What deficiency is this?

hackjack402 · Feb 16, 2016

Hello guys.

Since 2 days the leaves started develop some deficiency I think. First day was just on the tips of some leaves, but now it's started to get on the new leaves also. I attached some pictures.

Thank you for your attention.

Naut.s.33 · Feb 16, 2016

It doesn't look to be that bad yet. There is a couple different deficiencies that effect the edge of the leaf like that. What fertilizers, medium, EC (ppm), Ph are you running? what is the watering per gallon size? Calcium I have noticed tend to show in the lower end to higher mid range of the plant. while Iron will be tend to show in the top new growth to higher mid range of the plant. This is just my experience. Anyway good luck with finding out. There are some good threads on here spacifically about deficiencies. I would give those a good looking at!

TheWizardKing · Feb 16, 2016

Looks over fed or over watered

Collembola · Feb 17, 2016

yes, it's a "deficiency" of being fed too much.

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you see in pic 1 > the big shiny dark leaf (that is a sign of too much food)

the newer leaves can not hold as much food so get burned.

next time you have the shiny dark leaves (over abundance of nutrients), you can know that you are giving them more food then they can tolerate (prior to the new leaves going yellow).

hackjack402 · Feb 17, 2016

Collembola said:
yes, it's a "deficiency" of being fed too much.

--------------

you see in pic 1 > the big shiny dark leaf (that is a sign of too much food)

the newer leaves can not hold as much food so get burned.

next time you have the shiny dark leaves (over abundance of nutrients), you can know that you are giving them more food then they can tolerate (prior to the new leaves going yellow).

Thank you for your reply, but I did not fed them with nutes so far, so I am guessing it's a K (Potassium) deficiency.

Oher suggestions? Thanks.

Naut.s.33 · Feb 17, 2016

Yea we have other suggestions, but you haven't given us shit for info other than this is a two day old problem. Playing off of what king and collembola said for example if you used homemade compost it could be too hot. But what do you except? We are not weed wizards, we need info if you really want help. Help us help you. Or go read some threads anout deficiencies

Collembola · Feb 17, 2016

OOps sorry,

i think it is just overfert, but potassium can be locked out by nitrogen (i think), but potassium usually should come on in the older leaves, slowly, not over a 2 day period.

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to me, it looks like burning;

but that doesn't make much sense if they were happy before,

also, with such a rich medium > there should be more then adequate pottasium in the soil (???) (pots that big should sustain the plant for AGES)

> you didn't pot up into strong soil recently did you ?

hackjack402 · Feb 17, 2016

Collembola said:
OOps sorry,

i think it is just overfert, but potassium can be locked out by nitrogen (i think), but potassium usually should come on in the older leaves, slowly, not over a 2 day period.

--------------

to me, it looks like burning;

but that doesn't make much sense if they were happy before,

also, with such a rich medium > there should be more then adequate pottasium in the soil (???) (pots that big should sustain the plant for AGES)

> you didn't pot up into strong soil recently did you ?

Here are some infos:

1.I am using this soil here since the begining of the seedling https://www.compo.com/international/products/Universal-Potting-Soil.html

2.The max temperature in the grow room it's 30 degree celsius, and humidity 35%-50%

3.I am using a 100W LED and 2 CFL ( 2 x 45W)

4.They were switched to flower yesterday 16.02.2016 (anyway problem occured the day before that)

5.The plant was transplanted to a 3 Litres Pot about 2.5 weeks (was in a small cup with same soil at point 1)

6.I watered only with tap water (when the top soil was about 1-2 inch dry - don't know the pH of water,maybe I should buy a pHmeter)

7.I let the water flow to the end of the pot and then wipe out the excess water until the pot plate was dry)

Hope that is enough info for you guys.

Thank you for your time.

ganjygav · Feb 17, 2016

I couldn't tell you what this problem is but I can tell you a ph meter is essential.
I was growing in soil without a ph meter because I was told I didn't need one.
Well I kept getting deficiencies, some grows it seemed I had symptoms of every deficiency going.
It climaxed with me chopping down all my plants one grow and throwing them out after 11 weeks of growing for them.
They were completely lost to lockouts.
My last grow I brought a ph pen and some ph down. I adjusted my water and feeds to around 6.5 ph every watering and I didn't see one problem the whole grow.

Naut.s.33 · Feb 17, 2016

I totally agree. I don't get how one could not have one if they are serious about growing. I mean I understand money constraints but I'm sure you could find a used one for cheap. I've grown a lot in soil and never needed to adjust my water. Only when heavy salt was introduced. An ec meter would also be helpful as your water source could contain a lot of iron or calcium ect that could cause these problems. Check and see if your city or w.e has water quality information listed somewhere to see what is in your water. They don't look too bad, I have had similar problems in dialed rooms and time and proper care always pulls them back. I would wait it out a little. You could have damaged some roots and being transplanted with watering them in could have hurt. Its hard to pinpoint when there are so mane variables. But if you have been successful before keep it up and we will see.

ganjygav · Feb 17, 2016

Yeah my tap water is full of calcium,I don't know exact ppms but I sent my water charts to another member because I can't make out what they mean anyway.
But yeah full of calcium.
I've not got an ec meter yet because I haven't found I need one yet. I'm sure the time will come but for now adjusting my ph is working. My tap water Sat out for 24hrs + goes to 8.0ph.
I know I don't need to add calcium but I add extra magnesium in the form of Epsom salt once in veg and once in flower. It seems to balance out the calcium.

