What's new
  • Happy Birthday ICMag! Been 20 years since Gypsy Nirvana created the forum! We are celebrating with a 4/20 Giveaway and by launching a new Patreon tier called "420club". You can read more here.
  • Important notice: ICMag's T.O.U. has been updated. Please review it here. For your convenience, it is also available in the main forum menu, under 'Quick Links"!

Environmental impact on the phenotype of a clone

Hi all,

I am not sure where this post/info should go, or what will come of this thread, but I have observed something that is interesting to horticulturalists/botanists.

The following are some pics of plants I have growing. The plants are all clones of a mother which is Ninja Turtle x (MK-Ultra-F1) #3. the Ninja Turtle is a local heirloom and I breed it with a male MK-Ultra-F1 which I had at the time I had the pure Ninja Turtle. Anyways, I cut these 12 clones a bit back, some are growing in a hydro tray, some in a closet scrog thing, some in soil upstairs under 1000HPS, and some started in a new room in the basement under a 400HPS. The soil plants at least were veged identically under cool white flouro's with solid ferts and FoxFarm plus some additives I use. They all initially started flowering at 12-14", the two in the closet scrog were topped and fimmed, but they are not relevant here.

The first set of plants started with 3.5 weeks of flowering in the basement 400HPS which had 55-60F nights and 65-70F days. The plants were frozen literally to 19F twice by my landlord, I am surprised they are alive!

Here are all 4 Ninja Turtles



Here are the individual plants from left to right









They all have really tight nodes for this strain and weird looking buds on them. The branches are very close to the stem and there are more 3 leaves than usual. This strain usually has only single bladed leaves.

Here are the two plants which were flowered upstairs under a 1000HPS. Their environment was 72-75F at night and 77-80F during the day. They were never exposed to any extreme weather as my main room is well taken care of. The basement room was an add on, which is now gone as I cannot trust the basement.



Here are the bottoms of these two plants, this is the normal structure of the Ninja Turtle plants.





The are kinda spindly, but they swell and pack on some weight of stinky incense type sativa smoke.

Here is the bottom of one of the plants that developed in the basement under much colder weather and exposed to such extremes.



This just goes to show the impact of even 3 weeks of environment on your plants. Even a clone of the same plant which was born and veged in the same conditions can look quite different.

The smell so far is similar, but it really isn't until another week that these ladies start to stink, I will post along the way as to how these develop and differ in growth, harvest, and smoke.

I also have some Sensi Star plants that suffered the basement but I have never grown them in soil before so I am not sure if this is much different than what they would have looked like. They do look a little more indica than before.

Here is the Sensi Star, this is a two topped plant, basically all of them look this way.



Here is a side shot of a different Sensi Star top.



Maybe the weird look of the Ninja Turtle plants is the plants way to show its indica even though it is a sativa. The Sensi is a deep indica so it may not be as affected by the cold weather and extreme temps.

I don't really know, but I find the difference in development of these plants interesting.

If anyone else has similar pics or results I would like to see them. Feel free to add to the post, it would be cool to have a lot of info on environmental impact on clones in real growers rooms.

Peace all
 

spurr

Active member
Veteran
I have some papers I have been meaning to upload about various environmental effects on cannabis, I will post them later this week as per your request.

:)
 
E

EverLast

Well...I've come to the same conclusion...after my buddy grew one of my clones...at his place it didn't grow like it used to do it....at the end it was completly different plant...aroma..taste..high. I'll have to dig up some pics and post them here. Thank U for this thread!
 

Microbeman

The Logical Gardener
ICMag Donor
Veteran
I just noticed this thread -duh-. Thank you. I wish I had photo-documented the 'apparent' inherited degredation of my race over time.
 
Wonder if this would be a good place to talk about Ceramic Metal Halides vs HPS? I now run dual spectrum because of this very subject.
 
D

draco

i have been running SD clones for five or six rounds... certainly there is more variation than i would have expected! i have been blaming it on an uneven mix of soil.
now that everything is in coco, it will be interesting to see if they look more like the clones they are...

thanks for this thread!
 
I have some new pics of these plants, some of them are done, at least those not frozen for a few hours. One of the plants that is most effected by the cold is having nutrient issues now. I am not sure if this is because of the experience the plant endured or my own fault.

Regardless, I will post some update photos later, they are sitting on my digital camera now, and I am at work, haha.

Peace all.
 
S

sm0k4

One thing I notice is the lighting is different in each room. It is well documented that different lighting results in different crops.

Take 10 clippings and place them all over the globe, I bet they will look and taste different in the different regions around the earth from the different intensities and spectra.

The cold probably really screwed them up, but I would bet the lighting changes account for a good bit also. Cold pretty much stops all growth. If the roots had a chance to freeze, forget it, might as well pick it now. Very little if any new growth will continue since it is in repair mode or dying.

Just my opinion. Looks like a few different conditions led to different plant behavior, which is expected. The DNA didn't change though.

Your final experiment should be to take a clipping from each of the plants and grow them all in the same conditions.
 
Hey everyone, thanks for the comments.

sm0k4, are you saying I should revert clones from the damaged and not damaged plants and try to grow those in ordinary conditions to see if there are any long term effects from the cold conditions? I think they are too far along to try and do that, maybe I could reveg a plant and try to grow them again that way, but I have only tried that once and did not have success.

