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Hollow Stems?

Jhhnn

Active member
Veteran
Of course if you google: large hollow stem cannabis

Then you will find a plethora of statements such as this:


Males that have large hollow main stems are sought out rather than males that are more pith-filled stems - the main reason are that large hollow stemmed males are better THC producers than other plants.

Cannabis culture has created its own mythologies.
 

Jhhnn

Active member
Veteran
Flushing, defoliating, etc.

I have no idea. Organic soil spares me all of the hydro stuff & I don't get nearly as deep into it as some people. I mess with the plants as little as possible, like to just let 'em grow & let the blumats water 'em. They reward us with more than enough for our purposes.
 
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ganjygav

I have no idea. Organic soil spares me all of the hydro stuff & I don't get nearly as deep into it as some people. I mess with the plants as little as possible, like to just let 'em grow & let the blumats water 'em. They reward us with more than enough for our purposes.

Yeah I've always grown in organic soil but I use biobizz so I'm a cheater.
I had brown spots once so I come looking advice on the forums and ended up changing my growing style. I started leaving my water out 24hrs. It may be good for some but not me. The ph of the water sat out gets really high.
So then I started using ph down acids because I was told I need to adjust ph in soil.
Anyway problems came with these changes I had made but I didn't realize they were the problem. I thought I was doing good stuff.

So I started looking for fixes for the new problems. Started using calmag and watering 3 x the volume I normally did to get run off. I stopped feeding every watering which caused fluctuating ph levels between waterings and made my plants get deficiencies.
Plants still suffered.
Anyway I thought last grow, screw this I'm going back to the way I first grew.
I dropped the ph meter, I only let my water sit for 12hrs, I water little with no run off and more often and I feed every watering.

Guess what? My plants this grow are the healthiest they've been in years.

There is some good information on forums but there's also a lot of stoner logic and false science.

Keep it simple and let them grow.
 

Dakine

Active member
Veteran
True that Cannabis Culture created A BUNCH of mythology/myths. BUT common sense usually will tell us if something is wrong or doesnt sound right lol. Its just that when you get these 1st time grow experts looking it up on google(since the internet is nothing but the truth), and on the 1st page of google its showing other 1st timers agreeing with them. They think theyre right and everyone else and the experienced growers are wrong.

Even after doing pretty extensive research on this "hollow stem" subject.. There isnt A definent answer to whether or not its strain related if it isnt nutrients related and/or age/maturity of the plant...

Im still "iffy" on this though. Only because many books/articles explaining about stems and the internal parts of the stem, are saying that the stems will become hollow later in maturity.

But idk about these other people saying that the more hollow a stem is. The more water and nutrients can be transferred throughout the plant.. Like seriously? This is basic plant knowledge, well should be if you call yourself A grower and are giving information out to other growers...

I also came up with my own conclusion based on some research and my own personal opinion and experience. So say Mature branches do become stiff,solid, and slightly hollow after A awhile or when it actually hits full maturity. Which im sure isnt hapenning in the 5months people usually have there plants till..

If your plant is healthy and getting most of or the main nutrients it needs to stay healthy at tip top shape. Wouldnt the cells grow, which would make the xylem and phloem walls increase in size to be able to provide the water and nutrients the plant will need since growing? Which I would think would actually fill in the stems that got slightly hollow from hitting maturity, if they actually got that noticeably hollow?

I still havent found any information anywhere that states water and nutrients are traveling through that hollow space in the stem lol.. But its amazing how many people ive come across online that think that..
 
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ganjygav

That's the trap I fell into. I came looking for information and took in everything I read and took it for gospel.
I got the information from threads in various growing forums and I didn't think twice about it. These people know what they're talking about I thought and I didn't know any different.
I followed advice and didn't argue because I didn't feel I could justify the argument. I didn't still don't give a lot of advice to other growers because I don't feel I have the answers.
I will comment on stuff with my experiences and I think that's all anybody can do unless they have some sort of botanical degree.

I'm not sure what to think about the hollow stems so I'm not going to because I don't need to.
I've seen plenty of Woody and hollow stems. I've never noticed any difference between the 2. My plants still grow lovely buds either way. I have to support all my plants late in flower no matter how the stem is.
When my plants have had issues and there has been plenty check my albums, the problems have effected all plants no matter the stem.
So I doubt a hollow stem means problems.
I have no clue if a solid or hollow allows more water and feed to travel. I don't need to know this information so I don't seek it.
Even if someone came a long with the answer it wouldn't matter to me because the hollow stems produce buds and that's what matters at the end of the day.
 

Dakine

Active member
Veteran
Haha I like you Ganjy, you speak the truth and I like that. Yes it would be fine if those growers who really didnt know the truth or answer said there opinion based off of personal experience. Thats what I do, but some of them are giving wrong information out and stating it as facts while backing it up by saying "A bunch of other growers said so" or something along those lines.

LOL I was about to tell you that I already stated what actually transfers water,nutrients, and sugars throughout the plant/stems in this thread.. I do think the main problem with A hollow stem is that the more hollow it is, the weaker it gets.. Which means the less chance of it being able to support its self in flower.. That means or most likely means that its also using energy and wasting precious energy that could be used for flowering on trying to make the stems stronger to support its self..
 
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ganjygav

Yup, I had an older grower I know explain to me once about the plants wasting energy supporting themselves. I showed him my plants when I first started growing and I never used to support them before this. He showed me signs the plant was stressed with the dark stems and the like.
So yeah I agree with that.

