What's The Oldest Clone in Your Stable?

Ibechillin · Dec 8, 2018

Ive been trying to spread this around, perfect for this thread.

Natural high said:
As someone with a biological science background and 35+ years growing experience I think I can add further to the discussion.

I have been cloning multiple strains for over 25 years and have regularly taken clones from plants well into flowering. I have also maintained a Jack Herer cut since the early 2000's. In my experience I have never had any phenotypic change in my cuttings despite not keeping a mother plant and always starting with new cuttings each grow cycle.

The so called monster cropping response is simply because when a plant is in flower the internode length is extremely short (within the bud) and so there is many nodes available to re-sprout when the clone reverts back to a vegetative state. Taking cuttings off this plant (once it is fully back to the vegetative state) will not carry this morphology across - the cuttings are invariably identical to the original mother prior to flowering. There has been anecdotal reports over the years of cutting lines changing over time - losing vigour, potency etc. but there has never been any concrete evidence of this happening and I certainly haven't observed it.

TychoMonolyth · Dec 8, 2018

Ibechillin said:
Ive been trying to spread this around, perfect for this thread.

Natural high said:

As someone with a biological science background and 35+ years growing experience I think I can add further to the discussion.

I have been cloning multiple strains for over 25 years and have regularly taken clones from plants well into flowering. I have also maintained a Jack Herer cut since the early 2000's. In my experience I have never had any phenotypic change in my cuttings despite not keeping a mother plant and always starting with new cuttings each grow cycle.

The so called monster cropping response is simply because when a plant is in flower the internode length is extremely short (within the bud) and so there is many nodes available to re-sprout when the clone reverts back to a vegetative state. Taking cuttings off this plant (once it is fully back to the vegetative state) will not carry this morphology across - the cuttings are invariably identical to the original mother prior to flowering. There has been anecdotal reports over the years of cutting lines changing over time - losing vigour, potency etc. but there has never been any concrete evidence of this happening and I certainly haven't observed it.

Click to expand...

I think people who "notice or remember" the changes over time are thinking about Genetic Drift. There is NO genetic drift over time with clones.

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Most clones are not exposed to any stressors. But I'm very curious to know if clones *can be stressed into genetic change.

Change due to environmental factors do occur. For example, exposure to magnetic fields can increase germination and plant weight.
(Magnetic field effects on plant growth, development, and evolution)

I suspect extreme stressors can mutate the genetics. I've seen this first hand (I haven't cloned anything in my life) where the progeny of fem seed plants reverted to regular and expressed it's Thai lineage in a plant that should have been Indica dominant. They also reverted to continual flowering from 4 weeks to harvest much like Autoflower strains did when they were first developed. Two phenotypes emerged where 3/20 were single cola Indica dwarfs. This was a population of about 75 plants.

The seeds came from a NL Auto Indica drawf (stressed to the max) in the middle of 3 males (stressed to the max) from the same seed pack, that I let go until they were shooting blanks. 6 plants died from the shit they went through. The dwarf gave me 350 seeds. I planted those seeds and when I saw the strange growth, I let them some open pollinate which gave me 12k seeds. I'll plant another 100 females this year to see if the mutations are permanent in the females. I'm looking for a good location to do 50 males. I've sent seeds to the tropics where photo period plants don't get big at all to see how they'll do.

This ain't no normal NL auto.

Sativa pheno

Indica dwarf pheno was ready to pick at week 9 from seed.

Sativa phenos were packed tight like an Indica, and just kept growing and flowering.
Harvested end of September.

Guest · Dec 8, 2018

mr bluesky said:
Got a black domina Ortega pheno from
Pack of sensi seeds in 87 mate still has the seeds from that pack.

Only been growing in hydro for last 30 years it's been a commercial cut until I done it this year in organic soil
Soil really brings better flavours than the hydro lemon musky goodness hits hard

I get pic up when I get home

Thought sensi released black domina in 96. :tiphat:

Katsu · Dec 8, 2018

My 2001 Bubba Kush clone is still alive and well in many grow rooms all over the world.

Putembk · Dec 8, 2018

I have had Lucinda going since 2011. Got the clone from Cannarado. Breeder was Paco.
Cindy 99 x Willies Wonder. One of my all time favorites.....

skotty · Dec 8, 2018

ive got the

exodus cheese 80s/90s
bluez/liverz 80s/90s
amnesia core cut 80s/90s
chem91 skunkva early 90s?
cherry ak47 (debatable) 90s

im a fan of the skunks.. some of the best terps ive had have come from skunk being in their lineage...

mack 10 · Dec 8, 2018

im with skotty

mack 10 · Dec 8, 2018

mr bluesky said:
Got a black domina Ortega pheno from
Pack of sensi seeds in 87 mate still has the seeds from that pack.

Only been growing in hydro for last 30 years it's been a commercial cut until I done it this year in organic soil
Soil really brings better flavours than the hydro lemon musky goodness hits hard

I get pic up when I get home

youve been growing the same cut for 30 years
thats dedication

JohnnyChicago · Dec 9, 2018

My oldest clone is a male

recirculator · May 15, 2019

Any of these old clone mothers from fems? still providing clones with no intersex traits years later?

kumo_kuma · May 15, 2019

I'd guess the Ohio "G" would be the oldest. Her history is pretty murky, but it was old 10 years ago.

SeedySimon · May 15, 2019

The NLX, dating back to the early 2000's ... or maybe earlier?

