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New to Photoperiod

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stevebe

New member
Hi everyone,

I've had a couple of successful grows of autos in coco / perlite (80:20)

I have a bulk of photoperiod (fem) seeds and i want to get going on these. As ive never done a photo period grow before i was wondering if anyone would like to share a feed schedule/ amounts with me ?

usually with Autos i just went with the 1/4 the recommended and i didn't really run into a lot of issues. I fed at pH 5.6.

I am aware that photos will require more nutes but there's so much information out there. below are my current nutrients, light and the strain ill be attempting.

BCN critical (Seedstockers)

cocos premium - plagron

plagron A&B
zym root
power root
green sensation
CalMag
I have a mars hydro 600w light and a 1.2x1.2M space.

Thank you for taking the time to read this and i appreciate any advice on the schedule and amounts i should set up.
 
Creeperpark

Creeperpark

Well-known member
Mentor
Veteran
I would start with 1/4 the recommended nutrient as well for the photoperiod plants. You can start the plants under a 12/12 and when you get the first true leaves add more hours to the photoperiod. You can work up to 18 on 6 off within the first 4 weeks. Night times are very important for photoperiod plants and keeping them consentant is crucial. .
 
SuperBadGrower

SuperBadGrower

Active member
Thats what I'm wondering. Having used those products for quite a while, at 1/4th strength there wouldn't be a green leaf in sight. Even lettuce is grown at higher EC
 
S

stevebe

New member
This sounds logical to me, i usually do not feed for the first 14-16 days, so i will do this as normal and introduce 1/4 the nutes after day 14?
 
SuperBadGrower

SuperBadGrower

Active member
Hmm it's all relative. "follow the instructions" because Plagron are right about most things. No need to supplement ca/mg with coco A&B. If you use hydro A&B with coco you need to supplement Mg. GS is quite strong, half dose is OK

if I plant seeds here and give them tap water for 14 days, I will for sure be looking at a bunch of crippled plants with drained cotyledons, deficiencies and yellow leaves. But thats because mine get a lot of light. If I put them in a low light situation yeah you can get away with things.
Wouldn't worry too much about it, just satisfy the medium and see where it goes. The plant takes what it needs. If you make feed water 1.2 EC, run enough water thru the coco so the drain EC is the same as input EC, you have effectively set your coco EC to "light mix" levels. Even a monkey can keep plants alive for 2 weeks in a light mix (peat), which all target approx 1.2 EC. With the coco set to 1.2 EC you can put a seed in there and it will grow well. I set my coco to 1.6 EC then I put seeds in, then they grow, and then I smoke the weed.
 
S

stevebe

New member
SuperBadGrower said:
Hmm it's all relative. "follow the instructions" because Plagron are right about most things. No need to supplement ca/mg with coco A&B. If you use hydro A&B with coco you need to supplement Mg. GS is quite strong, half dose is OK

if I plant seeds here and give them tap water for 14 days, I will for sure be looking at a bunch of crippled plants with drained cotyledons, deficiencies and yellow leaves. But thats because mine get a lot of light. If I put them in a low light situation yeah you can get away with things.
Wouldn't worry too much about it, just satisfy the medium and see where it goes. The plant takes what it needs. If you make feed water 1.2 EC, run enough water thru the coco so the drain EC is the same as input EC, you have effectively set your coco EC to "light mix" levels. Even a monkey can keep plants alive for 2 weeks in a light mix (peat), which all target approx 1.2 EC. With the coco set to 1.2 EC you can put a seed in there and it will grow well. I set my coco to 1.6 EC then I put seeds in, then they grow, and then I smoke the weed.
Click to expand...

sounds good, ive never used an EC pen but that's not an issue i could use one. Ive just never seen the point in using it when i use a pH meter. The EC will move with the pH as PH adjusters are essentially a saturated salt solution.
 
SuperBadGrower

SuperBadGrower

Active member
Without calibrated EC measurement you're lost in the woods mate. The amount of phosphoric ph down you need to get to 5.8 increases EC by a marginal amount compared to every other input you listed. Even different batches of A&B can very in strength. 1.5 ml/L of today's bottles can get the same EC as 2 ml/L from tomorrow's batch

EC doesnt tell the whole story, it's not a religion to be at a specific number. Let's say it like this, 1 EC of coca cola does not contain the same stuff as 1 EC of gatorade. But it is the only informative measurement for nutrient strength.

