on top of being bulletproof from any type rootborn pathogens you could encounter with all your DWC and Undercurrent efforts , but far be it from me to say anything but good luck and hope for happy harveys ....and.....I will....

Good luck ....DHF.... .....

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That's why i keep them independent and in containers so you can turn them around individually when needed ...

DunHav`nFun said:

The first donut setup I ever saw online was my `ol buddy from Cross da Pond Heath Robinson with concentric circles and bare bulb Eye Horti 600`s hangin in his version of ebb and flow/"multi-flow" buckets growin his Black Rose purple plants , and this was 1 of the biggest setups of his I`d ever seen cuz he was known for growin single or at best double 600 watt setups perpetually in smaller areas for faster turnover......long story short.....

It was learned that the backsides of the plants suffered without light getting through once the bulbs were dropped down amongst the plants when stretch was over and they were so thick and healthy, and the reflectix on the walls helped , but for the most part the plants in the middle of the room caught overlap from the light configuration and yield increase was noted......so.....bottom line.....

Trade offs and learnin curves on all new setups , and I wish I could sway you toward DTW coco usin Dripclean with barely enough runoff to call it DTW if this is gonna be a production type setup for consistent returns , on top of being bulletproof from any type rootborn pathogens you could encounter with all your DWC and Undercurrent efforts , but far be it from me to say anything but good luck and hope for happy harveys ....and.....I will....

Good luck ....DHF.... .....

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You mean racks around a single 6 of dtw coco... I have thought a lot about those, and Heathy was the inspiration behind my current hydro system. I first saw it either back on the OG days, or a long time ago here... (this is my second handle here)... I was thinking that DTW coco will be a change at some point that I will convert to starting in my experiment room until I can dial it in, then perhaps start the next house all dtw coco... It is just hard for me to envisage the yield per square foot to match the donuts...

I like coco as a medium, and barely any runoff sounds nice too. I am sure that can be dialed since I'm talking to you, the master of the dialed flip rooms.

Are you talking 1 gal grow bags with 30 or so plants per cylinder....a zip per plant? or what is your vision? I appreciate you Freds,

Swap

star crash said:

That's why i keep them independent and in containers so you can turn them around individually when needed ...

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Some say that rotation negatively affects yields because the plants need to adapt to the light position with every turn...

I think Aero did a great job of just pruning the back of his plants that were away from the light.

I also considered having donuts set up in the pattern of the 5 on a paire of dice with each dot being in the center of a donut, and the middle donut just being made up out of the backsides of the donuts around the other 4 lights.

DunHav`nFun said:

I wish I could sway you toward DTW coco usin Dripclean with barely enough runoff to call it DTW if this is gonna be a production type setup for consistent returns...

Good luck ....DHF.... .....

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I can be swayed.... I am open minded and logic rules. I have zero experience with coco and setting up drip systems, and many years with all sorts of different hydro setups, so I naturally gravitate towards my experience. With you as a guide I know I am in good hands, and I am completely open to babyshit, dialed, consistant results. When I saw aero and bonzey pulling nice numbers out of their donuts, I was thinking heath's undercurrent system in a donut may give me that 2-2.5 lbs per 4x4 area that I'm looking for out of a bare 600 or stacked 315CMH, whatever need be.... it seems hard to beat. The more I learn, the less I realize that I know... so I am always open to learning new things, setups...etc. If you think I can yield more per square foot/ more gpw, I am all ears.

Thanks,

Swap

swapmeet said:

I can be swayed.... I am open minded and logic rules. I have zero experience with coco and setting up drip systems, and many years with all sorts of different hydro setups, so I naturally gravitate towards my experience. With you as a guide I know I am in good hands, and I am completely open to babyshit, dialed, consistant results. When I saw aero and bonzey pulling nice numbers out of their donuts, I was thinking heath's undercurrent system in a donut may give me that 2-2.5 lbs per 4x4 area that I'm looking for out of a bare 600 or stacked 315CMH, whatever need be.... it seems hard to beat. The more I learn, the less I realize that I know... so I am always open to learning new things, setups...etc. If you think I can yield more per square foot/ more gpw, I am all ears.

