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How do Aphria and Canopy Growth operate?

Maple_Flail

Well-known member
MPLE FLAIL actually "hash" is now available from 1 LP as Kief. edibles are coming but they needed more time to get it all figured out. extracts will come aswell, simply for the fact that if they want to get rid of black market they will have to.

using the term hash loosely here I see.. 'edibles' are available in oil form. it will be a LONG time before actual food products show up in LP, beverages will come first likely mainly/only cbd infused.

having the product alone available will not kill the black market. other factors are present.

Yes there was a mention a bunch of posts ago how many moonshiners do I know? personally none.. but that doesn't mean i've not met any, and logic dictates they still exist as every time I go on tour, someone always brings along a mason.. the stuff exists. someone is producing it and people are still buying. it may be rarer in certain areas, I can understand that.

It will take awhile to systematically get better or manage to push out the black market segment by segment to the point where they are almost a non entity. The only people I know that are actually willingly dealing with LP product are the ones that have an issue putting down a video game controller to look after themself so mail order makes sense to them. Ya legal market will make loads of money.. there will still be people waiting to get the stuff they are used too in the manner they are used too.
 

PaulieWaulie

Member
Veteran
Hey OP, since we are discussing your opportunity and how to seize it, you keep on mentioning your niche. Mind sharing exactly what it is that you want to bring to the table for the market?
 

cryptop

Active member
Interesting little quote in this article: https://mjbizdaily.com/how-india-can-become-a-global-cannabis-leader-qa-with-avnish-pandya/

I segregate the cannabis industry into two segments:

Those who want to do things big, fast and cheap. I don’t think India is the place for them.
Companies willing to work long term and work within the regulatory process.
For companies willing to work long term and within the regulatory process, there are definitely more than enough opportunities to do well in India.

We have received a lot of queries from the bigger Canadian companies, including Canopy and Tilray. But we spoke with the founders of those companies and we realized that their approach, their mentality and what they mention in Western philosophy, which is the hustle, that hustle might be too much for a place like India.
 

bigbadbiddy

Active member
That's the wrong mindset, almost antibusiness.

You want to coexist peacefully with billion dollar conglomerates that are jockeying for total control.

Beer is brought up a lot, but what happens there (big fish eating small fish) is what happens everywhere.

Order from any beneficial insect company the world over and you are likely to see 3 to 4 labels. While there are dozens of companies, most are retailers. Some had successful breeding and production programs, but as the small fish grew, it only became easier for the big fish to catch.

Of the 500 applications pending approval, 90% will fail, the others will be swallowed whole by a fish the likes they've never seen.

You are quite right Mikell and thanks for the reality check.

I just came back from there and even before I read your post, I have moved away from that line of thinking a little already.

But they are vulnerable, very much so and I can all but guarantee that they are misreading the market in Greece and things will not shake out the way they expect them to.

Bigger fish than them have tried and failed (in other sectors).
Big as they may be, they are still small timers compared to entities like Carrefour for example. And Carrefour fell flat on their belly and are all but gone. There are other big names that went similarly poor.

The country is .... different. Not necessarily in positive ways but in ways that afford opportunities for small timers like me and make things harder for these big entities than in countries like the US, Canada, Germany, etc. etc.

I have a plan but everything is still up in the air but there are opportunities and I have a chance. Because the country is unique and different, that I have just been reminded off from my short stay there.

But I still plan on occupying a niche and I am very convinced that they may try for total control all they want, they will not achieve it. Greece doesn't work that way, go ask Carrefour. They were able to eliminate the small mom&pop supermarkets in any country they decided to invest big in. They got chewed up and spit out in Greece and not for lack of money and trying. They were big as hell for a while. But they could not take the market share from the small mom and pop stores. Greece is different on so many levels.
 

bigbadbiddy

Active member
Hey OP, since we are discussing your opportunity and how to seize it, you keep on mentioning your niche. Mind sharing exactly what it is that you want to bring to the table for the market?

I am a little hesitant to be too open about my approach as everything is still up in the air and at the beginning and I don't want to give everything away.

But suffice it to say that I want to be the Wholefoods to their WalMart, just starting out a loooot smaller.

