OPEN DEBATE: Hermaphroditism, due to?

How are you?

First of all, just want to clarify that this is my 4th grow and im just a noob, but just trying to put all my effort in this.

I have been popping regular seeds since a year and a half, hunting the traits i like, keeping clones, and discarding the ones i dont like.

Well for this run i decided to put eight different strains i was keeping plus some clones a friend gave me for try em.

Okey two months ago i started growing the moms in soil, plant based organics in 10 liters tex pots using Canna's Bio Rhizotonic, Bio Vega, B.A.C's Pro Active, Foliar Spray. Mycoterra's Kraken (Glomus Iranicum) and Quimera (Trichoderma Harzianum), Molasses and a Red + Crimson clovers cover crop on them. Canna Bio Terra Professional. and General Organic's Black Diamond Humic Acid.

Those moms where from plants i selected prevoiusly and where grown in three different runs using House and Garden van der Zwaan full line (Mineral based line with some organic aditives.) They did not hermied even in the summer run where plants where exposed to +35 ºC and they did ripe better than her sisters with no showing hermaphroditism issues.

*Question 1: Does a plant (Nº1) wich have hermie tendencies do not show those tendencies due a previous pollination from a plant (Nº2) that hermied in the first weeks, so that plant (Nº1) dont need to reverse flowers for pollinate itself because she is already preggo?

After i grew the moms enough, i took clones and put them in my aero cloner with UC Roots, Hormex, Clonex, Plagron's Cal/Max and H&G PH+/ Osmosis stbil. (Yeah, its kinda stupid grow in organic for finishing cloning with hormones and shit, but this is the method that works perfect at the moment for me.)

Okay, 15 days before they completely rooted with a massive root system and i put them in Canna's Bio Terra Professional 7 litres pots under x2 400w MH and 1 400w Hps with B.A.C.s Funky Fungi in the soil Crimson + Red Clovers seeds for the Cover Crop, wich i think i put more than i had to. So much. ( So basically theres a lot of clovers in the pot, the pots takes a lot to dry the soil, the clovers are big and the soil is not exposed to to light so it takes time to evaporate (Stress nº1), also a big root system from the clover crop in small pots like 7 liters could be competing for food against the cannabis plant root system (stress nº2) so that is stressing the plant and they are showing hermie traits? )

Vegging them plus some clones my friend gave me, notice there are some Blueberry x Sour Diesel crosses and a Juanita la Lagrimosa x Cinderella 99, they where tested so many runs and a lot of different people have been running it and no one had hermaphroditic issues. I mean, he is a serious person and every clone he give me with hermie issues he tell me about it.

Okay so again Canna's Bio Rhizotonic, Bio Vega, B.A.C's Pro Active, Foliar Spray, Amino Complex, Final Soulution (Enzymes). Mycoterra's Kraken (Glomus Iranicum) and Quimera (Trichoderma Harzianum), Molasses and a Red + Crimson clovers cover crop on them. Canna Bio Terra Professional. and General Organic's Black Diamond Humic Acid

*I Feed in veg from R/O water mixed with tap water wich i let rest for a couple days with aireation stone till 200ppm and i dont put fertilizers over 400ppm. Feeding rotation like this -> (Feed with bases, Water, Feed Additives, Water, Water)

Working amazing for 15 days in veg and changd MH for HPS and dimmed the lights to 600watts and 12/12.

First week of preflowering/stretching i add some Canna's Bio Boost to the mix as the chart says... (A little, not that much. No over 400ppm.)

Okey, after a week i notice Sour Berry and Juanita99 from my friend are fucked up, leaves like clawns and like overfeed.

Juanita99 are the twins, the other ones different phenos of Sour Berry.



He told me they did not eat very much and they dont drink a lot. Okey but if i look closer leaf tips are not burn. (What does this mean?)



I continue in another post so i can post more pics.

Okey so.

Next days i still watering my babys, inoculate trichoderma only water, and the next watering only water 70ppm, they looking the same. Leaves like clawns but no burnt tip.

And suddenly i spotted what for me look like dicks in chicks.

This is the Juanita99 (The Sour berry did not shown any hermie issues, yet.)