Thanks,

Swap

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Trust me Bro....I`m one of the original water babies online runnin Krusty buckets for well over a decade before Heath talked me into his "multi-flow" setups that I DIY`ed outta 5 gal buckets , and ran them another 7-8 yrs before coco even ever came on the scene , so again believe me.....It took a lot to sway me toward the shit....especially havin to waste as much juice down the drain to make the beast pump out the dank but I digress....so.....

I got a pm 1 day from an `ol buckethead buddy to come check out his new coco thread runnin multiple 1 lb plants fed once a day DTW , so I did...and....He had 5 gal buckets inside another 1 with the bottom containers plumbed to a central drain and was absolutely killin it.....Bare bulbs hangin just like our old krusty buckets , but with way more plants in the room than we were used to , so to say the least I was intrigued.....but once again.....not easily swayed by hype , and on top of it all.....

I was dead off in the middle of 5 locations with 10 flip rooms slap damn full of ebb and flow buckets at all different stages of bloomage , and not about to change shit that ain`t broke , so I put the coco on the back burner.....but.....I was havin issues keeping up with enough rooted cuts from "mum" plants as Heath calls em , and he told me to setup Waterfarms that like fed continuously with a "venturi' tube , and I was ready to pull the trigger till I saw how much them pieces of shit cost , and then I remembered those coco plants Blue Haze was pumpin out so I hit him up...…

Long story short....With all the buckets I had on hand plus plumbing available at either Lowes or Home Depot , I spent couple hundred bucks on coco and perlite compared to couple thousand those bullshit waterfarm setups cost including shipping , so my tight ass went for the coco and never looked back.....

Put 4 buckets under 2-8 bulb 4' T-5`s @ each location , and in a month`s time I was throwin away cuts while bein able to have far more than needed to use picks of the litter for pre-veg and bloom rooms , so my tight ass started doin budget on all the bells and whistles it took to run and feed the monster I`d created , and I was kinda shocked while still skeptical on makin a major change and goin through yet another "learning curve" to dial a completely new and different setup …..but.....about that time.....

Heath started a thread on a vertical "rack room" with 2 stacked 600`s and square pots sittin in open "racks" for drainage fed continuously and pulled a lil over 4 lbs his very first run , and I was hooked.....finished out both rooms at 1 location and completely remodeled ….all in a weekend and was loading up both rooms within 2 weeks with 4 plants on 4 walls on 4 levels for a total of 64 clone only pick of the litter Chem D flippin on and off every 12 hrs with 3 stacked Eye Horti 600`s blastin their ass with 50 watts per sq ft and environment on autopilot...…

70 days later both rooms pumped out within grams of each other 98 ozs more/less with loads of room for improvement and yield increase as to where my ebb n flow bucket rooms had maxed out at 5 lbs +/- with waaaaay more shit to take care of and maintain , so I bit the bullet and remodeled as each location finished and the rest was history for awhile…..even shut down 1 location and was still pullin more outta 8 rooms than the previous 10 with all the bells and whistles of fast hydro...until....

Had a security breach and a close Bro got popped with 100`s of plants at all different stages plus finished product and they took his hard drive that I was all up on and had way too much to lose if he turned on me , so I shut down everything and remodeled all locations to either sell or rent out till able to sell , and that was my career in cropping , shut down before dialin said system but happy with what I have and no losses were incurred so it`s a win win in my book...…Sittin on my covered deck at the beach watchin my bulldawg chase sandpipers and seagulls then bite waves crashin.....free entertainment....

I stay around here to keep up with old friends in PM that I have no other way to contact securely , but I always read the threads and try ta help when I can.....Don`t post much and pm`s are always open , but bottom line Swap.....I`d never try and get yas outta your comfort zone with setups you have no experience with , so let`s work on doin maybe Ebb and flow buckets instead of "Recirculating Death Without Cause" LOL , cuz there`s just too many X factors involved that can make shit go sideways IME.....but....that`s your call , so let`s work on settin up a coco run on the side to see how it goes and you can make your mind up from there....aight.....

