Everybody a breeder ?

Welp I've been debating this topic for a while and said I'd make a thread to see others opinions on the subject

Lately it seems like everybody with enough brass or clones or enough Internet persona can be a breeder ..this is starting to annoy me somewhat ..I'm all for people making a hustle whatever ya reason be it MMJ or just wanting to out fire genetics out there ..but where do u draw the line ..how do u draw the line ?

What I see on alot of boards lately is people with 1-2 strains claiming there breeders or people that take clone only strains and smack whatever dad they can find and call it work done ...granted when u take to exceptional plants male and female combine them and produce something good without much work ..but what are the chances every cross will be great without doing "real work" backcross ,outcross ,whatever the work work is

I can't put all the blame on people trying to make a buck selling seeds cause to be honest who wouldn't ..it's the uneducated customer that will not really have to much background knowledge on what there getting ..but u can never get time,nutrients back ever again so growing half ass genetics only makes life more difficult ..being that alot more states are going legal there's ALOT of new smokers/ growers coming out the wood works everday ..

I remember b4 just trying to get legit kush in seed form was the big thing ..now u can find it everywhere ..here's my only gripe
Breeder puts out kush A+ kush B ..grower grows kush A+B crosses them puts out kush (abc) says hes a breeder now ..
My gripe is I COULD HAVE DONE THAT myself ..so why should I pay u top dollar for replicating something I can do myself ?
This u can see everywhere ..Originality seems to be fading when it comes to cannabis ..it's just whore out the hottest strain the moment

Another thing I see being done is the selling or hyping of strains not even made or released ..and people riding coat tails of breeders ..telling them everything is fire when nothing has been made its all talk ..it's like people become "star struck " over the Internet smh ..

In this bizzness it's best to let the beans(clones) do the talking ..
A strain like WIFI made all kinds of waves being almost a instant classic overnight ..strains like GSC was hyped till it made a tilde wave ..but this was due to rappers ,growers, etc talking about it ..I'm not knocking it at all but goes to show u diff in "hype" ..alot of it is just word of mouth and people wanna kno what the hype is about ..hence why every after all the CC drama his GSC cookies sold out ..people are curious and wanna be apart of something ..

I don't mean to offend anybody personally just expressing my views on the seed game as it stands

Didnt kno where to post this ..so mods can move it to wherever

Pre 98 Cookies is where it's at, believe it.

The difference between a breeder and a seed seller is that the breeder has a vision, a plan for the variety he's working with.
A breeder tries to make a variety better, adds traits that are missing or removes unwanted ones with the goal to create the (in his opinion) perfect variety.

The seed seller just crosses whatever he gets his hands on, basically the random combination of hype A x hype B with the only goal to produce seeds. Every 9 year old could do it.
The results are the stretchy, hermie prone, finicky, low yielding, leafy, floppy stemmed indicas that have only a single (resinous) or in rare cases even 2 desirable traits (colorful) which we see everywhere. Most of them are interchangeable, without distinct character and often paired with a high that one has to endure not to enjoy.

I don't get that so many people believe that is good cannabis.
The hype, the fanboys and the shills draw attention to that stuff, the n00bs buy it (seeds and finished product).
The seasoned grower looks for varieties with more than a single desirable trait.

you are opening a huge can of worms my friend. one that not very many people may want to see opened. me, i stay to myself. i am not a breeder, but i have bred. good luck with the shit storm that follows, and for the record, i do hope that you take what i gave you with an open heart as i am certainly not one to say that i bred those seeds. i am more of a facilitator. aloha bro.

Aren't you just saying what everyone already knows?
I am not talking down to you, but it's hardly a revealation....

I don't think many people would consider most pollen chuckers/ vendors as actual skilled 'breeders', but it is just a throw away label sometimes.
Not necessarily an accurate description.

TheFlyinHaWyn! said:

you are opening a huge can of worms my friend. one that not very many people may want to see opened. me, i stay to myself. i am not a breeder, but i have bred. good luck with the shit storm that follows, and for the record, i do hope that you take what i gave you with an open heart as i am certainly not one to say that i bred those seeds. i am more of a facilitator. aloha bro.

Click to expand...

HH your in a diff league u have some very desirable strains which u pass out freely ..with an open heart ..am I plan to keep that going ..improving or adding my own twist when the time comes ..I'm just waiting on the space ..free or not I don't wanna half ass project out there

As far as the can O worms they have to be opened to catch the fish
Don't bite if u don't like

blue green said:

Aren't you just saying what everyone already knows?
I am not talking down to you, but it's hardly a revealation....

I don't think many people would consider most pollen chuckers/ vendors as actual skilled 'breeders', but it is just a throw away label sometimes.
Not necessarily an accurate description.

Click to expand...

Maybe ur missing my message ..it not an attack on anyone ..it'a really aimed at the new grower / smoker that's gonna read this and think 2x b4 he just purchases seeds ..
Also I've noticed it's becoming more rampant by the day ..I kno a few of these seedbanks will defunct or basically throw away the label when there done ..but it will be to late by then ..u will have already spent ur money on the strain wasted light nutes time ..to find out the genetics are subpar ..