For the foreseeable future it will be medical only in Greece and imho the Canadian's approach conflicts with that as they aim for market saturation/dominance, fast and cheap, low price high volume etc. etc.

That is not what medicinal cannabis is about, this rings even more true if you know the country and culture.

I believe my approach of organic, high quality will be more in line with the culture and even without trying to bite anything out of their market share, it will afford me a niche that they won't be able to touch. Because they are definitely NOT aiming to fill that niche from the get go but I know it exists from the start. And if I occupy it, they would have to react to it and push me out of it if they want to take it over. Should be easy enough for such a huge entity with so much capital behind it. But I have identified mechanisms I am convinced will make it very hard all the way up to impossible to push me out of that niche unless I am willing to give up.

Greeks take home less than a grand a month on average and have no money for anything.
But they do spend 5 bucks for a cup of Cappucino at least once or twice a week because it is important to them to "be seen" and the like.
They are not the same as other western cultures in that "cheapest product with acceptable quality always wins out".
It's .... different.
The Canadians generally have a lack of understanding of Greek culture and the Greeks they work with have a lack of understanding of Canadian culture. Canada does not have a strong foothold in Greece. To illustrate: There is a huge Canadian mining conglomerate that has been trying to get rights for gold mining for ... decades now? By all means and accounts they should have had them long ago, they did the due dilligence, pumped in the money, fulfilled all contractual obligations etc. etc. but the people there do not want it and they have blocked it for a loooong time and there is no end in sight. I guarantee you this doesn't happen anywhere else on the globe in this manner. And I guarantee you the Canadians are frustrated to no end with this and are scratching their heads and trying their darndest to get this thing going but can't figure it out.

Also the medicine thing, how greeks buy medicine, the lack of prescription requirements etc. etc. all afford unique possibilities.

The government is also being taken advantage off by the Canadians because they are very inexperienced with the whole thing and have pushed it forward so fast due to necessity (crisis).
They lack personnel and knowledge on the subject matter.

I plan to share what I know with them and make it so that we play on the same team. I might end up working for the government in the end which of course changes everything even more drastically.

It's all too early to tell and I have nothing tangible to share so far only insights here and there and a picture forming in my head and confidence in my understanding of country, culture and the business side of things (where you guys are helping me out tremendously).

I will share with you all as soon as I am set up. I plan to do daily video logs and the like as I want to build a brand of quality over quantity organic cannabis for connoisseurs and lovers of the plant and its effects. And I am convinced that Greece will be one of the best spots on the globe to do so.

The end goal will be to make Greece a hub for cannabis cultivation (and processing) in Europe and create a global brand of Greek Cannabis being elite and one of the best available which would of course only happen if it can land on the US and Canadian markets as well. I plan to pursue these venues eventually, too.

Because I am that convinced that the country, soil, climate, everything speaks (imho) for ideal circumstances to produce the best possible Cannabis and its derivatives.


But I am getting ahead of myself. The opportunities are there but for now I want to start small, carve out my niche and produce the best cannabis possible and take it from there.
 

Maple_Flail

Well-known member
I am a little hesitant to be too open about my approach as everything is still up in the air and at the beginning and I don't want to give everything away.

But suffice it to say that I want to be the Wholefoods to their WalMart, just starting out a loooot smaller.

For the foreseeable future it will be medical only in Greece and imho the Canadian's approach conflicts with that as they aim for market saturation/dominance, fast and cheap, low price high volume etc. etc.

That is not what medicinal cannabis is about, this rings even more true if you know the country and culture.

I believe my approach of organic, high quality will be more in line with the culture and even without trying to bite anything out of their market share, it will afford me a niche that they won't be able to touch. Because they are definitely NOT aiming to fill that niche from the get go but I know it exists from the start. And if I occupy it, they would have to react to it and push me out of it if they want to take it over. Should be easy enough for such a huge entity with so much capital behind it. But I have identified mechanisms I am convinced will make it very hard all the way up to impossible to push me out of that niche unless I am willing to give up.

