T
Teddybrae
Hello.
"Amend" means to 'change' or 'correct'.
"Amendment" means 'alteration in' or 'addition too'.
So where one adds to a soil ... s/he has 'amended it'.
Cheers from the Land of Oz!
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Question about no-till
- Thread starter Predjee
- Start date
Hello.
"Amend" means to 'change' or 'correct'.
"Amendment" means 'alteration in' or 'addition too'.
So where one adds to a soil ... s/he has 'amended it'.
Cheers from the Land of Oz!
Thanks all of you! appreciate you guys helping me out understanding this concept.
I quickly read/scanned trough all the information you guys provided me. Altough forums are a great way to connect to people word wide, they are (at least to me) a huge pain in the ass to quickly look for information you need
Apart from that, i did some reading trough these topics but the following strikes me:
In most topics the topic starter starts of saying: i am going to explain no till gardening, or i am going to explain organic growing. But after the opening post, they dont really continue their explanation and the topic explodes into a subjective discussion on what the best 'recipe' is to start your soil with and what amendtments to add and wich not. I also read trough microbeman's website, wich gave a lot of insight about organic growing and micro organic life, but it did not explain what to do after a cycle
But none actually explains what to do after a cycle, this is still a huge mystery to me. It seems to me even that a lot of people are mixing up no till with reusing soil. Or are they the same and am i on the wrong end?
Let me explain what i mean.
Lets say for the ease of discussion is make a fresh start.
1: I buy fresh soil, 500L (aprox 120 USGAL) without nutriants in it.
2: I use any super soil recipe out there, let's say i use the one Dank Frank posted in his topic.
3: If i remember correct, Franks soil should be enough to last 1 cycle and i dont need to add any more nutrients, leaving my soil depleted after the cycle/run.
4: Now here comes the part i dont understand. After the cycle and depleting my super soil i have two options. (please correct me if i am wrong)
I can either REUSE my soil or no till my soil)
When i think of reusing, i would simply ditch the top layer of my soil, again add franks recipe (or any other that lingers on the forum) plus new soil to replace the 10/20% i ditched, mix it all together with mycorrhiza, let it sit for at least 2/3 weeks to create new micro organic life and replant.
But this means disturbing the soil, so it's not no-tilling.
OR
I leave the soil undisturbed and replant. But leaving the soil undisturbed means i still have my depleted soil to work with. Now i can layer my soil with a mulch, but that is not enough as stated early'er in this topic.
Now i understand it's annoying if people keep asking the same questions, but i read trough 100+ pages on this forum and still can't find the answer :') Like i said, all topics end in discussion about recipes to START your soil with. Or discussion on what amendments to add and what not. Or discussion about what the best organic tea is. Maybe 40ish pages later they continue on the opening post, but there are soooo many topics, i couldnt find it scanning trough them
But what at the end of the cycle? I cut my plants, pull out the root ball of the soil, and then what!?! If i want to do no-till, i cant touch the soil. So i cant add anything?! Surely i could take the amendments i used to create my soil with in the first place, and top dress my soil with it. But i dont think that is the correct way.
Btw, something else: I am thinking about making a bokashi bucket. The bokashi fluids i drain from that bucket, can that be accounted for organic tea? Is it the same? And does it alter NPK vallues? (eg is it a nutrient or an additive)
Thanks for all the help so far people, it is appreciated!
I quickly read/scanned trough all the information you guys provided me. Altough forums are a great way to connect to people word wide, they are (at least to me) a huge pain in the ass to quickly look for information you need
Apart from that, i did some reading trough these topics but the following strikes me:
In most topics the topic starter starts of saying: i am going to explain no till gardening, or i am going to explain organic growing. But after the opening post, they dont really continue their explanation and the topic explodes into a subjective discussion on what the best 'recipe' is to start your soil with and what amendtments to add and wich not. I also read trough microbeman's website, wich gave a lot of insight about organic growing and micro organic life, but it did not explain what to do after a cycle
But none actually explains what to do after a cycle, this is still a huge mystery to me. It seems to me even that a lot of people are mixing up no till with reusing soil. Or are they the same and am i on the wrong end?
Let me explain what i mean.
Lets say for the ease of discussion is make a fresh start.
1: I buy fresh soil, 500L (aprox 120 USGAL) without nutriants in it.
2: I use any super soil recipe out there, let's say i use the one Dank Frank posted in his topic.
3: If i remember correct, Franks soil should be enough to last 1 cycle and i dont need to add any more nutrients, leaving my soil depleted after the cycle/run.
4: Now here comes the part i dont understand. After the cycle and depleting my super soil i have two options. (please correct me if i am wrong)
I can either REUSE my soil or no till my soil)
When i think of reusing, i would simply ditch the top layer of my soil, again add franks recipe (or any other that lingers on the forum) plus new soil to replace the 10/20% i ditched, mix it all together with mycorrhiza, let it sit for at least 2/3 weeks to create new micro organic life and replant.
But this means disturbing the soil, so it's not no-tilling.
OR
I leave the soil undisturbed and replant. But leaving the soil undisturbed means i still have my depleted soil to work with. Now i can layer my soil with a mulch, but that is not enough as stated early'er in this topic.
