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Very slow growth and dying leaves - Please help me save my grow

Latino-grower

New member
First I'd like to thanks everyone who took the time to read this thread.

So, here is my problem:

I'm growing a Somango and a Super Silver Haze since mid-April, but the growth has been remarkably slow since the beginning. Initially, the Somango was really stuck, then, when it was showing some signs of recovery, the SSH started showing some very abnormal growth, and when it became vigorous, the Somango displayed problems again, this time with leaves slowly necrosing and dying. The plants were alternating problems like that until recently, when they finnaly started to show some strenght and consistency.

All of a sudden, about one week ago, the situation turned: the growth of both plants virtually stopped and their lower leaves began necrosing and dying (the Somango never got rid of the problem, but it was improving a lot), only that this time the necrosis seems to be moving a lot faster - every time I open my grow the situation is worse and I see new affected leaves. If it continues like that I think both plants will die soon.

I'm growing in a wardrobe (about 1.7x0.8x0.5 meters HxLxW) with CFL lamps (160W), and using soil (50% perlite and 50% peat), in 7 liter fabric pots. The plants are receiving a weekly dose of Bio-Grow and Bio-Heaven, about 2.5 ml of each (initially it was 1.5 ml, though last week I lowered the dose again). They also received some Magnesium Sulphate, but I cease the application about two weeks ago. I wonder if the decrease of the ferts dose (and the cessation of the Magnesium Sulphate) is somewhat responsible for the plants getting worse, but I did that because the growth was already stopping and I thought that maybe the problem was overfertilization...

After the initial difficulties, I came to the conclusion that the PH of the water I was using with the plants may be causing the problem, so I bought a PH pen and, when I finally managed to use it (like 20 days ago - it took a long time to arrive), it was indicating 7.5! After correcting the PH of the water to 6.2 and flushing the plants, the initial response was satisfactory, but soon things became very ugly, and here I am. My last attempt of solving the problem was flushing the plants again 3 days ago, but it only seemed to accelerate the deterioration.

Some people will tell me to throw the plants away and startover because they're weak and will not develop in a satisfactory manner. Unfortunately, thats not an option now since those were my last two seeds and I will not be able to obtain more for some long time. Well, I think thats all. Thanks again and I will appreciate a lot any comments and suggestions!

Peace
 

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7 litre pots are too big for seedlings. I would carefully remove the plants from the large pots and get an idea how well the roots are doing. if the roots are under developed, re-pot them into an appropriate size container with fresh organic potting soil with about 10% perlite.
Let them dry out between watering.
No nutrients for the next 3 weeks.
Plants can't use much nutrients in low light.
Temperature, air flow and air exchange in a wardrobe can be tough.
What is the end game for these plants? Do yo have a light to flower or are they going outside?
Good luck
 

Guy Brush

Well-known member
ICMag Donor
Veteran
For me it's a typical peat look. I have tried a similar peat mix made by myself. What I have learned, such a simple peat mix isn't a good mix. Peat actually isn't good for plants in pure form or mixed with only perlite. It is low of nutrients and needs cal/mag to compensate it's acidic ph. So you would actually have to put fertilizers into the mix and dolomitic chalk. What I don’t understand is that you are reading an alkaline ph, while peat is actually sour. So there must be something wrong. Somebody said you should start again and he is right. Take clones of your plants and give them a ready-made soil mix from the garden center! Or at least try to re-plant them in better soil!
 
T

Teddybrae

Those leaves turning brown like that usually means wet feet ... somehow or other. which fits with Guy Brush saying it's the peat.


You can still transplant your plants. They are not too big yet. Lucky you put them in big pots cos you'll be able to get yr hands around them and gently remove them.


Review your growing process. Do things differently. Begin with your growing medium.


Hope you do well ...
 

Lester Beans

Frequent Flyer
Veteran
Transplant them into some proper soil and you should see improvement. It's either lack of nutrients and over or underwatered. I think if you need to save these get some good soil and transplant, then feed them well with pH between 6.5-6.8.
 

Latino-grower

New member
7 litre pots are too big for seedlings. I would carefully remove the plants from the large pots and get an idea how well the roots are doing. if the roots are under developed, re-pot them into an appropriate size container with fresh organic potting soil with about 10% perlite.
Let them dry out between watering.
No nutrients for the next 3 weeks.
Plants can't use much nutrients in low light.
Temperature, air flow and air exchange in a wardrobe can be tough.
What is the end game for these plants? Do yo have a light to flower or are they going outside?
Good luck

Thanks for the advices Ace! Do you think 4 liter pots will work well with them? As far as I know, exhaustion (e-11, 2800 RPM) and ventilation (clip-vent) are adequate for the area.

That's my 6th grow and I've always used those CFL lamps, though in the flowering stage I use to add another one, totalling 210W. This time I was planning to install an HPS lamp for flowering, but all those problems didn't allowed me to do it yet...

Guy Brush, Lester Beans and Teddybrae,

Thanks for the enlightening inputs!

I took a closer look at the soil and it actually seems very compact and bad. I used this mix with almost every plant I grew, always with great results, though it was always with Sunshine Mix peat (which has Vermiculite, as I just discovered).

This time, I used a mix made by a local store with 50% perlite and 50% Sphagnum peat from Letonya (according to the store that sold it to me, "the best peat available at the world market").

Regarding the PH, the alkaline I read is on my water, before going through the roots. After this, it actually goes down from 7.5 to 7.1.

Troutman

Unfortunately, I don't have the instruments to measure the humidity in the growroow. However, in my city, the humidity is currently at 60%.
 