Greeks take home less than a grand a month on average and have no money for anything.
But they do spend 5 bucks for a cup of Cappucino at least once or twice a week because it is important to them to "be seen" and the like.
They are not the same as other western cultures in that "cheapest product with acceptable quality always wins out".
It's .... different.
The Canadians generally have a lack of understanding of Greek culture and the Greeks they work with have a lack of understanding of Canadian culture. Canada does not have a strong foothold in Greece. To illustrate: There is a huge Canadian mining conglomerate that has been trying to get rights for gold mining for ... decades now? By all means and accounts they should have had them long ago, they did the due dilligence, pumped in the money, fulfilled all contractual obligations etc. etc. but the people there do not want it and they have blocked it for a loooong time and there is no end in sight. I guarantee you this doesn't happen anywhere else on the globe in this manner. And I guarantee you the Canadians are frustrated to no end with this and are scratching their heads and trying their darndest to get this thing going but can't figure it out.

Also the medicine thing, how greeks buy medicine, the lack of prescription requirements etc. etc. all afford unique possibilities.

The government is also being taken advantage off by the Canadians because they are very inexperienced with the whole thing and have pushed it forward so fast due to necessity (crisis).
They lack personnel and knowledge on the subject matter.

I plan to share what I know with them and make it so that we play on the same team. I might end up working for the government in the end which of course changes everything even more drastically.

It's all too early to tell and I have nothing tangible to share so far only insights here and there and a picture forming in my head and confidence in my understanding of country, culture and the business side of things (where you guys are helping me out tremendously).

I will share with you all as soon as I am set up. I plan to do daily video logs and the like as I want to build a brand of quality over quantity organic cannabis for connoisseurs and lovers of the plant and its effects. And I am convinced that Greece will be one of the best spots on the globe to do so.

The end goal will be to make Greece a hub for cannabis cultivation (and processing) in Europe and create a global brand of Greek Cannabis being elite and one of the best available which would of course only happen if it can land on the US and Canadian markets as well. I plan to pursue these venues eventually, too.

Because I am that convinced that the country, soil, climate, everything speaks (imho) for ideal circumstances to produce the best possible Cannabis and its derivatives.


But I am getting ahead of myself. The opportunities are there but for now I want to start small, carve out my niche and produce the best cannabis possible and take it from there.

OK, so I was under the assumption that you were canadian, looking to set up something in Canada. Now that I see that you are not necessarily a bushy eye'd puffy tail pipe dreamist looking to make waves in canada as a tadpole. Some of what I said it more so irrelevant.

at quick glance at what is available in news, Greece's medicinal cannabis seems to be almost 2 decades behind canada's experience. (please do not take this as insult! it is not), we've been thru atleast 3 specific regulations to do with medical use, each noticeably different from the other.

In the beginning, patients were out for themselves once the government passed access exemptions, there was no support from the government. there was no conglomerate producers.

Conglomerate producers are only a thing of the past 4-6 years? and IIRC Tweed was the one that led the way.. it was a different company back then.

Looking at Greece, I don't really see any conglomerated producers as it seems the bill is still in legislature there (not sure what you call your governing body, no insult intended.) and I see the government setting out what appears atleast in brief news to be an attainable barrier to entry provided you can afford the land.

If the economy is as bad as you say in Greece, i'm not sure you have much to worry about from the canadian market. the LPS that export will likely target countries where they came in cheap at that countries price and due to exchange make a killing in canada. this doesn't sound possible if your country is in economic crisis.

with an acre of land, lots of hard work and the right staff helping i'm sure you can carve out your niche before conglomeration gets on top of it.

But as you say your culture does it different. you still have to worry about your cultures big fish. they might not exist now.. but they will.
 
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I think a lot of us thought you were talking about setting up in Canada. One thing to note about how things have gone in Canada is that most of the companies that got into medical cannabis, didn't do so to get into medical cannabis per se. They got into it to be in position for when the much larger legal recreational market opened up. Medical cannabis was the little fish, they all wanted the big fish. This has been the catalyst for the consolidation phase we have been going through. So keep an eye out for that as things unfold in Greece. Is legal medical the prelude to legal recreational there? Good luck in your venture, and bring quality organic medicine to people who need it.
 