B.C. · Feb 17, 2016

That's not much soil, are you sure it's not root bound again? If so boot it up asap.

If yer deficient in anything, use a -balanced- fertilizer like hydrolyzed fish, etc to correct the problem. A deficiency will cause a chain reaction of deficiencies because each depends on the next in order for it to be utilized, in one or another.

Also, if you have enough humus/compost/worm casting, 10-20% by volume it will buffer the soils ph. Once a plant is established the plant roots will dictate it's own ph. This is covered very well in the oganics forum if you doubt me or would jus like to learn more about it.

Let us know if yer plant is root bound....

BC

Collembola · Feb 18, 2016

i dunno, i am one of the ignorant "will never buy a ec pen" people, who fortunately has not have a ph related problem, in soil, (but many human error problems..)

---------

i would speculate, that, as the medium was obviously really rich already (re: overabundance of nitrogen in leaves), and nitrogen locks out potassium

> and the plants nutrient requirement changes needling less nitrogen in flowering, resulting in what you are seeing now ?

(i would give them a flush and then stick to not too much flowering specific nutrients (low N - rating).

imho

regards,

Collembola · Feb 18, 2016

also how can people suggest they are rootbound (???), add MORE fertilizer (????) when you can not even see the whole plant, only bits of ???????????

(and then obviously someone likes the comment (???))

this is the problem i think, less ec pens and more learning about plants.

(although i may be wrong, and am no botanist)

regards

hackjack402 · Feb 19, 2016

I come back with an update. The problem seems to aggravate and now the def appear on some of the new leaves also.

The fan leaves aren't affected almost at all.

I got a pH meter yesterday (water ph was 7.5 - 7.8 ) and I brought it down to 6.5 using vinegar.

I watered the plant two times with lot of water yesterday with ph 6.5 water (doesn't seems to respond bad to over water) and the girl is in flower for 3 days now.

I also added some nutrients in very small doses with NPK 3 - 0.4 - 6 , 2 days ago.

Maybe the problem it's lack of phosphorus? Anyway I grow in pre-fertilized soil from here https://www.compo.com/international/products/Universal-Potting-Soil.html , and I start fertilizing only 2 days ago.

If any other info is needed please let me know as I don't want to ruin my first grow.

Thanks to all.

Naut.s.33 · Feb 20, 2016

How long and how dry is the soil getting before you are watering now. It almost looks like over watering. I have something similar going on in my room. I moved them into the bloom room and watered them a little heavy. You could try spraying them with some simple fert or w.e you have sitting around. If it is over watering I've found that spraying is the best way to help them out other than just letting them dry out more between watering. For spraying I generally use 1/4 strength w/e I'm using depending on if said fert, or w/e isn't labeled for spraying. Could go even a little lighter if your are worried.

hackjack402 · Feb 22, 2016

Naut.s.33 said:
How long and how dry is the soil getting before you are watering now. It almost looks like over watering. I have something similar going on in my room. I moved them into the bloom room and watered them a little heavy. You could try spraying them with some simple fert or w.e you have sitting around. If it is over watering I've found that spraying is the best way to help them out other than just letting them dry out more between watering. For spraying I generally use 1/4 strength w/e I'm using depending on if said fert, or w/e isn't labeled for spraying. Could go even a little lighter if your are worried.

I'm pretty sure it's not over watering as I have good air circulation, and the plant is drinking 1L water / day, and it's never droopy.

I took your advice and spray (15%-20% strength) the leaves, and also feed some nutes (25% strength) with NPK 4-6-4. The plant is in flower for 1 week today.

I still think it's not helping, and I am not sure what to do anymore. Anyway here are some new pictures.

Any suggestions are welcome guys. Thank you for your time.

B.C. · Mar 14, 2016

Doh!

Doh!

Take the mylar off the floor! It's too bright on the under side of the leaves. I've done the same thing with soil covers made of mylar. They don't like it.

I know this thread is getting old now, but it may still help??

BC

JohnKimble · Mar 14, 2016

Try some calmag, 1ml per liter.( :deadhorse

: )

hackjack402 · Apr 1, 2016

Hey guys. The plant has recovered now and it's in flower for several weeks now.

I don't know what the problem was as I tried multiple things: PH, nutes, removed the unhealthy leaves...anyway it's fully recovered and it's looking great IMHO.

Here are some pictures:

What deficiency is this?

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