Clonex vs Self Made Rooting Compound

englishrick · Apr 17, 2019

Hay Guys,,

I heard recently that groth technologys have removed rhizopon from the clonex formula???????

To back this claim I have noticed when taking clones, using clonex and root riot plus formulex (my classic cloning protocol) even in combination with clonexmist which I just tested ,,, clones are taking so long it's worrying,, really worrying

This raises the question,, should we be adding rhizopon to our cloning prosses now it's been removed???

OK,,, so let's say its a good idea,,, what about other stuff,,like naa,, Bap,, kinatin, zeatin,, etc,,,

Has clonex just been subpar???,,, can we do better??

OakyJoe · Apr 17, 2019

Indole-3-butyric acid

powder mix:
The concentration of indole-3-butyric acid is 1.0%, the remainder consists of talc (magnesium silicate hydrate).
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/10-g-Bew...493052?hash=item1ef52ea27c:g:6m0AAOSw-ghb4AWH

or as a gel

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/50ml-Bew...681199?hash=item1ee9fcda6f:g:7vYAAOSwvoNblQXb

works amazing!

englishrick · Apr 17, 2019

So is this in itself better than clonex?

OakyJoe · Apr 17, 2019

Indole butyric acid (also known as IBA) is a plant hormone that is responsible for root initiation and growth and is the active ingredient in Clonex.

englishrick said:
So is this in itself better than clonex?

So yes, since they took out the hormone in the new formula ( at least in the eu )

Ibechillin · Apr 17, 2019

Its not been uncommon for me to have cuts healthily rooted in 7 days using rockwool plugs, Take Root powder (Indole-3-butyric acid), and Great White powder with a humidity dome. More effort is involved this way as controlling the humidity and letting them dry at specific times is key.

Ive never had cuttings root as fast in an aero cloner using Clonex. Also dont cover them with a humidity dome and do the wet dry cycles, just misted a few times through out the day.

englishrick · Apr 17, 2019

Yeh,, so previously,, clonex had how many active ingredient?,, now only iba?

I'm wondering what would be an ultimate mix/formula ,, any ideas?,,, it's quite possible that a home formula is easily 10x better than clonex is in the EU now,,,

like is it a good idea to add zeatin,, naa,, superthive,, gamborg vitamin, meta tarpolin to the mix,,, etc???,,, i could litrally buy a pot of clonex and dump extra bits in,, that seems the best way for people to aproch a clonex upgrade

And would any of the homemix formulations show up on pgr test when it comes to budsales

OakyJoe · Apr 17, 2019

englishrick said:
Yeh,, so previously,, clonex had how many active ingredient?,, now only iba?

based from the 2012 MSDS sheet it contains indole butyric acid as the active ingredient. 2-hydroyxethylccllulose as viscosifier and crystal violet dye as colourant; these components are dissolved in water.

Water mixed with >98%
Indole butyric acid @0.3%
2-Hydroxycthylcellulose @1.2%
Crystal Violet Dye @0.0012%

englishrick said:
like is it a good idea to add zeatin,, naa,, superthive,, gamborg vitamin, meta tarpolin to the mix,,, etc???,,, i could litrally buy a pot of clonex and dump extra bits in,, that seems the best way for people to aproch a clonex upgrade

There some other acids:

1-Naphthaleneacetic acid (NAA)
Indole-3-acetic acid (IAA, 3-IAA)

i can't tag users here but WHIPEDMEAT got some knowledge about this iirc, maybe he can lead you the way

f-e · Apr 17, 2019

In the UK we also have baby bio roota. Another gel formulation, that offers protection against dampening off. It's this mold managing ingredient I buy it for, over any other.

Once it's no longer available (which after decades is looking likely) I just won't use anything. Which I found preferable to clonex and all the hardware store things I have picked up, and slung out.

englishrick · Apr 18, 2019

cytokinin heavy is what we are going for,,meta tarpolin seems like one of the best options for tissue culture and rooting formula,, iba is good,, but what others,, naa,, etc?,,, what sorta proportions?

Options include

Zeatine
Kinatine
Naa

What else

OakyJoe · Apr 18, 2019

u might have a look here

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indole-3-butyric_acid IBA
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indole-3-acetic_acid IAA
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1-Naphthaleneacetic_acid NAA

SuperBadGrower · Apr 18, 2019

This cannabis-specific article contains some solid info about taking cuttings. They test IBA but not many others and the competition is lame (willow extract)...

