Mites in the rootzone

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MIway said:

3ma... Sorry to hear bout the situation... all the way around... esp the coppers.

My guess is that you have a few different critters and the likely source is the cuts you are bringing in and to a lesser degree the coir... my mites and springtails came from them... esp if using wet bags of anything. That could also be the source of the gnats... tho those can just fly in thru the door. Root aphids and springtails can also come in wet bags... th soil mites can come in moisture resistant eggs in compressed bales or bricks of both coir and soil. Root aphids are usually gifts from other growers tho. But that's where I'd be thinkin on where and what.

From ur pics though... I'd say it isn't a bug issue... you've got good lookin veg and early flower pics... aphids would hurt you earlier... and ud be able to pic em out. The gnat larvae isn't creating all that damage either... but do indeed gnaw on the roots like dank said... and black heads mean gnat larvae as poopy nailed. Soil mites just aren't doin it... even when they breed by the thousands. Bugs are a reasonable guess tho esp when considering the crop to crop to crop pattern...

I'd check ur runoff first like ptb suggested... will give you an indication if its what dank thought... ph... or high ppm's. It def looks to be a root zone issue effecting uptake. Your veg just looks too good... and the roots are white... don't see the bug issues. What's the feed regiment like?

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thanks. it was a heartbreaking and life changing experience. and an extra kick in the balls to be shaken down in a state where it is legal to grow...

my current feed regimen is house & garden just as on their feed chart but mixed a little weaker than they recommend.

ballplayer 2 said:

I could always squeak a decent veg out of my plants, though later in the daily veg light cycle some plants would experience some minor wilting that would be gone by the next morning. By three weeks into Flowering cycle things are just not progressing the way I know they should from experience. The flowers never really begin to "stack" the way they should. Plants pretty much quit using water in a normal fashion. Plants seem to be EXTREMELY light sensitive, to the point where I have to keep them nearly 3 feet from my air cooled 600 so the leaves dont burn up. My room has decent ventilation, and air cooled lights on separate systems. I get the burnt leaf tip and random necrotic patches. Other leaves stay competely green and look somewhat unaffected, but the plant itself has OBVIOUSLY lost vigor ad refuses to grow. Root structure is pretty much non-existant, even though it was gangbusters in veg. I dont even bother to harvest, the flowers are basically undeveloped/immature/tiny even after 8-10 weeks.

This has been impossibly frustrating and to some degree life shattering for me. My only recourse may be a move, but that would be at least 18-24 months into the future.

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ballplayer2 i really feel your pain. the above quotes really describe what i am going through. i didnt want to admit it but i have had this problem for like 2 years now. we are living the same nightmare. hopefully we can work together and find a way to beat these things!

Great post GeorgeSmiley.

To the OP. If you want to rid yourself of this problem, you must first identify it. Since there are bugs present I'd get a microscope with a camera and take some high quality detailed pics so you can be positive what they are. Till then you are just guessing, and spending lots of money on poisons that may or may not fix the problem. You can get a camera microscope at walmart and discover what you're dealing with today.

WishDoctor said:

That's classic root aphid damage in the pics of your plants
NOT GNATS!!!

you have a serious infestation
READ THE ROOT APHID THREAD!!!!

nothing more nothing else.

root aphids are not the same as outdoor aphids, not even the same bug
just because the term aphid is in the name

mm you need to study more

get imid now!!!

root aphids

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i have been through that thread front to back and tried almost everything i saw there except orthene. i always check it to see the latest on RAs....

GeorgeSmiley - great posts and pics. those look exactly like the bugs i have unfortunately.

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what an AMAZINGLY helpful thread - respect all the way around....for sure...

