Super plants

CrushnYuba · Dec 17, 2018

So.. In all my years i have only seen a handfull of plants that grow like blue dream. Pale thin leaf sativa fast vigorous growth, that when it comes time to flower, completely fills in and puts out rock hard indica like buds. It's almost a super plant. But BD is so played out. I need something similar with a different terpine profile at least.
I have grown so many different strains and none of them have a similar expression. I have been waiting, and i never see this super plant expression. Im wondering if the reason why i haven't seen it its because everything i grow these days is a hybrid of a hybrid of a hybrid. Do you think these freak pheno types are only possible with a more true f1?

What lines have you seen super plants like this in? And to find another super plant like this, where should i look?

who dat is · Dec 17, 2018

Start breeding what you want to see using the Blue Dream mom you're speaking of? :dunno:

CrushnYuba · Dec 17, 2018

I have made a couple BD crosses. Not super worth while. I want pure Sativa growth, with huge chunky indica hard buds. Just different nose really. Different bag appeal. Basically a super yielder with a different flavor.
Any crosses i have made using bd, that inherited the growth traits i wanted, also inherrited identical looking and smelling flowers.

who dat is · Dec 17, 2018

CrushnYuba said:
I have made a couple BD crosses. Not super worth while. I want pure Sativa growth, with huge chunky indica hard buds. Just different nose really. Different bag appeal. Basically a super yielder with a different flavor.
Any crosses i have made using bd, that inherited the growth traits i wanted, also inherrited identical looking and smelling flowers.

Maybe look at some kind of male that likes to dominate in crosses? Deep Chunk is the first to come to mind...

Ibechillin · Dec 17, 2018

Blue Dream really showcases the potential of F1 hybrid exaggeration, Imho alot of its vigor comes from the Super Silver Haze Sativa heritage (another well known large/high yielder). The largest plants in nature are sativas, need that growth to dominate the cross and carry over the indica nugs.

ramse · Dec 17, 2018

MNS Critical Mass
you can find some killer plants... sativa structure and indica hard nug with heavy leaf to flower ratio

CrushnYuba · Dec 17, 2018

Is critical mass like that? I thought critical was more on the indica side. I don't really know anyone that grows critical mass. Not really a cali thing.
Does critical mass carry yield traits to hybrids

who dat is · Dec 17, 2018

I've seen critical mass before and I wasn't impressed but that also wasn't a well grown sample. :2cents:

3rd-3yed · Dec 17, 2018

CrushnYuba said:
So.. In all my years i have only seen a handfull of plants that grow like blue dream. Pale thin leaf sativa fast vigorous growth, that when it comes time to flower, completely fills in and puts out rock hard indica like buds. It's almost a super plant. But BD is so played out. I need something similar with a different terpine profile at least.
I have grown so many different strains and none of them have a similar expression. I have been waiting, and i never see this super plant expression. Im wondering if the reason why i haven't seen it its because everything i grow these days is a hybrid of a hybrid of a hybrid. Do you think these freak pheno types are only possible with a more true f1?

What lines have you seen super plants like this in? And to find another super plant like this, where should i look?

I've got the last pack of Johnny Blaze from Red (Legend seeds).

Hope to find a special blue and Hazy gem, then if it's good enough I'll make F2's :biggrin:

Good luck to find something similar that please you with those new school breeders.

Ibechillin · Dec 17, 2018

Have you tryed out any of Bodhi's crosses CrushnYuba?

therevverend · Dec 17, 2018

Critical Mass is more of a Big Bud type plant. Nowhere near the vigor. You want to try other Super Silver Haze crosses or straight up Super Silver Haze. I was doing some internet window seed shopping and there's quite a few Silver Haze hybrids out there. The SSH is a super plant everything about it is bigger then a normal plant.

I saw a few Ghost Train Haze descriptions that sounded promising. Either straight up or crossed with something. If my flowering season was a bit longer I'd be very interested.

The above poster mentions Bodhi he's got a lot of hybrids with vigor. Worth your while to look through his stuff. The large sativa frame with big indica type bud formula has been a proven winner in the Emerald Triangle for a lot of years. The breeders select tall vigorous males crossed with a proven clone mother. I've seen quite a few 10 lb monster strains that fit this. A lot of them include an outdoor Diesel line as the father.

ramse · Dec 17, 2018

CrushnYuba said:
Is critical mass like that? I thought critical was more on the indica side. I don't really know anyone that grows critical mass. Not really a cali thing.
Does critical mass carry yield traits to hybrids

I found some phenotypes that lean on the Afghan side and others on the sativa/skunk side
I particularly preferred a sativa phenotype, very, very vigorous, with narrow leaves and thin branches, large and dense colas, excellent flower / leaf ratio and a very good resin production.
at 44 ° it is ready within the first week of October.
has become my Gold standard for an outdoor productive growth

check this thread:
https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=33550

this is one of mine... put on the ground in the mid-July
I had them all in a context of guerrilla in the woods... ground not prepared, commercial substrate only in the holes 20cm x 20cm; water from rainfall if not a handful of water crystals at the bottom of the hole...
In a controlled garden, put in the ground in the spring they would have become monsters

CrushnYuba · Dec 17, 2018

Shes purty. Thinner leaf then any specimens i have seen. The only CM i have seen must have been 6 ish years ago. They were way more indica leaning. Somewhat bland. Not really much larger buds then many other indica leaning hybrids. Just very un memorable. How common do you think those thinner leaf with chunky nug phenos are?