Gmack

Member
No lp's are in the cannabis growing business they are in the stock selling business. If you're planning on being a craft grower you will be forced to sell only to a large lp and they will distribute it. Can you live with only getting $4-5 a gram? How much they will pay you will have a limit around there. So the liberal party of Canada and their minons are heavily and privately invested in lp's. The former cfo of the party (chuck rifici) happens to be the cofounder of tweed. Are you planing on growing here in Canada or another country where these lp's operate? No lp grows outdoors here. As for nutrients I don't see them shipping liquids maybe the dry salts if they can't be sourced in the other country. They hire master growers for just long enough to train the $15/hr employees the basics to growing then the master growers contracts aren't renewed. It's a total shitshow that will be very difficult for the small craft growers to survive in. Good luck
 

Gmack

Member
Ok just read your response to maple.. I'm not sure I understand how things work over in Greece. But anything you can do to make it unfavorable for Canadian lp's to sell in your country the better off you will be. They will make your life difficult if they get in there. Good news is their bud is garbage. I saw some a few weeks ago that looked nice. $17 per gram. Didn't look that nice to me. There will always be a demand for high quality well grown cannabis. How is your government purposing to sell cannabis? Will dispensarys be allowed? The way lp's operate here probably won't be how they operate over their. They only sell by mail order here because that's the only way they legally can. Lift.co is a good place to find out about what lp's are growing and read reviews from patients. But the info there is skewed as most reviews are positive and in real life most reviews are not so great.
 

Gmack

Member
Just read your response to maple. So much of what I posted doesn't apply to you. Do anything you can to keep lp's out of your country it will be for the best.
 

bigbadbiddy

Active member
I believe that the Canadian LPs are planning to produce but not necessarily sell much in Greece.
They already have agreements across several European countries, Germany included for example, to distribute Cannabis through pharmacies. They just want to profit from the ideal climate and low production costs that Greece affords and use it as a launching pad to flood all of Europe with cannabis.

In Greece it will also be done through pharmacies but you don't need a prescription like in other countries because ... Greece.
They can buy Xanax and all kinds of stuff without prescription there. Different ...
So I imagine something akin to dispensaries actually with the difference that they double as a regular pharmacy.

Anyway, my ace up my sleeve is that I have an in to the pharmacies (and pharmacists association that is currently debating what will be considered medicine and what extraction/processing forms will be accepted) and already have a few lined up that will sell my products, good locations/cities/markets too.
I am also convinced that I can offer more than the big guns and anyone else in the country in terms of genetics and understanding of cannabis as a plant, herb and medicine.

The laws are still in legislation but close to finished and I am in contact with the government to be one of the first to apply for and receive my license.


So while there is no way to keep the LPs out of Greece and Mikell is right, the whole "peacefully coexisting" thing is likely not going to happen, I have high hopes that I can carve out a niche and fly under their radar so to speak, ready to expand and fill the same niche in other European countries and maybe, hopefully, eventually Canada and the US.


You guys helped tremendously through this thread in understanding what the giant entity in the market place I want to enter will be like and how it will operate.
And it fills me with hope and a sense of opportunity, not dread and fear.


I am confident they will produce for the masses, low quality, low cost etc. and I will go the "craft way" and produce for connoisseurs and actually sick people who need high quality meds, not just get as high as possible for as little as possible. Aphria et al can service those people.
 

bigbadbiddy

Active member
OK, so I was under the assumption that you were canadian, looking to set up something in Canada. Now that I see that you are not necessarily a bushy eye'd puffy tail pipe dreamist looking to make waves in canada as a tadpole. Some of what I said it more so irrelevant.

at quick glance at what is available in news, Greece's medicinal cannabis seems to be almost 2 decades behind canada's experience. (please do not take this as insult! it is not), we've been thru atleast 3 specific regulations to do with medical use, each noticeably different from the other.

In the beginning, patients were out for themselves once the government passed access exemptions, there was no support from the government. there was no conglomerate producers.

Conglomerate producers are only a thing of the past 4-6 years? and IIRC Tweed was the one that led the way.. it was a different company back then.

Looking at Greece, I don't really see any conglomerated producers as it seems the bill is still in legislature there (not sure what you call your governing body, no insult intended.) and I see the government setting out what appears atleast in brief news to be an attainable barrier to entry provided you can afford the land.