Now i understand it's annoying if people keep asking the same questions, but i read trough 100+ pages on this forum and still can't find the answer :') Like i said, all topics end in discussion about recipes to START your soil with. Or discussion on what amendments to add and what not. Or discussion about what the best organic tea is. Maybe 40ish pages later they continue on the opening post, but there are soooo many topics, i couldnt find it scanning trough them
But what at the end of the cycle? I cut my plants, pull out the root ball of the soil, and then what!?! If i want to do no-till, i cant touch the soil. So i cant add anything?! Surely i could take the amendments i used to create my soil with in the first place, and top dress my soil with it. But i dont think that is the correct way.
Btw, something else: I am thinking about making a bokashi bucket. The bokashi fluids i drain from that bucket, can that be accounted for organic tea? Is it the same? And does it alter NPK vallues? (eg is it a nutrient or an additive)
Thanks for all the help so far people, it is appreciated!
Last edited:
That's where soil tests come in and you use the formulas I provided to decided how much to top dress for the next crop, regardless of what amendments you ultimately decide to use.
dank.Frank
dank.Frank
The closest word in Dutch would be 'Toevoegingen', you add to the soil. As Dank.Frank explained calling amending just fertilising (bemesten) doesn't entirely cover the subject.
If you don't have it already be sure to pick up a copy of the following books:
- True Living Organics: The Ultimate Guide to Growing All-Natural Marijuana Indoors by The Rev
- Teaming with Microbes by Jeff Lowenfells (and maybe also the 2 other books into the serie)
These books will give you a basic understanding what Organic growing is about. You'll understand then why you need to re-amend your soil after a cycle.
@CvH
I actually have the rev true living organics, but been a while since i read it. Let me check if there is a topic in it about no-till. But in my head re-amend means actually mixing it trough the soil, thus, disturbing the soil. Thus, not no-till but reusing.
Apparantly Frank also just replied, and from his answer i take it that top dressing with amendments actually IS enough, just as long as i just use the formula and test my soil before-hand.
I guess that answers my questions then
I actually have the rev true living organics, but been a while since i read it. Let me check if there is a topic in it about no-till. But in my head re-amend means actually mixing it trough the soil, thus, disturbing the soil. Thus, not no-till but reusing.
Apparantly Frank also just replied, and from his answer i take it that top dressing with amendments actually IS enough, just as long as i just use the formula and test my soil before-hand.
I guess that answers my questions then
@CvH
I actually have the rev true living organics, but been a while since i read it. Let me check if there is a topic in it about no-till. But in my head re-amend means actually mixing it trough the soil, thus, disturbing the soil. Thus, not no-till but reusing.
Apparantly Frank also just replied, and from his answer i take it that top dressing with amendments actually IS enough, just as long as i just use the formula and test my soil before-hand.
I guess that answers my questions then
Please don't rely on the information in the book by Rev. No offense to anyone but there are so many errors in that book that I had to put it down when I tried to read it.
It is unfortunate that the search function does not seem to be working. I did post a method of no-till quite a number of years ago which I would try to retrieve if I could but I can't find it.
I'll give you a quick break down now. We used bins similar in size to what you're using maybe some even smaller.
We Grew my own cultivar which finished in 49 days. We did our initial mix as I described but we use peat mixed with bottomland soil and other local ingredients.
After harvest we amended by top dressing with vermicompost, em, compost tea along with some fish fertilizer. We were in the practice of putting composting worms in for about 8 to 10 days which we would then trap out again and then we would plant however retrospectively I would have not had the rest. I would have just taken the Harvest and then immediately planted the new clones.
The reason for this is that living soil is also comprised of the plant and it keeps the microorganisms more active to have plants involved.
During growth we watered regularly using compost tea that we made from vermicompost and we applied fish hydrolysate. That's about it. If I were you I would try an experiment and see how it goes.
E m and compost tea work very well in tandem as yin and yang. When you don't have plants growing it's good to use EM. It clears up any toxins that are in the soil and helps to degrade crop residue quickly and compost tea is good to use when the plants are growing because it stimulates the microorganisms that are essential to cycling nutrients.
Sorry I forgot we also use some Botanical teas made from alfalfa meal kelp and molasses
http://www.soilminerals.com/Ideal_Soil_Main_Page.htm
This is a lot of information about soil mineraliztion and what you might consider looking for in soil levels. I personally don't agree with how much phosphorus is recommended and think that you could go with about quarter of the amount if you use mycorrhizae.
If you do a field soil test you could send it off for cannabis if you're in a legal state/country or just simply put mixed vegetables or mixed flowers and follow their recommendation per acre. If you get a soil test get them to do your bulk density as well, this is quite important as well as your cec to determine how much you need to add to your soil or blindly follow their recommendations which would, in most cases, be what you need to add to the top 6 inches of soil.
This is a lot of information about soil mineraliztion and what you might consider looking for in soil levels. I personally don't agree with how much phosphorus is recommended and think that you could go with about quarter of the amount if you use mycorrhizae.
If you do a field soil test you could send it off for cannabis if you're in a legal state/country or just simply put mixed vegetables or mixed flowers and follow their recommendation per acre. If you get a soil test get them to do your bulk density as well, this is quite important as well as your cec to determine how much you need to add to your soil or blindly follow their recommendations which would, in most cases, be what you need to add to the top 6 inches of soil.