Does any one know how the critical mass hybrids turn out?

ramse · Dec 17, 2018

did you check the link? the phenotype of youngones, seems equal to my... on page 7 you can see well https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=33550&page=7

ramse · Dec 17, 2018

21 seeds, 9 males and 12 females.
In these I found 4 that leaned on the sativa / Skunk side. this shown above is the most extreme... and it is also the one I liked best

CrushnYuba · Dec 18, 2018

Thereverand: you don't think a sativa critical mass phenom would have the vigor?
It's been so long since i ran ssh. I don't remember ever having a pheno as chunky as bd that also had that sativa growth structure. And finished in 65ish days.
Could it be that super plants can only be found in pur-ish indica x pure-ish sativa crosses? And that's why i havent seen "super plants" in so long? Because these modern day breeders are all 50/50 hybrid x 50/50 hybrid?

Blue dream was Santa cruz haze x blue berry. I'm wondering if i need something like haze x bubblegum. Ssh is a 4 way hybrid. It's been so long since i have ran strains mentioned. Are they really as dank as modern day clone onlys?

ramse · Dec 18, 2018

this is the description of Big Bud from The Seed Bank of Neville

The first seeds of the world-famous Big Bud are now available. These seeds are Northern Lights #1 x Big Bud x Big Bud, resulting in 75% Big Bud. The first cross, a NL#1 male to the original Big Bud cutting, resulted in extremely vigorous Big Bud types in 50% of the seedlings. The second cross, a handsome male from this generation back to the original Big Bud cutting, should result in even more Big Bud types among the seedlings. Also, the remaining hybrid vigor from the NL#1 should result in the appearance of a few super plants that should surpass even the original Big Bud in yield and quality, if enough seedlings are grown to choose from. These are the seeds that are now available.

Other Big Bud Hybrids will be available soon, including F1 hybrids with both Skunk #l, and Northern Lights #2 (Hindu Kush), also a 4-way hybrid of Big Bud / NL#1 and Skunk #1 / Early Pearl. The availability of these will be announced soon in a future Seed Bank Update.

After doing some research, we have also discovered the probable origin of the original Big Bud cutting. Apparently it was brought to America as a cutting from Afghanistan. This is very good news, as we should therefore be able to obtain a virtually pure-breeding seed line in a few more generations, since we have used our best Afghani, NL#1 as a starting point for backcrossing to the original cutting.
(Big Bud x NL#1) x Big Bud

Critical Mass consists of a vigorous and productive Afghan x Skunk#1

about the heterosis and the consequent phenomenon called the hybrid vigor, on this site there are many threads that talk about the topic... I suggest you to make a search

I am in Europe and I can not easily find the so-called elite clones... I have cultivated some cuts of American genetics bought in Austria... and I was not particularly impressed... but I do not know if it's about legitimate clones... my comparison meters consist mainly of seed growth and my selections...

about hybrids containing haze, I've heard good things in all round about ASH Afghan Skunk x Afghani Haze

Ibechillin · Dec 18, 2018

CrushnYuba said:
Thereverand:Could it be that super plants can only be found in pur-ish indica x pure-ish sativa crosses? And that's why i havent seen "super plants" in so long? Because these modern day breeders are all 50/50 hybrid x 50/50 hybrid?

Blue dream was Santa cruz haze x blue berry. I'm wondering if i need something like haze x bubblegum. Ssh is a 4 way hybrid. It's been so long since i have ran strains mentioned. Are they really as dank as modern day clone onlys?

The best hybrid vigor comes from f1 after crossing 2 stabilized strains together, they can be similar in growth and appearance such as an indica crossed to indica dominate hybrid. It does not matter which plant is the pollen donor or the female, trait inheritance is random from both parents in offspring.

Haze works well as the backbone in a cross because it carries traits from multiple different types of landrace sativas (india,mexico,columbia and thai). This gives potential for "super" sativa phenotypes exaggerated in many ways. After finding a "super" sativa pheno it will probably need stabilized (which can/will cause vigor loss). By crossing the stabilized "super" sativa with another stabilized chunky nug dominant hybrid strain (preferably with large sativa heritage such as thai like blueberry) there will be potential for phenotypes that get huge with crazy f1 vigor and chunky nugs.

Ideally you would take the stabilized "super" sativa and make your own chunky nug dominant cross and stabilize. When you cross this stabilized chunky nug hybrid with the stabilized pure "super" sativa more of the large plant "super" sativa expression can be retained with hybrid vigor.

Not alot of breeding has been done towards "super" plants imo (alot of strains were bred indoors as well), most has been oriented towards stealth (compact, low odor, quick finishing etc) and then poly hybridized together. Haze, Skunk and Blue Dream were all 3 outdoor grown and bred in california.

zachrockbadenof · Dec 18, 2018

we have bought thousands of dlrs worth of seeds from lots of 'breeders' (more like pollen chuckers) the only 'super' weed we have found was in a cheap (did i say cheap) pack of nirvana's jock horror - it was super weed... but being old and stupid, didnt take cuttings and never found that special lady again in 2+ packs of jock, even bought a pack of jack herer... nothing close..

ramse · Dec 18, 2018

so many good things out there...
it is difficult to give targeted advice on a variety without knowing a whole series of things... latitude, microclimate, growth environment, expectations etc...
...also for this reason I felt to recommend Critical Mass
ask the Spanish why he became so popular...
the cannabis-enthusiast will tell you that the Spanish have no imagination... others will tell you: because it is reliable, consistent, vigorous, high yield, good potency, appeal bag, etc... a cash cropper

P.S
I'm not Spanish

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