El Tigre's TINY BOX for reversing plants and pollen collection

El Tigre · Feb 22, 2020

Hi guys, it's been a while since i'm thinking about doing some pollen chunking with the automatics.
The unhealthy idea is mostly the result of the excellent work of Reiko X and Mr. Sparkle.
I was lurking at their stuff for a while and I told myself, why don't give a try with plant reversing with Colloidal silver.
I want to cross different autos for getting some seeds to experiment with.
I hope to receive some advice from more experienced users.
Now,I need to obtain some pollen and also a place for reversing plants and collecting it.
So I bought a plastic container and wired a socket inside, very simple stuff.
I want to put inside the box 2 small plants in 1L pots to revert with CS and flower.

El Tigre · Feb 22, 2020

Here are the specs:

ACTUAL BOX
Internal dimensions: 30x20x40(h)
Usable space: 30x20x25 (h)
Internal surface: 0.06 mq - 0,64 sqft
Light: 13w LED bulb (20,3 w/sqft)

POSSIBLE IMPROVEMENTS:
Small PC fan (making an hole in the box or just inside it)
Adapter for an additional bulb

I plan to run a single 13w LED bulb, without ventilation for now.
I made a 36 hours test and the parameters (T and RH) were on the range.
20,3 w/sqft is a little low, but the light will be very close to the plants.
Putting second bulb could rise temperature and reduce the already tiny space.

I want to check if is possible to flower small plants without any ventilation.
Obviously without aiming for an exceptional collection of pollen, a little bit is good for my purposes.

Do you think my plant could work? Any advice, suggestion or idea?

El Tigre · Feb 22, 2020

In the meantime i got the parts for the CS generator.
The output of the 12V transformer that i found is 1A.

Is it good for our purpose?
If Yes, how long do you suggest to run the generator? 12 hours? 24?

Chevy cHaze · Feb 22, 2020

Good stuff and I'm pulling up a chair! Small scale micro reversals are on my list once I have looked through some of the last unwanted pollination seeds hahaha

Have you already thought further about ventilation? Computer fan in the lid, holes around the bottom?

Cheers
CC

El Tigre · Feb 22, 2020

Chevy cHaze said:
Good stuff and I'm pulling up a chair! Small scale micro reversals are on my list once I have looked through some of the last unwanted pollination seeds hahaha

Have you already thought further about ventilation? Computer fan in the lid, holes around the bottom?

Cheers
CC

Hi Chevy, I'd like to give a try without any ventilation. Am I too optimistic?

If needed I'm thinking about making an hole on the bottom and putting a small PC fan pushing air inside. Being the top of the box not sealed this should permit a decent air exchange.

Sunshineinabag · Feb 22, 2020

id suggest some sort of ventiliation

Zomboy · Feb 22, 2020

Cool idea. Interested to see how this works out for you

imakandi · Feb 22, 2020

hello
tygre!
you suprise all time all day
nice

can i say 2 thing? sorry
1- ventilation, better air wind pull than push, if top open still better pull, i think
2- for seed grow inside flower, mayb need more lyght more photosyntth

thank to share
luck and visit again sure!
100%

Benny106 · Feb 22, 2020

If you used a clear box and filtered the ventilation you could just have this next to the girls.

blynx · Feb 23, 2020

Cool, looking forward to seeing how this turns out!

If you haven't seen it, JLP's thread 'Male Isolation Chamber' shows how you can add ventilation and filtering to keep pollen from spreading outside the box.

https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=46076

Crowmax · Feb 23, 2020

El Tigre said:
In the meantime i got the parts for the CS generator.
The output of the 12V transformer that i found is 1A.

Is it good for our purpose?
If Yes, how long do you suggest to run the generator? 12 hours? 24?
View Image

Hi Tigre
Transformer looks decent, could run 24/7 one or more fans.
Just be careful running it 24/7 since its -probably- cheap china transformer , keep an eye on it.

I use for the same purpose a transformer from my old TP-Link modem , powering 3 pc fans, running 24/7 without problems

Chevy cHaze · Feb 23, 2020

Hey Tigre,
I would strongly suggest some for of ventilation. With wet grow medium and plant transpiration, even if just a small plant, there will be too much humidity in that container otherwise.
How you do it is very secondary, as in this small of a compartment even just lifting the lid from time to time could work.
The tricky bit might be making holes for the ventilation without creating light breaches (as you will be reverse flowering, right?). Adn you'll need to make 110% sure none of that pollen gets out. If you spot it late there might already be enough in the air to get your ladies (in another room!) preggers!
My suggestion would be an intake fan blowing into the bucket and a self made mini carbon scrubber. But still be careful, that pollen will eventually get out somewhere hahaha
All the best, really looking forward to the show!

El Tigre · Feb 23, 2020

Thank you all for your enthusiasm and immediate participation! Excellent advice, I really appreciate.
Let's divide the matter into 2 parts:

BOX
All of you rightly recommend a ventilation system and the tip of Blynx and BeAn v.2.0 on the JLP method made me think.
I think i will do something like that with a small PC fan (80mm ?) and a filter.
The one used by JLP is a quality one, but it's quite expensive (after a quick search around 90 EUR!!).
I think I'll try to use something cheaper, this box will be in a different room from my tent.
No problem of light leaks because i want to reverse autos.
I found 2 old transformers, so if they work one of them will run the PC fan.