Here are some pics of the plants currently.

picture.php


picture.php


I guess I did not get any clear shots last night, as this is all I have in the new folder... I will try and take some shots of these again and the non-frozen plants tonight. The undamaged plants are almost 7 weeks old which is about when the Ninja Turtle crosses finish, she is a fast girl. They look almost identical to the hydro versions that I have around, I am hoping that I can match the size with the soil, that is always one of my goals.

That is all for now, thanks for the comments and stopping by.

Peace
 
S

sm0k4

Hey everyone, thanks for the comments.

sm0k4, are you saying I should revert clones from the damaged and not damaged plants and try to grow those in ordinary conditions to see if there are any long term effects from the cold conditions? I think they are too far along to try and do that, maybe I could reveg a plant and try to grow them again that way, but I have only tried that once and did not have success.

Yeah, it would be a good experiment and I bet the clones would look just like the originals. I've rooted clippings from flowering plants before (just cant remember how far along mine were), it just takes longer. I used the lowest skinny branch I could find, with a light popcorn bud and some decent leaf structure. Cut the 4-6" tip off like any other clipping and after planting, the new growth comes right from the popcorn bud site.
 
Pics

Pics

Hey all,

Here are some current pics of the plants. I am harvesting one frozen plant which for whatever reason was terribly burned. I flushed the plant and now it is done at around 6.5 weeks instead of 7.5. I find this kinda weird and fast, also the plant is freakish looking compared to the others, even the frozen one. I am also harvesting two plants which were the basis of comparison here that were not frozen.

The first pics here are the plant which is being harvested.

picture.php

picture.php

picture.php


The main things that I noticed were:

1) less stretching when flowering was induced
2) less branching
3) tighter internodes where it did stretch
4) shorter branches where they did develop
5) more leaves
6) secondary leaves have shorter petioles
7) primary leaves have larger petioles
8) leaves with more leaflets
9) reduced harvest size
10) thicker stems

Whole plant to be harvested,
picture.php

top of the plant closeup,
picture.php

bottom of the plant.
picture.php


These are the physical traits I have noticed from the plants while growing them, I am very interested in how the smoke will compare between these plants.

Here are the two comparison plants which were not frozen and are also being harvested tomorrow.

whole plants,
picture.php

picture.php


I will try to snap some better shots tomorrow morning when I give these ladies the chop, for now, they are sitting in the middle of the room and kinda hard to get at.

Here are their tops closer up.

picture.php

picture.php


More on these ladies when they get the chop tomorrow.

Peace all.
 
Harvested Plants

Harvested Plants

Hi all,

I pulled 3 ladies from the flowering box before school today. There were the two unfrozen plants, then the most damaged/burned frozen plant.

First off, here is a pic of a hydro version of this plant.

picture.php


Next we have the two ordinary soil plants.

picture.php


Closeup of their bottom branching pattern.

picture.php

picture.php


Finally, a pic of all three plants taken this morning. I think the pic of the two ordinary plants with the affected plant on the far left says it all.

picture.php


That is all for now, I am interested to give harvest/smoke reports on these ladies in a week or so.

Peace all.
 
Trim Shots

Trim Shots

Hi all,

No smoke report yet, but I finally got off my but and did some trimming, here are some of the pics I got.

The first pics are of the frozen plant which burned to death. I looks surprisingly airy for how tight the nodes are compared to the other plants.

picture.php


The second shot here you can really see the difference in branch structure with all the leaves removed.

picture.php


Lastly I have a pic of the tops from the two non-frozen plants, I am really hoping this are as heavy as they look.

picture.php


That is all for now until I smoke some of these to compare how the phenotype changed in smoke and effect.

Peace all.
 

Buddle

Active member
Veteran
Looks nice Pez..The hydro ones look further along.I'm wonderingb by your screen name if you have grown Pez by Apothecary Seeds? I could never find any of there beans.Always wanted to try the Cherry Pez..sorry for hijack..Looking forward to the smoke reports..BL
 
Hi man,

I noticed the hydro was grown a little longer as well. I have 3 other soil girls that were frozen for a short period, they are going to be flowered up until zenith and maybe beyond.

I have never grown pez, the name is because of my appreciation of PEZ cand. I really like that you can get a new dispenser with a little candy for the same price as getting more candy.

Peace man.
 
Harvest Report

Harvest Report

The plants were finally dry yesterday, I may leave the jar open a bit today to be certain they are dry to my satisfaction.

The weights for the two ordinary plants is the same as the hydro plants I grew recently, they were around 35 grams. The frozen plant which was most affected by the cold temps only harvested 20-21grams which is somewhat disappointing. The plant definitely did not like the cold and the small size is probably due to the lack of branches and the airy structure of the buds.

I plan on taking shots of the buds and trichomes, but I have another thread with those, the link is below.

https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?p=4190004#post4190004

That is the normal soil plant, the frozen shots will be up later when I medicate again.

Peace all.
 

headband 707

Plant whisperer
Veteran
Yes enviromental factors play a key roll in development.. DJ Shorts speaks of this when he mentions bring Asian and Hawian strains out of their elements .. I know he is right about this .. peace out Headband707
 

Latest posts

Latest posts

Top