If the economy is as bad as you say in Greece, i'm not sure you have much to worry about from the canadian market. the LPS that export will likely target countries where they came in cheap at that countries price and due to exchange make a killing in canada. this doesn't sound possible if your country is in economic crisis.

with an acre of land, lots of hard work and the right staff helping i'm sure you can carve out your niche before conglomeration gets on top of it.

But as you say your culture does it different. you still have to worry about your cultures big fish. they might not exist now.. but they will.

The conglomerate producers (Aphria and Canopy) will be there from the get go in Greece.

You are correct in your assessment that we are a couple decades behind BUT so is the rest of Europe (safe for the Netherlands and I guess Spain in a way).
And Greece is fast tracking the whole thing something fierce, due to their economic crisis. The thing they did right is recognize the opportunity this affords for the country to get out of the red and fast tracking things where Germany and the rest of Europe are moving ever so slowly, trying to figure out ways to make sure the "right" entities are the ones to profit from all this.

And this is what I see as my in.

Greece doesn't have any big fish in the cannabis sector because Cannabis prohibition was enforced there much more fiercely than elsewhere in Europe. I believe because they used to be very close with the Americans. Which is no longer the case. Also culturally speaking, hash was the most common form of consumption and it always came from Lebanon, Algeria, Turkey, Morocco, all countries and cultures that are not exactly favored in Greece.
Cannabis had a very bad rep over there.

The huge 180 the government did in such a short time is for one reason and one reason only: Foreign capital injection into an ailing economy.

Aphria and Canopy have pledged to invest close to a billion into Greece and that is why everything is being fast tracked. The one thing Greece is more desperate for than anything else is foreign capital, which is also why for decades the Russian Mob has been feasting in Greece. I am talking stores selling fur coats at beach fronts. You are correct, nobody in Greece buys fur coats.
But Russian Mobsters and their "ladies" do, when they visit to wash some of their money.
It's nasty to look at ....

So they regard the Canadian investors as a godsend I suppose and are not really seeing the dangers.
I am meeting with some government officials in the coming months and will present my point of view which will include what I have learned here. I don't plan to demonize the Canadians or anything but I do want to make them aware of potential pitfalls.
I am sure they were told that a whole industrial sector will grow out of this with employment for lots of people.

I will let them know that this will likely only be temporary and they will terminate all the well compensated employee contracts as soon as they trained cheap help (probably refugees) to do essentially the same and then simply not renew the contracts and only bring in people for harvest and other menial work at absolute dumping prices.

I will also inform them about their modus operandi which I am sure the Greek governing body has not yet grasped. That I have reasonable doubt that they plan to sell much of what they produce in Greece but elsewhere in Europe or the US/Canada. And that profits from these proceedings will likely not be finding their way back into Greece. They also haven't considered the nutrient situation, pesticides etc. I am fairly certain none of this will be produced or bought from Greece.

I don't think they should move into a standoffish position with the Canadians or anything but they should be aware of those things and not believe that they are coming to build a healthy industrial sector that is meant to stay and grow. It looks to me like it will be more in line to how hedge funds operate. Bleed dry and move on.

And they should be aware of this from the start so they can (potentially with my help) build something to counteract this.


I have seen it in the Netherlands where organic bud is being advertised and sold separately on the menus. No strain, nothing, just "outdoor bud" and suddenly its 2-5 bucks more expensive.

I imagine that Aphria and Canopy plan to do something similar with Greek Cannabis in the US and Canadian markets. Advertise it as top shelf import bud and bank on the novelty aspect. Basically you can run through the whole Diesel and OG Kush catalogue again, just slap import from Greece on it, market accordingly and charge healthy prices per gram (compared to the price level of regular bud which they already ruined lol).

I will be able to counter with actual top shelf product that has been produced organically and trust in people being open to pay a little more for it.

That's the idea roughly.
 

Quiet_Riot

Active member
Veteran
Bedrocan holds at least one solid strain which is the Jack Herrer cultivar they got their hands on from Sensi back in the 90ies or something.
So it figures that they have at least some decent genetics in their library.

I guess I have to wait and see how legislation shakes out and how discriminating it will be towards the little guy.

But the impression I get is that they are definitely leaving a niche to be filled by the right little guy.
Just have to wait and see if legislation will allow for that niche to exist or not ...