GO GO ICMAG!!


dank.Frank

Yeah... second that... esp Mr smiley! Cool shit... thank you...

so about the bulb mites...

sns203 is the only thing that works?

is there any real way to get rid of them at all?

what about sns217? or is that only for spider mites?

akari 5SC -- im looking at this product as well... another miticide...

are the bulb mites known to make webbing in the root zone?

webbing in the root zone? damn you got issues, never seen that b4

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cool thanks for the answer there.

i had some pretty major issues last year with a bug that i cannot 100% identify as a bulb mite.

wound up doing like you said. taking emergency clones; tossing plants; i started treating using organic methods and it has allowed me to get a few good harvests in but i do feel as though my yield is slightly lacking from what it should be.

i managed to get a single picture of the bug in question during this episode.



it was one of the only bugs i ever saw even after taking apart root-balls of every plant.

i felt like a crazy person chasing a bug i could never find, but the effects on the plants were easy to see. very frustrating.

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Michiganmmma, thanks again for starting this thread. I am going to be doing my best to try and take care of whatever bug I have. I'm honestly not sure if I have Root Aphids or Bulb Mites. I will be treating for both. I figure I will do my pesticide treatments early, then get beneficial mites and nematodes.

GeorgeSmiley, thank you for your input regarding root zone mites. The first thing that went through my mind when I saw these a couple years ago was, Oh no I have spidermites. Then I thought, why are they in the soil and NOT on the leaves.

At first glance what I am fighting looks very mite-like. The larger ones run around the rim of the pot when the container gets bumped or disturbed. These are big enough to be seen with the naked eye (I could count the legs when focusing on them long enough), and are reddish-brownish-clear if that makes any sense. They move pretty quickly, not fast spider fast, but a pretty good clip for their size.

The smaller mites I saw are white/clear and look like white paint fleck. They move very slowly, and are generally not able to be seen by the nake eye. If you did see them you would just think they were some random debris or dust on your containers. I was able to see them with the naked eye when I focused on the container with great intent, with my face nearly next to the container. BUT, ONLY because I was absolutely obsessive about bugs because I saw the larger reddish ones. If I had not been alerted by the bigger ones, I would have NEVER seen these very small ones. The small ones move VERY SLOWLY, at least 10-20x slower than the large ones. It would take them more than 1-2 minutes to go from the bottom of a 5 gallon container to the rim, perhaps even longer.

I have daylily and tiger lily plants in great numbers in my landscape, so it seems reasonable that I may be dealing with bulb mites. What I have looks identical to a mite of some sort, more than any picture of a root aphid I have ever seen. I had people convince me that I either had beneficial mites, or a type of wood mite common to terrariums (though I do not have any of those types of pets in the house).

So George what is my best plan of attack? I figured I would start anew from seed. Plant with Met 52 in my medium (I need to use it up anyhow), treat with Bayer Fruit and Citrus approximately 2-3 weeks into veg. Spray with Azatrol to deter any leaf dwelling pests. Water weekly with Worm Casting Tea infused with Capulator's beneficials. Introduce beneficial mites, and maybe nematodes(?) a week after Imid treatment. Use Botanigard and SNS 203 throughout flower (until say week 6 of a 9-10 week strain). Then try and clone and repeat. I do have Bud Factor X, which is supposed to be salicylic and chitosan, because it was recommended by people battlng root aphids.

Also, what kind of beneficial mites do you use? Is Hypoaspis Miles acceptable? A website I saw recommended Hypoaspis for Bulb Mites.

Thank you all for your help and knowledge, hopefully I may be able to get this show back on the track afterall.

BP2

Possibly relevant
http://www.apsnet.org/edcenter/advanced/topics/Pages/BiologicalControl.aspx

http://www.apsnet.org/edcenter/intropp/topics/Pages/OverviewOfPlantDiseases.aspx

i got my USB scope yesterday and got some pics and videos.

this is a 200X but it look like maybe i should have got a 400X to see these things a bit better...(still trying to figure this thing out)

check it out:


there are some videos below. the last one has gnat larvae next to the mites to show how small they are.
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so i am learning to use this microscope better now.....

i have more pics and some good videos i will post when they are finished uploading