Vegetative propagation of cannabis by stem cuttings: effects of leaf
number, cutting position, rooting hormone and leaf tip removal (D. Caplan 2018)

The paper is Ch. 2 at page 17:
https://atrium.lib.uoguelph.ca/xmlu...n_Deron_201808_PhD.pdf?sequence=5&isAllowed=y

I myself use NAA powder (at a concentration of 3% iirc) 100% success rate, 9-15 days they emerge depending on medium volume... but that's just anecdotal. The article might be a good starting point for research (see citations) about different hormones

Rooting hormone (IBA) had the greatest effect on both rooting success rate and root quality (Figure 2.2, 2.3).
The synthetic hormone delivered a 2.1 times higher rooting success rate and 1.6 times higher root quality than the organic hormone. (willow extract)

aridbud · Apr 18, 2019

Organic natural cloning:
A favorite approach is cutting a large, healthy leaf from your aloe plant and dipping the tip of your clone directly into the gooey center of the aloe leaf.

Collect fresh young green/yellow shoots/branches. Sometimes rather than cutting into 2"'-3" chunks, I will run my scissors alongside the branch, creating ribbons. The goal is to expose as much of the interior of the branch as possible — that’s where all the good stuff resides. Fill it with boiling water, cover, and let sit for 24 hours. Once your water is fully infused, drain into container to dip plants in.

Combination of aloe/willow work beautifully.

shaggyballs · Apr 18, 2019

IBA and NAA are the powerhouses of rooting.
I use water soluble stuff found on ebay.
No dangerous KOH needed.
https://www.ebay.com/itm/Indole-3-b...301750?hash=item4d70398d76:g:MnYAAOSwheZatAnM

https://www.ebay.com/itm/NAPHTHALEN...133533?hash=item4d6c666c5d:g:-B4AAOSwtfhYpyMA

If you need gel use methyl cellulose or agar.
https://www.ebay.com/itm/Carboxy-Me...hash=item1eea93f50a:m:mnQ-v24l8rEsKRBo28_kopA

So for about $20 you will have enough clonex to last for years.
BTW I don't think you need to add cytokinin to the mix.

englishrick · Apr 18, 2019

Methyl cellulose is super interesting,, better for tissue culture than sucrose?,,, it's an interesting thought that maybe washing clones in auxin,, even methyl cellulose plus gamborg vitamins,,

What about a mix of,,,

Naa
Gamborg vitamins
Iba
Methyl cellulose
Dash of meta tarpolin

What about zeatin and Kinatine?

Is it worth buying clonex for the gell and iba,, or is rhizopon just better

englishrick · Apr 18, 2019

Obviously for root differentiation we use ausin heavy formulation,,, but what about shoot diferenceation?,,, when should we change the ratio of auxin:cytokinin?

Is a touch of cytokinin healthy in root induction stages,, if so which and how much

Nice Post BTW shaggy balls

englishrick · Apr 18, 2019

What are your thoughts on autoclaveing the home formula?

And what about adding ppm,, plant preservative mixture??

Dunkin no Dunkin?,,,

Uvc

70% ethanol wash 5 secs,,,

Distilled water?

What is ultimately the best protocol to use nowadays,,

englishrick · Apr 18, 2019

SuperBadGrower said:
This cannabis-specific article contains some solid info about taking cuttings. They test IBA but not many others and the competition is lame (willow extract)...

Vegetative propagation of cannabis by stem cuttings: effects of leaf
number, cutting position, rooting hormone and leaf tip removal (D. Caplan 2018)

The paper is Ch. 2 at page 17:
https://atrium.lib.uoguelph.ca/xmlu...n_Deron_201808_PhD.pdf?sequence=5&isAllowed=y

I myself use NAA powder (at a concentration of 3% iirc) 100% success rate, 9-15 days they emerge depending on medium volume... but that's just anecdotal. The article might be a good starting point for research (see citations) about different hormones

This is an area I have great interest in,,,

Naa is a fantastic deviation from the norm,, i love that you use this currently,, your a trend setting guy bro,,

What about that ultra protocol,, you gota be thinking ultimate protocol,, over comp to the max

Mart · Apr 18, 2019

Hi

I grow for myself only and I use honey,cut the clone from mum immediately brush the cut with honey then I trim the leaves and I root in ph 6.2 water,usually root in 10 days.Fresh water after first 5 days.Then into coco hempys.

Did I read that bloom nutes work too?

Philmore Jars · Apr 18, 2019

1 pint aloe gel not juice 1 tablespoon kelp meal 1/2 tablespoon Bioag Ful power let sit 1 day then refrigerate

Contains all 3 plant compounds identified as rooting agents IAA IBA & SA

(Got this off Clackamas coots Instagram)

SuperBadGrower · Apr 18, 2019

englishrick said:
This is an area I have great interest in,,,

Naa is a fantastic deviation from the norm,, i love that you use this currently,, your a trend setting guy bro,,

Haha no way man, that's way too much credit there

I use NAA is because my dear late Grandmother left us enough of it to take about a million cuttings. I only researched what it was after finding out that it works great. (for me)

Clonex vs Self Made Rooting Compound

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