We can only talk about our own experience, what applies to me does not apply to everyone else's grows.
Some of the stuff I've read and tried that didn't work for me probably did work for someone else. There is no fix all solution.
You just gotta find ya own way.
But people shouldn't go around spreading information like its the Bible because like I say. It may work for them but it will most probably complicate things for others. Especially people like me who didn't know much (still don't) and come in search of advice.
 

Dakine

Active member
Veteran
Nutrients travel into the plant through the xylem. Look up where the xylem is suppose to be

Finally lol!! Someone who understands the very basics of Plant Information..

Xylem and Phloem are the Cell Walls that carry and transfer Water and Nutrients throughout the entire Plant.

Xylem and Phloem are what Fills the stems. Silica is one of the Main nutrients for Cell Growth. There is no readily available Silica in A Hydro set up, like the rocks and rock dust/Minerals in Soil.. No available silica for the Roots/Plant means poor Cell production/growth, which means the xylem and Phloem “CELL” Walls are going to be thin and weak.

That in turn is Creating A Hollow Stem which is SERIOUSLY A poor highway with bunches of Potholes that’s supposed to Transfer water and nutrients throughout the plant..
 

djonkoman

Active member
Veteran
yes, xylem and phloem are a plant's vascular system, but I don't think a hollow stem matters anything...

see this picture of what a stem looks like if you make a slide and look trough a microscope:
dicot-stem-1.jpg


see how the xylem/phloem bundles are arranged in a circle, around the middle, closer to the skin than the core of the stem?
so hollow pith or solid pith, that shouldn't matter for nutrient/water transport or sugartransport, since the phloem and xylem are not in the pith(the middle of the stem)
 
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djonkoman is absolutely right. The fact that the inner core is hollow or filled with pith in some stems and branches means nothing in terms of plant health, ability to uptake nutrients or potency. Weight for weight, a hollow stem is stronger than a solid stem, so it may be an advantage for plants for support when producing large flower clusters and seeds.
 
BORON

BORON

Hollow stems are caused when the plant does not have sufficient Ca, B and Si when it is building frame. This is most often seen in plants grown with salts.

All of the formulas on the market tend to emphasize N and K to excess cause it makes things that dark green color with really fast growth. Problem with that is the frame is not built properly

Jidoka said it. Hollow stems are a boron deficiency and that is not healthy. Period. On big plants, hollow stems = broken branches. Get the boron in the soil up to 2ppm and you will have no more hollow stems regardless of strain.
 

Rodehazrd

Well-known member
I grew a pack of candy kush. one pheno showed mg def veins darker and had a hollow stem and white leaf tips she was the sweetest and longest growing of the batch. I ran her clone and doubled the regular dose of microblast by EJ still had some dark veins and tips of leaves were still tipped in white not near as bad as the first run and no hollow stem.
So sometimes its the nutes making hollow stem for sure. didn't run her this time as I'm trying the bodhi gear and she's finicky I'm still looking for that easy grow knockout strain that likes my fish hydro.:tiphat:
 

G.O. Joe

Active member
Veteran
For me only a couple strains were notably hollow indoors, after switching to rockwool, coincidentally or not. A sign of fast climbing, long internodes, no sense of deficiency really - the feeling was genetics and fast growing from decent conditions. Not necessarily a sign of good breeding. Scary hollow - the many stems of the viney one could easily fold over without support, nearing the finish. Silica (Armor Si) doesn't prevent it, and I don't think Fasilitor would either, even though it also has boron. Different main nutes on different days, 3 or 4 kinds probably. Same regimen does not cause hollow stems with other strains.

Does adding boron stunt height? What will lock out boron? My calmag is tap water.

The hemp stalk is hollow, and in the best fiber-producing types the hollow space occupies at least one-half the diameter. The hollow space is widest, or the surrounding shell thinnest, about midway between the base and the top of the plant. The woody shell is thickened at each node, dividing the hollow space into a series of partly separated compartments. (Pl. XLI, fig. 4.) If the stalk is cut crosswise a layer of pith, or thin-walled tissue, is found next to the hollow center, and outside of this a layer of wood composed of hard, thick-walled cells. - Lyster Dewey 1913
 

Rodehazrd

Well-known member
G.O. Joe;824978 Does adding boron stunt height? What will lock out boron? My calmag is tap water. [I said:
The hemp stalk is hollow, and in the best fiber-producing types the hollow space occupies at least one-half the diameter. The hollow space is widest, or the surrounding shell thinnest, about midway between the base and the top of the plant. The woody shell is thickened at each node, dividing the hollow space into a series of partly separated compartments. (Pl. XLI, fig. 4.) If the stalk is cut crosswise a layer of pith, or thin-walled tissue, is found next to the hollow center, and outside of this a layer of wood composed of hard, thick-walled cells. - Lyster Dewey 1913[/I]
Check out Mulders chart on google
 

farmerlion

Microbial Repositories
Mentor
Veteran
Interesting read guy's. I have been growing for many year's and I've never had hollow stems. I have read that DJ Short prefers the hollow stemmed plants in his breeding projects. I believe he stated higher THC ratios as the reason. It's been a while since I read the article. There could be more to it?
I don't keep mother plants or take clones. I start each grow from seed and listen to what each plant is saying individually. I try to make the best environment for the group as a whole and feed according to the individual plants needs. Very good read, again thank you all.
Peace
 

Dropped Cat

Six Gummi Bears and Some Scotch
Veteran
This line was culled, but the hollow stem was an afterthought.

picture.php


The male from an open pollination, from stock circa 1979.

If the plants from this line were exceptional, then hollow stems be damned.

Boron, yup.
 

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