Bedrocan and Bediol are irratiated with gamma rays to kill off any unwanted stuff... Not entirely appetizing.
 

PaulieWaulie

Member
Veteran
Not to offend or upset, but there are over 60 or 70 LP's, some of these are 100% fully organic, others focus on quality over quantity, these companies need to differentiate somehow, else they can't all survive. One company is doing aquaponics and donates all the fish. Capital required is massive at this point, and there are many LP's that ran dry went bankrupt and assets got bought out. Like the 60 million greenhouse bought by Aurora for 7 Million. You need to be in production by the time its legalized, many of these companies have been working at this for years waiting for the day risking everything. Im sure there are thousands of quality growers waiting around, thinking the market will appreciate their skills in some niche when the time comes. Sorry I think this is delusional, if your not part of it now, the time has passed, if your comparing yourself to LPs like Canopy or Aurora One.


You guys need to remember, these companies found the best growers and hired them. They know how to grow good weed. It's just a matter of scaling up production. There is no reason quality has to go down when you scale up. 100% dialed in and controlled environments, purpose built will be unmatched by anything seen in the black market to date. Any strain that you or I can get, they can get as well btw.
 

Maple_Flail

Well-known member
The conglomerate producers (Aphria and Canopy) will be there from the get go in Greece.

You are correct in your assessment that we are a couple decades behind BUT so is the rest of Europe (safe for the Netherlands and I guess Spain in a way).
And Greece is fast tracking the whole thing something fierce, due to their economic crisis. The thing they did right is recognize the opportunity this affords for the country to get out of the red and fast tracking things where Germany and the rest of Europe are moving ever so slowly, trying to figure out ways to make sure the "right" entities are the ones to profit from all this.

And this is what I see as my in.

Greece doesn't have any big fish in the cannabis sector because Cannabis prohibition was enforced there much more fiercely than elsewhere in Europe. I believe because they used to be very close with the Americans. Which is no longer the case. Also culturally speaking, hash was the most common form of consumption and it always came from Lebanon, Algeria, Turkey, Morocco, all countries and cultures that are not exactly favored in Greece.
Cannabis had a very bad rep over there.

The huge 180 the government did in such a short time is for one reason and one reason only: Foreign capital injection into an ailing economy.

Aphria and Canopy have pledged to invest close to a billion into Greece and that is why everything is being fast tracked. The one thing Greece is more desperate for than anything else is foreign capital, which is also why for decades the Russian Mob has been feasting in Greece. I am talking stores selling fur coats at beach fronts. You are correct, nobody in Greece buys fur coats.
But Russian Mobsters and their "ladies" do, when they visit to wash some of their money.
It's nasty to look at ....

So they regard the Canadian investors as a godsend I suppose and are not really seeing the dangers.
I am meeting with some government officials in the coming months and will present my point of view which will include what I have learned here. I don't plan to demonize the Canadians or anything but I do want to make them aware of potential pitfalls.
I am sure they were told that a whole industrial sector will grow out of this with employment for lots of people.

I will let them know that this will likely only be temporary and they will terminate all the well compensated employee contracts as soon as they trained cheap help (probably refugees) to do essentially the same and then simply not renew the contracts and only bring in people for harvest and other menial work at absolute dumping prices.

I will also inform them about their modus operandi which I am sure the Greek governing body has not yet grasped. That I have reasonable doubt that they plan to sell much of what they produce in Greece but elsewhere in Europe or the US/Canada. And that profits from these proceedings will likely not be finding their way back into Greece. They also haven't considered the nutrient situation, pesticides etc. I am fairly certain none of this will be produced or bought from Greece.

I don't think they should move into a standoffish position with the Canadians or anything but they should be aware of those things and not believe that they are coming to build a healthy industrial sector that is meant to stay and grow. It looks to me like it will be more in line to how hedge funds operate. Bleed dry and move on.

And they should be aware of this from the start so they can (potentially with my help) build something to counteract this.


I have seen it in the Netherlands where organic bud is being advertised and sold separately on the menus. No strain, nothing, just "outdoor bud" and suddenly its 2-5 bucks more expensive.