Oh my... i was like BUD WTF DID YOU JUST GAVE ME? I'm starting to see brown pistils everywhere, burned and pollinated or am i crazy, my money, my effort... everything. My all time story because i didn't grown 100% sinsemilla yet since my first grow, this one was about it and haha no.

Okey so we where having a talk and we ended thinking that she was overfeed and thats why she herms. He was asking everybody about it, and no one that has been growing it had issues. So we suposed that due to the bacteria, mycorryza and the quality of the food, nutrients are so available and she gets more than she needs. (Because i feed all my plants equally, more than 14 different strains so some are way more sensitive or not, but all the 75 plants did not show any symptoms like clawed leafs) (?) But why tips are not burnt??

So, Day 21 flowering and i was defoliating because needed some extra airflow and light penetration and i spotted some dicks in the plants that i previously selected and had no hermie issues with them.

Max/Min Temps (29ºC/18ªC) 26ºC Media this week.
Max/Min R/H (80%/40%) 55% media this week.

More Cowbell N.9: GSC Forum x 88'G-13/HP by Bodhi




Okey i know gsc its prone to hermie, but this one was very resistant compared to all my plants. Did not hermed before.

Disco Bisquits N.3 : Purple Dogshit x The Freeze by Pacific Northwest Roots.

I mean, they look healthy for me, a little bit need of N but, they dont look overfeed or shit?

This is the quantity of clover cover crop that is in each pot, the pic was taken when soil was dry so it looks a little fluffy.

Maybe root bound due to the quantity of clovers plus plant root system?

I dont believe the root system is that massive, like, 90% sure... But i'm not an expert.

As you can see there are some roots that are brown, maybe some clovers that has died and its starting to rot/descompose? I'm startng to think that it was a bad idea to put those clover seed in those small pots...

Okey so, i ended thinking about the possibilities of those issues and i would like to have your help or opinions if you have time.

I forgot to say i also use Atami B'cuzz Silica 1 time a week, i cant edit my posts.


A) Root Bound
B) Overfeed
C) Different plant trying to survive in the same space
D) Some stuff in the nutrients they don't accept very well. (I doubt it)
E) Switching to Plant based Organics in the plants I have been growing in Mineral based nuts previously. (I doubt it)
F) Temps? (I don't think so)
G) Bio Boost in the first week 12/12 (high P-K?) I don't know.
H) Genetics

All of this plus i don't know how to grow properly yet...

What should i do?

You think pulling out the clovers will help? Will roots from clovers start roting?
Root pruning and some new soil i think its not an option in day 21 as a guy told me, lol.
...

Any info you need just ask, i mean, the crop is basically lost becuse i think it has been partially pollinated, and summer is coming and, so if i cut everything and start growing new it will be worst i think due to the heat...
Just dont wan't get hermies again.

Regards and best vibes for all your grows.

J) I will take a microscope tomorrow for look at the roots. I got some fungus gnats, maybe there are some Root Aphids in it.

I didn't read much after Q1 in the first post. It needs asked in a manner that isn't so convoluted. I couldn't understand it.


But, to the thread title... [FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]Hermaphroditism, due to?[/FONT]

[FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]Hermaphrodite cannabis plants ALL test, genetically, as female.[/FONT]

https://phylos.bio/plant-sex-test said:

[FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]Does this test identify hermaphrodites? [/FONT]No. It is widely accepted that plants “flip” when exposed to environmental stresses, such as high temperatures, light leaks, and nutrient deficiencies. Always keep a close eye on your plants and keep plant stakes with your plants until flowering for quality control purposes.

Cannabis is a dioecious plant, meaning the male and female reproductive organs are on separate individual plants. Cannabis is unique in that female plants when stressed can develop functional male flowers. Because these flowers were generated on a female plant they do not posses the y-chromosome and as such do not contain all male specific DNA. Instead these hermaphrodite plants are simply pollinating a female flower with genetically female pollen. The Phylos Sex Test genetically differentiates male from female but is not able to identify if a plant will be a hermaphrodite or not as hermaphrodites are genetically female.

Click to expand...

[FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]
[/FONT][FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]Intersex expression is the result of hormone imbalances caused by stresses to a plant.[/FONT]

All to often polyhybrids can lean towards this and it's commonly not seen due to its ability of detachment from the plant in the lower branches which are almost always in low lighting ( this alone can trigger such with unstable plants. ) All to often novice growers never look closely and it happens with some lines no matter when least expected. You can sometimes find it in second runs every now and then with proven plants, but oftentimes that first run with a few male flowers won't show stray male flowers with another run, unless severely stressed. Even if it its good on a second run it can't deemed as stable. No such thing as semi-stable..

MJPassion said:

I didn't read much after Q1 in the first post. It needs asked in a manner that isn't so convoluted. I couldn't understand it.


But, to the thread title... [FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]Hermaphroditism, due to?[/FONT]

[FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]Hermaphrodite cannabis plants ALL test, genetically, as female.[/FONT]

[FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]
[/FONT][FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]Intersex expression is the result of hormone imbalances caused by stresses to a plant.[/FONT]

Click to expand...

Hi, thanks for the answer, sorry for that question, english is no my mother lenguage so sometimes my head collapses when writing it.

The question would be: Can a pregnant plant do some hermie flowers while pregnant?

Anyway, those seed even beign from female pollen would show hermie tendencies so...

Regards.

xxPeacePipexx said:

All to often polyhybrids can lean towards this and it's commonly not seen due to its ability of detachment from the plant in the lower branches which are almost always in low lighting ( this alone can trigger such with unstable plants. ) All to often novice growers never look closely and it happens with some lines no matter when least expected. You can sometimes find it in second runs every now and then with proven plants, but oftentimes that first run with a few male flowers won't show stray male flowers with another run, unless severely stressed. Even if it its good on a second run it can't deemed as stable. No such thing as semi-stable..

Click to expand...

Thaks for your time. So basically if i want to keep a plant with hermie tendencies i gotta grow her with the conditions that she did not get stressed before i guess. And all its descendancy will be X% hermie so it's not a good idea keep her for crossing. Of course there are no things such as Semi-stable. But in terms of progeny we gotta clean the higher number of hermies in a line for reduce the expression to the minimum.

Regards.

Definitely identify the stressors.

If you want to keep the genetics, you can make S1's and sort for stable versions of her. Reverse a cut using colloidal silver or STS. Use the pollen to make hundreds/thousands of seeds of her. Plant and stress flower the seeds, keep mums of the plants which do not hermie.

It's a looong process, but the end result will be much more stable versions of the clone you really like.

The more ethylene the genetics produce during flower, the lower the hermie expression will be. Hrmmm... is there a test for ethylene expression levels yet?

As others mentioned, STRESS and also genetics. Not too hot, not too cold, not too root bound, adequate light are all factors to consider. Good luck!

getting hermies is quite difficult id say, i had a random seedling go hermie straight away whilst others didnt want to grow at all

Hey guys! I just took some pics with the scope in some plants to the root system and I did not found any root aphids, I think its very healthy at the moment...

Douglas.Curtis said:

Definitely identify the stressors.

If you want to keep the genetics, you can make S1's and sort for stable versions of her. Reverse a cut using colloidal silver or STS. Use the pollen to make hundreds/thousands of seeds of her. Plant and stress flower the seeds, keep mums of the plants which do not hermie.

It's a looong process, but the end result will be much more stable versions of the clone you really like.

The more ethylene the genetics produce during flower, the lower the hermie expression will be. Hrmmm... is there a test for ethylene expression levels yet?

Click to expand...

Well I don't think its a good idea to spend time reversing a line that actually its hermie for find a clone closer to the mom but way stable. I mean, im just looking keepers for smoke myself, maybe in the future i want to do some crosses but definitevely won't use unestable stuff...

aridbud said:

As others mentioned, STRESS and also genetics. Not too hot, not too cold, not too root bound, adequate light are all factors to consider. Good luck!

Click to expand...

Yeah i mean, i work in a non-dialed room so in fact temp and humidity its a problem when summer is close. Also no A/C so... But defoliation helps. Anyway those plant did not show hermie issues with 38ºC

volur said:

getting hermies is quite difficult id say, i had a random seedling go hermie straight away whilst others didnt want to grow at all

Click to expand...

Dont you know the strain?

Regards.