I could switch off ventilation during the very last days before collecting the pollen from the mature male flowers.
I am concerned about possible contamination, as Chevy recalled, but I will try to be as careful as possible.
It's a risk I have to take for the sake of experimentation LOL

What about light? I'd try to give a try to the single 13w buld and eventually add one more later.
My goal is a miserable production of pollen, so i don't think optimal conditions are needed..just the union minimum.

COLLOIDAL SILVER GENERATOR
I've connected the transformer to the alligators today for making a test.
After connecting everything with the electrodes in the water, well nothing happened.
Not even a small bubbling, I think i need to get a multimeter to be sure that transformer (from the garbage) is working properly.

Somebody can with experience has something to suggest about generation process?
I don't have any instrument for measure the PPM of the water so i'm not sure about duration.

El Tigre · Feb 23, 2020

I take back what I said, I reconnected the colloidal silver generator and it seems to work.
This is what the small bubbles near the electrode mean right?
I think I'll check in tomorrow morning before going to work and if I'm not happy again after work.
I prefer to overdo it for this test, so I'm sure everything is working fine.

El Tigre · Feb 24, 2020

COLLOIDAL SILVER TEST RUN

COLLOIDAL SILVER TEST RUN

My first attempt to generate CS was quite a mess.
I had run the generator too long and the water I've used probably was not pure enough (or at least i think).
After couple of hours a weird dark deposit formed on one electrode, I cleaned it.

When i woke up this morning (generator was running 9 hours +/-) i found a dark liquid with a lot of silver suspended, one of the electrodes was reduced to an half!
I let it settle all day and most of the silver suspended is now on the bottom of the jar.
If i leave the liquid alone for more time, do you think that Colloidal silver is usable?

q3corn · Feb 24, 2020

Following! :joint:

brickweeder · Feb 24, 2020

I think you need to slow down your CS reaction by both lowering the voltage and current. If you have a 5v supply with <= 0.5A, that would be better (smaller particles and less buildup on the electrodes and water).

Also, are your electrodes fine or sterling silver? If sterling, switch to fine.

My CS is usually very light, yellow/amber-ish, definitely doesn't look muddy like yours. Try running your CS through a coffee filter into a clear jar, then shine a laser pointer through it to see if you can see the beam. The darker the beam, the higher the ppm. Too heavy of a beam may mean you need to dilute with RO/distilled water before applying.

When I make CS, I check it every few hours, clean the FS electrodes with 600 grit, then switch polarity and repeat until the beam is solidly discernible.

El Tigre · Feb 24, 2020

brickweeder said:
I think you need to slow down your CS reaction by both lowering the voltage and current. If you have a 5v supply with <= 0.5A, that would be better (smaller particles and less buildup on the electrodes and water).

Also, are your electrodes fine or sterling silver? If sterling, switch to fine.

My CS is usually very light, yellow/amber-ish, definitely doesn't look muddy like yours. Try running your CS through a coffee filter into a clear jar, then shine a laser pointer through it to see if you can see the beam. The darker the beam, the higher the ppm. Too heavy of a beam may mean you need to dilute with RO/distilled water before applying.

When I make CS, I check it every few hours, clean the FS electrodes with 600 grit, then switch polarity and repeat until the beam is solidly discernible.

Brickweeder! What a lot of useful information, thanks :tiphat:

If you don't mind could you tell me the Amperage you use and how long it generally take for making a fine CS?

brickweeder · Feb 24, 2020

El Tigre said:
...If you don't mind could you tell me the Amperage you use and how long it generally take for making a fine CS?

my power supply is 4.5V 300mA. I can't remember how long it takes...but its at least 6 hours. My first batch took a very long time. After that, I started my new batches with some CS from a previous batch added to the distilled water (for the new batch) to get better electron flow right off the bat, and that sped things up a lot. I don't time the process, I just go by how the laser beam looks passed through the CS, but I generally clean the electrodes between 3-6 times per batch if I remember or am not too lazy (I also look to see if the electrode has turned blackish...if so I sand and switch polarity...if not, I let it go longer). I will be switching to a bench power supply and will experiment with lower voltages and currents to try to get the particle sizes smaller on my next couple of batches. Not that it matters...I haven't had much luck with my CS in reversing (china yunnan, panama & destroyer) but have with STS. I think my CS might have been too mild or the particle sizes too large, so I'll give CS another go at reversing when I get a good batch made from lower V and I.

El Tigre · Feb 28, 2020

Hi guys, i opened a thread on the Marijuana Strains and Breeding sub forum and i got good advice about CS generating process.

Blynx suggested a Phenomenal's thread that is a good information source:
[FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=60610[/FONT]
I also found a cool thread from another forum, try to google and you find it: The Definitive Colloidal Silver Tutorial

To make it short i bought a DC with adjustable voltage,that exit at 600 mA and pure water from pharmacy. I will change electrodes every hour.
Still not sure how long should be the process, but i will try the laser trick.

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El Tigre's TINY BOX for reversing plants and pollen collection

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