I imagine that Aphria and Canopy plan to do something similar with Greek Cannabis in the US and Canadian markets. Advertise it as top shelf import bud and bank on the novelty aspect. Basically you can run through the whole Diesel and OG Kush catalogue again, just slap import from Greece on it, market accordingly and charge healthy prices per gram (compared to the price level of regular bud which they already ruined lol).

I will be able to counter with actual top shelf product that has been produced organically and trust in people being open to pay a little more for it.

That's the idea roughly.

Seeing as those companies are heavily invested into Canadian rec legalization. I doubt anyone but Canada and maybe Germany are getting those batches.

Greece would be a nice geographic location for centrality, as germany and some of the other contracts are much closer.

are they investing almost a billion in Canadian or almost a billion in Euro?

real estate is expensive here, space ain't cheap. If it is what i expect, they will make much profit and you are very right very little is coming back to greece outside employee wages and land taxes.

The thing you really really have to be worried about. These two entities are used to Canadian Bureaucracy, We have this thing called Lobbying. it is a Nasty dirty thing. but it works.. companies get their way. With their profit margins these 'lobbying' "incentives" will be hard to ignore without strong public and cultural opposition.

You come off as the type of 'patriot' that could get people to rally behind him with the right goals in mind. Might I suggest paying some time to that? get a small vocal movement going for greece pride and attempt to legislate things into effect that will help your country.

Canopy and Aphira will not care, their investors are canadians and americans. they are in it for the price point and logistics and chance to influence policy. (i.e. give themselves a monopoly like they did here)
 

Maple_Flail

Well-known member
Not to offend or upset, but there are over 60 or 70 LP's, some of these are 100% fully organic, others focus on quality over quantity, these companies need to differentiate somehow, else they can't all survive. One company is doing aquaponics and donates all the fish. Capital required is massive at this point, and there are many LP's that ran dry went bankrupt and assets got bought out. Like the 60 million greenhouse bought by Aurora for 7 Million. You need to be in production by the time its legalized, many of these companies have been working at this for years waiting for the day risking everything. Im sure there are thousands of quality growers waiting around, thinking the market will appreciate their skills in some niche when the time comes. Sorry I think this is delusional, if your not part of it now, the time has passed, if your comparing yourself to LPs like Canopy or Aurora One.


You guys need to remember, these companies found the best growers and hired them. They know how to grow good weed. It's just a matter of scaling up production. There is no reason quality has to go down when you scale up. 100% dialed in and controlled environments, purpose built will be unmatched by anything seen in the black market to date. Any strain that you or I can get, they can get as well btw.


no they dont... LMAO... Have you ever purchased from tweed or any of the other big time lps? (ie, tweed, broken coast, aphria, and weedmd)

all terps disappear within a day or two, it is already powder dry by the time it gets to you, you are always getting atleast 10%-15% weight as shake and stem at the bottom of the cannister.

out of the 11 strains I tried at Tweed. ONE burned clean. It was a snoop CBD strain.

they are currently struggling to product the quality the black market can produce on the regular. Not sure of your location, but here in the GTA LP gear is Low mids at best.

also, no they haven't found the best growers, there is plenty of proof all over the net of them trying to poach breeders and failing. They have local help and a day plan.
 

cryptop

Active member
Not to offend or upset, but there are over 60 or 70 LP's, some of these are 100% fully organic, others focus on quality over quantity, these companies need to differentiate somehow, else they can't all survive. One company is doing aquaponics and donates all the fish. Capital required is massive at this point, and there are many LP's that ran dry went bankrupt and assets got bought out. Like the 60 million greenhouse bought by Aurora for 7 Million. You need to be in production by the time its legalized, many of these companies have been working at this for years waiting for the day risking everything. Im sure there are thousands of quality growers waiting around, thinking the market will appreciate their skills in some niche when the time comes. Sorry I think this is delusional, if your not part of it now, the time has passed, if your comparing yourself to LPs like Canopy or Aurora One.


You guys need to remember, these companies found the best growers and hired them. They know how to grow good weed. It's just a matter of scaling up production. There is no reason quality has to go down when you scale up. 100% dialed in and controlled environments, purpose built will be unmatched by anything seen in the black market to date. Any strain that you or I can get, they can get as well btw.

