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What are the best African landraces?

thejact55

thejact55

Active member
cotienxanh said:
That malawi gold from rsc?

Any new update? Its is the real thing?
Thanks :tiphat:
Click to expand...

Its the real thing. You dont have to worry about rsc, they offer what they advertise. Its an afropips open pollination reproduction. Afropips was legit, a reproduction of probably some of the last remaining seeds.
 
thejact55

thejact55

Active member
Yes, it was a small scale repro.

How profitable would it be to have to spend 5,000 to 10,000 bucks a trip around the world to get seeds every time? With people expecting to buy them for 50 bucks or less a pack....while you got everyone else chucking pollen and using everyone elses clones and seeds, then selling em for 100 bucks plus a pack. I personally have no issue with the reproductions. Sure your gonna lose a little, or alot, of some expressions, but better than nothing. Id be curious how many people are sitting on viable afropips malawi seeds, or collected malawi seeds from a stable source of pure orgin, untainted? Id say not to many...
its more of a case of logistics, you cant expect him to drive on back to nepal, or lebanon every time his seeds get low. Mail from there maybe, but you dont always know what youre getting then, therefore reproduction seems the natural transition.
 
troutman

troutman

Seed Whore
Makes me laugh when people complain about small numbers of plants to make Landrace seeds
claiming some type of genetic issue(s). Meanwhile they are content growing modern day strains
which for the most part are derived from one single seed and more often than not from an unknown
source.

i.e bag seed.

If you want lots of variations use one or more Landraces to breed with and you'll have your wish.

That's what the real breeders do.
 
W

Water-

troutman said:
Makes me laugh when people complain about small numbers of plants to make Landrace seeds
claiming some type of genetic issue(s). Meanwhile they are content growing modern day strains
which for the most part are derived for one single seed and more often than not from an unknown
source.

i.e bag seed.

If you want lots of variations use one or more Landraces to breed with and you'll have your wish.

That's what the real breeders do.
Click to expand...

a lot of assumption there.
 
W

Water-

thejact55 said:
Yes, it was a small scale repro.

How profitable would it be to have to spend 5,000 to 10,000 bucks a trip around the world to get seeds every time? With people expecting to buy them for 50 bucks or less a pack....while you got everyone else chucking pollen and using everyone elses clones and seeds, then selling em for 100 bucks plus a pack. I personally have no issue with the reproductions. Sure your gonna lose a little, or alot, of some expressions, but better than nothing. Id be curious how many people are sitting on viable afropips malawi seeds, or collected malawi seeds from a stable source of pure orgin, untainted? Id say not to many...
its more of a case of logistics, you cant expect him to drive on back to nepal, or lebanon every time his seeds get low. Mail from there maybe, but you dont always know what youre getting then, therefore reproduction seems the natural transition.
Click to expand...

I agree.

I know all about spending 10,000s of dollars traveling looking for seeds.

there is no profit in it unless you are wealthy like arjan.



Im just saying that his buisness model seems to have changed.

.
 
thejact55

thejact55

Active member
Sorry if i came off harsh water. We are allies im sure. I just like to hear myself rant sometimes haha. Yes, his model has changed some, but the fact, well maybe not fact- but in my opinion, RSC is still the best source for buying the most pure "landrace" or "heirloom"....so i get defensive easily and often withouth provication.
 
ngakpa

ngakpa

Active member
Veteran
For the record,

Afghani No. 1 is based on six seeds sent back from Kabul in 1979

Any doubts, ask Mel Frank

The Afropips Malawi Gold is based on home grows Malawi Jim did in the UK, so was kept in pretty small populations for many years

The genetic diversity in even a reproduced landrace is off the charts vast

People fixating on the number of plants used in some repros need to deepen their understanding of genetics... there is an immense scope of genetic variation in these plants, including the repros. Any botanist could tell you that.

And you only need to grow them to see that.
 
W

Water-

People thinking that genetic bottlenecking is not important need to deepen their understanding of evolution.
The amount of males and females used is certainly important


how many of these have you grown out to see the diversity that you claim is so vast?

any pics?

any info at all?

How about the Congo?

any info ?
 
thejact55

thejact55

Active member
The comment has relativity to your concern with a small scale reproduction of the malawi.
Nobody questions affie #1.
Thats about it though.

Sam skunk has said it takes like 1000 ea males n females to make all genetics not bottlenecked, somewhere recently here...that means 99.9 percent of strains suffer from bottleneck over time.
 
Cvh

Cvh

Well-known member
Supermod
Water- said:
I know all about spending 10,000s of dollars traveling looking for seeds.
Click to expand...

troutman said:
What did you find out there? :)
Click to expand...

Water- said:
great herb

https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=59587&page=127
Click to expand...

Water- said:
Bulawa, Transkei, SA.

I met a guy walking around with a small dried branch to sell.
Found this seed in it.
2014

grown outdoor Hawaii 2018:
Click to expand...

Hi Water-, may I ask how many seeds you had collected into your seedhunting travel that you are referencing to?
From how many different fields in that specific region did you collect from? If from different fields, was it also from different valleys?

How many seeds did you use yourself for your reproductive work? Was it open pollination? Or haven't you done any reproductive work yet from your seedhunting trip in 2014 (or before that date)?

Or did you just score the single seeded branch of unknow genetic makeup from a guy you met into the street there and you then grew out a few singles in pots at your home as quoted above from your own reference?
 
W

Water-

Cvh said:
Hi Water-, may I ask how many seeds you had collected into your seedhunting travel that you are referencing to?
From how many different fields in that specific region did you collect from? If from different fields, was it also from different valleys?

How many seeds did you use yourself for your reproductive work? Was it open pollination? Or haven't you done any reproductive work yet from your seedhunting trip in 2014 (or before that date)?

Or did you just score the single seeded branch of unknow genetic makeup from a guy you met into the street there and you then grew out a few singles in pots at your home as quoted above from your own reference?
Click to expand...

.:comfort:

you can ask, but i wont be telling the you..
I dont care if you know anything about my past, Im not here to brag about where Ive been and what i have done.
nor am I interested in incriminating myself

maybe you should PM me.
for the last couple days you have been attempting to trigger me so why dont you just get what ever is bothering you off your mind.

I dont sell what I collect and never claimed to be a reproducer of anything.

If I was selling the seeds I would give the info to who ever I was asking money from.
 
ngakpa

ngakpa

Active member
Veteran
thejact55 said:
Sam skunk has said it takes like 1000 ea males n females to make all genetics not bottlenecked
Click to expand...

well, that's to ensure there's literally no evolution of the strain

whereas 'bottlenecking' implies something negative

it's important to understand how extremely broad the genetic base of any landrace strain is --- it's immense compared to modern hybrids

the fact a first-generation pure landrace strain has been open pollinated from a double-digit population is not relevant for the purposes of someone who wants to buy 5, 12, 25 or even 100 landrace seeds, which is what 99.99% of growers do

even in a small-scale repro the landrace will still be handsomely represented, with an immense scope of genetic variation

and for those determined to unconvinced by the facts, there are plenty of first-generation seeds around right now, from Afghanistan, Nepal and so on
 
I

I wood

Well-known member
Why try and absorb new information if you think you already know everything.

Water always flows down.
 
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