While rooting one notices that it is quite and old lady and I usually give the clones an extra week of veg but in flower they are still kicking

I honestly don't understand why some clone shops change their mother plants every year and change the tried and tested genetics of their plant selection, probably just to save a few days on rooting.

beta · May 15, 2019

SeedySimon said:
I honestly don't understand why some clone shops change their mother plants every year and change the tried and tested genetics of their plant selection, probably just to save a few days on rooting.

Clones are clones. Refreshing your mom regularly doesn't change that. This is grow bro 'science' at its worst.

I wood · May 15, 2019

beta said:
Clones are clones. Refreshing your mom regularly doesn't change that. This is grow bro 'science' at its worst.

Yup, my favorite ( nebula x blueberry from Willyjack) is 21 years old and clones easier and faster than some of newer things I’m working with.

Iowa Grown · May 15, 2019

I have a 1 male + 2 female Colombian Gold landrace cuts, that were gifted to me in 1976, but they are all 1970 cuts. Then I have a 1971 Afghani landrace female cut that was also gifted to me from the same guy who gifted me the 1970 Colombian Gold landrace cuts. Anyhow... as for the Afghani landrace female cut, that came from "The Brotherhood of Eternal Love", supposedly one of the Afghanistan born Tohki brothers brought it over to the U.S. while working at the Afghanistan Consulate in late 1971, and then one of them gifted it to someone in "The Brotherhood of Eternal Love" in early 1972, and it was gifted to many people before that group was disbanded because of a major drug bust.... and I have been repeatedly told that the first Northern Lights plant was a offspring of that Afghani landrace female cut, and that same Afghani landrace female cut had something to do with the original Bubble Gum, as I understand it, the original Northern Lights came from a cross between that Afghani landrace female cut and a male Thai landrace cut and the original Bubble Gum came from that same Afghani landrace female cut crossed with a male Colombian Gold landrace cut. I also have lots of other 70(s) cuts, like the original Bubble Gum before it was sadly crossed in New England because they didn't have the original male any longer, which I still have, Lambs Breath, and Panama Red just to name a few.

SeedySimon · May 15, 2019

beta said:
Clones are clones. Refreshing your mom regularly doesn't change that. This is grow bro 'science' at its worst.

Clones are clones, exactly my opinion.

Was not talking about refreshing though, but about changing the mother plant in the sense of selecting a new one from seeds. Which is what some clone shop owner told me they were doing about every year, because he claimed the genetics were losing vitality. Which is obviously nonsense.

kumo_kuma · May 16, 2019

Iowa Grown said:
I have a 1 male + 2 female Colombian Gold landrace cuts, that were gifted to me in 1976, but they are all 1970 cuts. Then I have a 1971 Afghani landrace female cut that was also gifted to me from the same guy who gifted me the 1970 Colombian Gold landrace cuts. Anyhow... as for the Afghani landrace female cut, that came from "The Brotherhood of Eternal Love", supposedly one of the Afghanistan born Tohki brothers brought it over to the U.S. while working at the Afghanistan Consulate in late 1971, and then one of them gifted it to someone in "The Brotherhood of Eternal Love" in early 1972, and it was gifted to many people before that group was disbanded because of a major drug bust.... and I have been repeatedly told that the first Northern Lights plant was a offspring of that Afghani landrace female cut, and that same Afghani landrace female cut had something to do with the original Bubble Gum, as I understand it, the original Northern Lights came from a cross between that Afghani landrace female cut and a male Thai landrace cut and the original Bubble Gum came from that same Afghani landrace female cut crossed with a male Colombian Gold landrace cut. I also have lots of other 70(s) cuts, like the original Bubble Gum before it was sadly crossed in New England because they didn't have the original male any longer, which I still have, Lambs Breath, and Panama Red just to name a few.

Damn dude, that's a real legacy stable. I wonder if that's the Afghan they used to make the blue orca.

AgentPothead · May 16, 2019

And I felt special for keeping a plant alive for more than a year. Ya'll hardcore.

beta · May 16, 2019

Iowa Grown said:
I have a 1 male + 2 female Colombian Gold landrace cuts, that were gifted to me in 1976, but they are all 1970 cuts. Then I have a 1971 Afghani landrace female cut that was also gifted to me from the same guy who gifted me the 1970 Colombian Gold landrace cuts. Anyhow... as for the Afghani landrace female cut, that came from "The Brotherhood of Eternal Love", supposedly one of the Afghanistan born Tohki brothers brought it over to the U.S. while working at the Afghanistan Consulate in late 1971, and then one of them gifted it to someone in "The Brotherhood of Eternal Love" in early 1972, and it was gifted to many people before that group was disbanded because of a major drug bust.... and I have been repeatedly told that the first Northern Lights plant was a offspring of that Afghani landrace female cut, and that same Afghani landrace female cut had something to do with the original Bubble Gum, as I understand it, the original Northern Lights came from a cross between that Afghani landrace female cut and a male Thai landrace cut and the original Bubble Gum came from that same Afghani landrace female cut crossed with a male Colombian Gold landrace cut. I also have lots of other 70(s) cuts, like the original Bubble Gum before it was sadly crossed in New England because they didn't have the original male any longer, which I still have, Lambs Breath, and Panama Red just to name a few.

Lrus007 · May 16, 2019

my oldest is a hashplant i started from seed in 1982.
i learned to clone that year. it has never been reveged.
then i have a columbo gold from a seed i got mid 70's.
was about 1985 i found it and planted. lucked out was a girl.
the next year i found some indica seed i had one was a girl.
still have all 3 of them. all my strains are older i guess.
have those 3 and also shrom, apollo 11, blowbubble,
princess 75, mowie and chem d. still searching for old thai.
i had a great thai but in 1981 was ripped off of all plants.
Lrus007

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