You are giving them too much credit. While there are some great LP's out there (Whistler I particularly respect) the biggest ones are NOT in this to produce quality. Whenever they say "quality" they mean consistency. That's all those automated setups will get you. I have visited with multiple LP's and I am not exaggerating that some of our US hemp cultivators treat their flowers better than they do.

And the "best growers" they have hired are contracted consultants with their own cultivation companies, who have zero incentive to give these LP's 100% of their techniques and secrets. If the numbers work out, that's all that matters.
 

Gmack

Member
Not to offend or upset, but there are over 60 or 70 LP's, some of these are 100% fully organic, others focus on quality over quantity, these companies need to differentiate somehow, else they can't all survive. One company is doing aquaponics and donates all the fish. Capital required is massive at this point, and there are many LP's that ran dry went bankrupt and assets got bought out. Like the 60 million greenhouse bought by Aurora for 7 Million. You need to be in production by the time its legalized, many of these companies have been working at this for years waiting for the day risking everything. Im sure there are thousands of quality growers waiting around, thinking the market will appreciate their skills in some niche when the time comes. Sorry I think this is delusional, if your not part of it now, the time has passed, if your comparing yourself to LPs like Canopy or Aurora One.


You guys need to remember, these companies found the best growers and hired them. They know how to grow good weed. It's just a matter of scaling up production. There is no reason quality has to go down when you scale up. 100% dialed in and controlled environments, purpose built will be unmatched by anything seen in the black market to date. Any strain that you or I can get, they can get as well btw.
Your assertion that there is no reason quality has to go down when they scale up is 100% wrong! You don't have to believe me ask people who live in states where rec amd medical weed is legal. The medical stuff is great and the rec is mids at best. Not my opinion just the facts. Also saying lp's have the best growers is total bullshit. Name one grower working for a lp we should aspire to grow like. Can't you don't know Any of their names. Lp's hire master growers on contracts. Everything they do is filmed and then inexperienced growers copy them and the masters contracts aren't renewed. Show us this lp weed that's better then anything seen in the black market. Seriously show us. You can't.
 

Maple_Flail

Well-known member
Your assertion that there is no reason quality has to go down when they scale up is 100% wrong! You don't have to believe me ask people who live in states where rec amd medical weed is legal. The medical stuff is great and the rec is mids at best. Not my opinion just the facts. Also saying lp's have the best growers is total bullshit. Name one grower working for a lp we should aspire to grow like. Can't you don't know Any of their names. Lp's hire master growers on contracts. Everything they do is filmed and then inexperienced growers copy them and the masters contracts aren't renewed. Show us this lp weed that's better then anything seen in the black market. Seriously show us. You can't.

https://ca.linkedin.com/in/derek-pedro-2598a931

WeedMD master grower. ^

https://www.weedmd.com/meet-weedmd-team-nick-trueman-cultivation-manager/

Weedmd Cultivation manager, Previously Bedrocan headgrower prior to canopy corp acquisition.

Pedros got some clout, but he ain't international AFAIK, not tried any of his gear so can't comment.

You can get names if your enough of a knowledgeable pain in the ass... how do you think I was told the genetics of one of their trademarked(well the name is) pheno selection?

Bottom line. These guys aren't pros.. they haven't been underground (cept maybe pedro), and had to deal with that life. the staff supporting them also are not pros. They don't know what to hide and what to share.

not to aspire to be these guys.. just saying names are there.

also, weedmd Ghost train haze is pretty decent. it's one of the only things i've seen close to dispensary quality.. however stills pales in comparison to what someone like me or you guys could likely do with that type of plant.
 
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Gmack

Member
I'm impressed you found a few names! But their skills are shown in the bud. There is some good lp bud out there but it's horribly expensive and not upto the quality levels available on the black market. The real problem is scaling up. It's not that easy. Delta 9 has hundreds of grow pods to keep rooms as small as possible and guess what? Still they produce mids at best. The only reason lp's survive is because there are lots of medical patients who can't or don't want to grow themselves and think Los are the only legal option for them. legilzation is going to be a total shit show. People will buy the lp supplied bud and be put off from day one. Untill the craft growers are allowed to sell we won't see anything I'd want to smoke sold legally. Lp's will make it as hard for them to survive as possible.
 

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