U ever heard the term "fake it till u make it" ..

@happy 7 ..spot on ..
breeder = has a direction
pollen chuckers=have a motive

I don't think there was any confusion, i know you aren't attacking anyone.

If any new grower has the common sense to read a thread like this, they would already be able to realise that most of the endless 'brands' are just hacks...

But, (my new word) whatevs lol

there is a lot of untested pollen chucking going on thats for sure. you have to be selective and do some research before ordering seeds.

Ya seems most people that own collectives have a seed brand too. That's the problem. Now im not saying all are the same but out of all the choices of shops you can buy bud, very few is top quality. In it for the money rather then the love of the plant. Work your line to an f3 or something, dam. I've made the mistake of buying hype. I don't even shop at a collective haha, y do i want a strain they "made"

I couldn't agree more! I'm not a big fan of most of the hyped strains and hybrids OGKs, Diesels, Chems, etc. Yes, they are often potent, look nice, and have good flavors. But, the cannabinoid profile does not suit my chemistry for extended periods of heavy smoking. Yet, they are still in demand, so call it what you will(hype, etc). It's funny, I was making concentrates for a friends dispensory from strains and hybrids I prefer to smoke on a daily basis. Most were not selling extremely fast, so the owner decided to relabel them OG "this" or "that". Suddenly they were sold out fast.

I enjoy a cannabinoid profiles that leaves me feeling like a better person, or better than I was in one way or another than before I smoked..or even those that elevate my mind for meditation, creativity, etc. Versus most of the hyped stuff, better suited for drug addicts.

I have alot of respect for the old school breeders. Always loved most of the classics from the 90's and even early 2000's. Such as, SSH, NL5xHz, SWT3, KM, ISS, BB, WW, etc. Really loved most things from the canadian guys, and some of the american and euro guys too..Such as Red, Steve, DJ, Federation guys, and others.

It's unfortunate alot of those classics are not as popular, have been lost, has changed, or is just different/diluted than it was. It's also unfortunate most of those old guys can't stand forums, because of the way young people act today. Most of us old dudes have a descent amount of respect for people in general and were not raised on internet "banter" and reality TV.

Yes, it annoys me too sometimes..but, ultimately it has no real effect on me because I choose to do my own thing and not follow the hype too closely.

Hope you find what you're looking for. Thanks for your post silverhaze. It's refreshing to hear a similar mindset sometimes.

Rush - The Spirit Of Radio

All this machinery making modern music
Can still be open hearted
Not so coldly charted
It's really just a question of your honesty
yeah
Your honesty
One likes to believe in the freedom of music
But glittering prizes and endless compromises
Shatter the illusion of integrity

Click to expand...

change the word "music" with "breeding"

its still just a question of your honesty.
yeah
your honesty

silverhazefiend said:

HH your in a diff league u have some very desirable strains which u pass out freely ..with an open heart

Click to expand...

Yes he is, if this is the same DaFlyinHawaiian I used to know. Playing with some Molokai Frost x Strawberry Web and others atm.

Greyskull said:

Rush - The Spirit Of Radio



change the word "music" with "breeding"

its still just a question of your honesty.
yeah
your honesty

Click to expand...

Aahhhhhh..SWEEEET! THE ALMIGHTY RUSH!!!!!

Is the success of WiFi, really due to some rap turd singing about it.Or because it's a great strain?

I suppose that breeding consist in years of selection, a particular set of characteristic that are sought in the progeny, and a real interest in the conservation of the cannabis gene pool.
For me, being away from the states, is quite hard to understand the elite clone scene, I can't even think not to share a good genetic, it perplex me the constant bickering around the ones that even use this elites to make seeds (for me a natural step, a seedline is a must if conserving the fine characteristics of the chosen individuals).
Is like that a select few got the "permission" to breed with certains cuts, and if this person don't offer libations to the "pantheon of growers" they are instantly excommunicated and the genetic make up of their strains are put in doubt.
But no one flush when a mere 10 seeds are hitting the €100 barrier... it seems that greed is justified in a select group also...
A great numbers of elites clones are just generated by chance or is just a good old bagseed, nevertheless they are priced as it were made from precious stones.
As many had said before, cannabis is operating as a business with all the prejudices that it brings.
Is hard to consider a breeder if their catalog is all feminized, full of auto or hyped clones with 0 load of selection for certain traits. And if they prices are abrasive... well, you are just accumulating profits not breeding.

cash money $ $ rules everything around me ... (wu tang off)

first of all, it's a black market still, 2nd most folks love the plant but know shit about it (biology, genetics, chemistry, ...) hence they look up to folks who pretend to know all these things -> kaboom, jackpot and third most growers once they succeed in keeping a plant alive till harvest, start feeling as some botanical/drug kingpin gurus/know it all's ...

believe me folks, it's just the "main aspects"

i mean come on, if you want to grow a certain heirloom tomato are you gonna buy the seeds or clonez from a certified company/nursery operated by folks trained and educated in horticulture or some shady mofo who is educated in marketing/scamming/drug hustling???

blessss

Stupid people drive the demand for stupid things.
Business as usual. ;P

If one bought something that's actually worthwhile growing, more often than not, it turned out that way not because of the 'breeder's effort' but in spite of it.