I`m stoned as a goat and the `ol lady`s hollerin Breakfast is done , so wake n bake over....Gotta get the dawg in and eat then go check crab traps....Sorry for the long-windedness , but I thought you should know I feel your pain on change my buddy , but we all know if you don`t Grow , you wither.....so...Take care and good luck.....

Peace.....DHF.... …..

Thank you for the background Freds. I have been reading your posts for years, some to grow bros of mine, preaching dialage, monocroppin, and telling each of them that they ought to consider racks in coco for babyshit automated yields. As you say frequently, some get it... most don't. Your experience and wisdom I trust 100%, and have seen it workin for folks for years. I tell people I am from Missouri... the show me state... I am a visual learner. I am one of the ones who "gets it." I've got no ego, I am eager to learn, and I pay attention to detail.

I am at the perfect place in this grow to make this kind of plan change and I've got the time and space. I also have the equipment on hand to change back to my original plan if this coco thing doesn't work out, so if you're willing to guide me, I say let's go for it.

I have ordered a couple different rack options to see which one is going to work the best, and I have more heavy yielders on the way in the form of Chem D, AK47, and GDP... So I can give these patients options, though I will be monocropping and dialing each flip room individually.

So I think I remember you talking about little Christmas trees that yielded around an ounce dry each and you using a combination of the stringy and chunky coco...

If that is true (or close) that is 4 plants per rack, 4 shelves, 64 plants per 4' x 4' area with a bulb or 2 in the middle dangling bare.

What size pots are we talking about here?

Thanks,

Swap

I fed the girls 458ppm @ 6.2 ph... They look like the 9 bulb t5 is a bit to close, so I'll move it up a bit today...

Group Shot:



NL1 and 2:



GSC, Cheese seedling, and GG4:



GG1 and G2:

DunHav`nFun said:

Trade offs and learnin curves on all new setups , and I wish I could sway you toward DTW coco usin Dripclean with barely enough runoff to call it DTW if this is gonna be a production type setup for consistent returns , on top of being bulletproof from any type rootborn pathogens you could encounter with all your DWC and Undercurrent efforts , but far be it from me to say anything but good luck and hope for happy harveys ....and.....I will....

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swapmeet said:

I can be swayed.... I am open minded and logic rules.

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hello there brother, your setup looks killer!
just wanted to pop in, like a vegan, to share my experience with what DHF is saying -coco-blumats-dripclean-norunoff-... it's easy, convenient, cool and more, just mix some nutes, throw in the reservoir and watch the jungle grow; it's truly a miracle for me at least and it's my very first time with them. just follow the instructions and don't try to reinvent the wheel and you are good to go.

still, whatever path you take my brother, i wish you the best and will be subbed from now on your thread, you have a killer team there,
cheers

pongster said:

hello there brother, your setup looks killer!
just wanted to pop in, like a vegan, to share my experience with what DHF is saying -coco-blumats-dripclean-norunoff-... it's easy, convenient, cool and more, just mix some nutes, throw in the reservoir and watch the jungle grow; it's truly a miracle for me at least and it's my very first time with them. just follow the instructions and don't try to reinvent the wheel and you are good to go.

still, whatever path you take my brother, i wish you the best and will be subbed from now on your thread, you have a killer team there,
cheers

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Right on, thanks bro. I am going Freds' way. I am pretty sure, IIRC, it is just timed drippers, no blumats.... Just drips for x minutes 4 times per day or something similar until a touch of runoff....that's part of the dialage... This will be fun.... I am up to the challenge.

Swap

I have started getting acquainted with coco... by reading the first 60 pages+ of
"A few things that I've learned about growing in coco with a drip systm DTW" and taking notes.... More learning to do, of course, but I like what I see so far Freds...

Thank you,

Swap