Remove the soil around the root ball and see how large it is. Re-plant it in a quart pot if that seems large enough. Then Re-pot again when roots begin to fill the bottom of the new pot. It's called potting up.When you finally put them into the 7 liter, then Flip to 12/12. The goal is to let them build a massive healthy root system in new soil. if you are potting up every 3 weeks you on't need to add nutrients. Maybe replace the lamps or add as much light as you can without overheating. Growing in a wardrobe in the summer can be a bitch.
 

Latino-grower

New member
Remove the soil around the root ball and see how large it is. Re-plant it in a quart pot if that seems large enough. Then Re-pot again when roots begin to fill the bottom of the new pot. It's called potting up.When you finally put them into the 7 liter, then Flip to 12/12. The goal is to let them build a massive healthy root system in new soil. if you are potting up every 3 weeks you on't need to add nutrients. Maybe replace the lamps or add as much light as you can without overheating. Growing in a wardrobe in the summer can be a bitch.

Thanks for the instructions Ace! I will try this as soon as possible, just need to find a good soil. Excuse my ignorance, but how big is a quart pot in liters/gallons?

Troutman,

I already tried to regulate pH and it had little to no effect..
 
A quart is close to 1 liter. Available at a Home Depot as well as potting soil. Maybe replace the lamps Florescent lamps, although putting out light become useless for growing after extended use. Think about getting some Screw in LED lamps to bring down the heat.
 

Latino-grower

New member
A quart is close to 1 liter. Available at a Home Depot as well as potting soil. Maybe replace the lamps Florescent lamps, although putting out light become useless for growing after extended use. Think about getting some Screw in LED lamps to bring down the heat.

Great, thanks again Ace!

I only have access to peat moss, the regular soil sold here were I live is really bad. This time, though, I'll do the mix myself with Jiffy peat moss and perlite, and at a ratio of 70% perlite and 30% peat moss... Hope the roots like it.

Unfortunately, I'm already way over my budget, so I'll have to make do with those CFL lamps. Cheers!
 

TanzanianMagic

Well-known member
Veteran
I'm growing in a wardrobe (about 1.7x0.8x0.5 meters HxLxW) with CFL lamps (160W), and using soil (50% perlite and 50% peat), in 7 liter fabric pots. The plants are receiving a weekly dose of Bio-Grow and Bio-Heaven, about 2.5 ml of each (initially it was 1.5 ml, though last week I lowered the dose again). They also received some Magnesium Sulphate, but I cease the application about two weeks ago. I wonder if the decrease of the ferts dose (and the cessation of the Magnesium Sulphate) is somewhat responsible for the plants getting worse, but I did that because the growth was already stopping and I thought that maybe the problem was overfertilization...
Peace
Quick answer: yet it is.

Nice looking plants, which clearly have a mobile nutrient deficiency.

That's either magnesium or phosphorus (we can rule out nitrogen and potassium).

Because of their massive foliage, cannabis uses a lot of magnesium. Then, as soon as plants get to more than 7 nodes, it is possible for the first pre-flowers to show up, and the plant needs more phosphorus, so if it's already short on phosphorus and has used most of it up growing some roots, the plants will show phosphorus deficiency.

Just add magnesium sulphate or epsom salt, and give the plants some bloom food like Biobizz Bloom, which has a higher level of phosphorus. Don't feed anything else, because right now it will just build up in the soil.

The plants should be just fine.
 

Guy Brush

Well-known member
ICMag Donor
Veteran
Hey Latino, first of all we need to clear up what you are referring to when you say peat or peat moss because they are two different things and one time you say peat, the other time it's peat moss! Peat is a soil type which is taken from swamps. Peat moss is the actual plant which dies and sinks to the ground of the swamp and becomes peat. You should google a bit around these two words for yourself. 'Peat moss' and perlite alone cant be used as soil because they contain absolutely no nutrients. 'Peat' and perlite can be used alone but only for special plants like swamp plants, because they need this acidic type of soil with low nutrients. Cannabis doesn't like it! Your on a completely wrong way, and you dont listen!
 

Latino-grower

New member
Quick answer: yet it is.

Nice looking plants, which clearly have a mobile nutrient deficiency.

That's either magnesium or phosphorus (we can rule out nitrogen and potassium).

Because of their massive foliage, cannabis uses a lot of magnesium. Then, as soon as plants get to more than 7 nodes, it is possible for the first pre-flowers to show up, and the plant needs more phosphorus, so if it's already short on phosphorus and has used most of it up growing some roots, the plants will show phosphorus deficiency.

Just add magnesium sulphate or epsom salt, and give the plants some bloom food like Biobizz Bloom, which has a higher level of phosphorus. Don't feed anything else, because right now it will just build up in the soil.

The plants should be just fine.
TanzaniamMagic,

Thanks for the inputs! I actually ended up doing that and with good results - plants are finally showing some signs of recovery. I concluded that it was already to late to transplant them to a smaller pot, even tough they are probably with some roots issues too.

Guy Brush,

I'm referring to the peat moss soil (Sphagum). I'm not experient at all, but I've always used that kind of soil with good results (complementing with ferts, obviously). If there is a problem at the roots, it is caused either by (a) this specific peat moss I bought (I never used it before); (b) some mistake I may have made with the watering; or (c) growing the plants at 7-liter pots since the beggining. You can even grow cannabis only in perlite, as long that you apply the required fertilization.
 
Hey bro

There has been a bunch of post saying this and that.. ph, temperatures ext.

In the last pic there's a clip fan, under the canopy, blowing straight up.. what kind of air circulation are you getting in the rootzone?

I've always had/have hot air being sucked out. Air blowing on the canopy, is one thing... but what I see is a couple bugs, and air moving in the wrong direction:)
 

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