Yeah I am getting tired of it as well. Buying a pack of TGA seeds, and DNA seeds, crossing both together and posting around saying your working a line is all I see now... Perhaps some of these people need to stop and think further and ask themselves if strains (you can still currently buy) crossed together are even desireable for the consumer to begin with? These endeavors are should be no more than freebie projects at best.

I love to pollen chuck, but never for resale. If a buddy wants to try some its free. More than anything, I just want to provide my own seeds. Prices for genetics are insane, I just can't keep up with it all financially.

First of all, I would like to say, that mixed genetics is pretty much what you get these days...
Landraces are hard to come by, and most of us/you people, you never go out to collect some? So maybe, someone who has done that and created a stable line is the one who has a right to criticise?

Thats why we all buy very expensive seeds from others....

They are expensive, because someone went to Reunion or Afganistan, collected seeds, grew plenty, selected, grew again under strong lights, selected the best ones,did some more crossing and selecting and put them seed for you to buy...

Because, if you are to buy something that someone else has done the work for....you need some serious cash.

Then you go and complain that it's shitty weed? It might be, still....

Yes, there are some cowboys in trade, but it's still up to you.You can do your homework and find out what the genetics are and if the deeler has a good reputation.You shouldn't always wait ready things for you, whenever you bother to seedbank sites...

Yes it's allright to expect good seeds if you pay 100 £ for ten...
And that's on the other hand, to pay so much for anything...
There are some sellers who put 10 seeds and price is 475£.Then you must ask....are they really worth it?

I dont believe so, I personally wouldn't pay so much for any seed. Next question is, who is so fool.Alas, there are some so fools...And those poor souls think they have the cream of the crop...

But with your post, you blackmail people who buy seeds and enjoy of making their own seeds.They never intend to sell them, they just want to share, good genetics.
And I must say, many excellent crosses have come from homemades...
Some of them are now wordknown.

You ask where to draw lines.I think it's pretty simple.There are honest breeders, there are some gowboys, and there are plenty of good people who want to make seeds for themselves and friends...

my opinion has to do with one aspect of the community of growers at large and that's not enough networking.

tons of ppl could be selling cuts and rooted clones literally taking and negating the need of/the money from the breeders of current.

ppl are soo scared of talking to each other and meeting each other to trade cuts and clones that there is currently and always will be a demand for seeds and most ppl (specifically the growers that germinate quality seeds and don't bitch about getting males amongst female seeds) are going to do what they need to do in order to fill that need/demand

another thing that will always have hack breeders on the rise is all of this business about "security, security, security". be clear, im not saying that you have to shout from the rafters that you grow, but unless you are a commercial grower, there are ppl that you can network with, talk to about growing, and even setup situations or forums to at the very least trade cuts. when you involve money into the process that's when ppl get antsy and annoyed.

now with many states allowing some manner of limitations to cannabis instead of complete prohibition, your going to have, not only growers but even more "breeders" than ever before!!

there are many ways that all of this can be done and should be done for all our benefits and most of us know this to be true. how many of us spend how many hundreds if not thousands of dollars on seed stock? how many ppl have constantly started thread after thread about how this breeders seeds sucks? this breeders sells hermie stock? and so on/ so forth?

these days I try my best to get a baggie of some dank and ask these hoddrat/ghetto ass dealers if there are any seeds; of course you have to get past their moronic egos to ge tot them but once I get them then that's what I grow. my brothers first grow was with some mexi-brick/schwagg grown garbage seed BUT once he grew it out PROPERLY (key word here) its was some of the most fire shit he's had and it could have stood next to anything coming from more reputable places, he s his own worst critic so at no point is it an exaggeration especially since many of you guys have done the same damned thing!

seed prices too high? hack breeders coming out of the wood work? yeah its a fact and always will be. there are a myriad of reasons as to why this could be happening BUT IMO its mainly because of the community itself. you may have one or two cats that share their cuts or stock and that cool but there needs to be an expansion of this sort of thing. stop trying to look to breeders and the like to give you what you want and look towards each other.

ive said it on many other threads and i'll say it here, I plan to be going to as many events as my finances will allow me to and when I am there its to meet other growers plain and simple. we all have our government/given names but my grower name is FRIENDinDEED, its on most grow sites and forums that ive been able to hit and sign on to, so when you hear that name at an event then you know whats up. 6', 300+lbs, 2 distinct tats on both forearms, couple of piercings, bald/shaved head, beard, glasses. im looking for the "WE" in the grower community, nothing more, nothing less since I know its there.

hack breeders is an indication of a bigger problem that has a very many solutions