(If you follow the instructions and best practices, in a good environment, you'll almost neve rhave a nutrient related problem. We all mess up sometimes though or maybe a problem occurs. That's when EC measurement is useful for diagnosis)
 
Last edited:
S

stevebe

New member
I understand what youre saying, thank you. However i imagine you use salt to move the ec ? either up or down ? in which case the pH will most certainly move once you start changing this. so i guess my questions now is how do you move the EC without moving the pH ?

if i take my my nutrient solution and its not the correct EC how do you adjust that without moving the pH ? as if im to just dilute that with water that will absolutely move the pH
 
S

stevebe

New member
unless of course people dont specifically measure their nutes ? In this case i guess you make up your nute solution to x EC and then adjust pH at end ? i could understand how this would work ? is this the common practice ? like one day i might use 1.5mL nute the next i might use 1.2mL ?
Would this be how people usually feed ?
 
S

stevebe

New member
SuperBadGrower said:
Without calibrated EC measurement you're lost in the woods mate. The amount of phosphoric ph down you need to get to 5.8 increases EC by a marginal amount compared to every other input you listed. Even different batches of A&B can very in strength. 1.5 ml/L of today's bottles can get the same EC as 2 ml/L from tomorrow's batch

EC doesnt tell the whole story, it's not a religion to be at a specific number. Let's say it like this, 1 EC of coca cola does not contain the same stuff as 1 EC of gatorade. But it is the only informative measurement for nutrient strength.

(If you follow the instructions and best practices, in a good environment, you'll almost neve rhave a nutrient related problem. We all mess up sometimes though or maybe a problem occurs. That's when EC measurement is useful for diagnosis)
Click to expand...

Actually i think i get it now, People dont measure their nutes they adjust to Ec and then record the nute amount ? so i should be using the EC and not the actual nute amount from a chart ?

.add nutes unti desired EC
. Adjust pH
.Feed

would this be correct ? ive only ever been using say 1/4 or 1/2 the suggested nutes on an online chart sigh
 
SuperBadGrower

SuperBadGrower

Active member
stevebe said:
However i imagine you use salt to move the ec ? either up or down ? in which case the pH will most certainly move once you start changing this. so i guess my questions now is how do you move the EC without moving the pH ?

if i take my my nutrient solution and its not the correct EC how do you adjust that without moving the pH ? as if im to just dilute that with water that will absolutely move the pH
Click to expand...

I'm not sure what you are getting at but it seems like you have an unusual understanding of this stuff. I recommend reading a few articles on this website: https://manicbotanix.com/

"Nutrients" (i.e., A&B together) are typically acidic, so the more you add, the lower the PH. Adding stuff to water only increases EC. EC is like ppm.

Calcium for example is alkaline. Adding it to water raises PH, and raises EC. PH down raises EC and lowers PH.

First you dose your nutrients, then you adjust PH. So if it's not the correct EC you will have noticed and changed that before even adding PH down or up.

But indeed all of that does not matter if you have a "600w" light that is not actually 600 watts. there is just no way you can finish a properly lit LED grow, in coco, at 1/4th strength with this. Something's up. if that was possible I would be laughin to the bank right now because I buy this by the jug.
 
SuperBadGrower

SuperBadGrower

Active member
stevebe said:
Actually i think i get it now, People dont measure their nutes they adjust to Ec and then record the nute amount ? so i should be using the EC and not the actual nute amount from a chart ?

.add nutes unti desired EC
. Adjust pH
.Feed

would this be correct ? ive only ever been using say 1/4 or 1/2 the suggested nutes on an online chart sigh
Click to expand...

Haha, looks like you already grasp it while I wrote my last reply :)
That order of actions is correct.

I dont remember Coco A&B, it's been 1 or 2 years since I used that. When I get a new bottle, calibrate EC meter, add 1 ml/L to tap water and see how much that increases EC. Then you can say: every ml/L raises EC by, lets say 0.4 EC. Yes, it works like that - so if you were to add 5 ml/L that would be the same as adding 2.0 EC in this case.

So to say it quickly, EC informs you about the concentration, PH informs you of the acidity/alkalinity. PH affects whether something can be taken up, and whether certain elemnts (like iron) stay in solution or precipitate. The concentration decides whether there is enough in the first place to support healthy growth
 
S

stevebe

New member
SuperBadGrower said:
Haha, looks like you already grasp it while I wrote my last reply :)
That order of actions is correct.

I dont remember Coco A&B, it's been 1 or 2 years since I used that. When I get a new bottle, calibrate EC meter, add 1 ml/L to tap water and see how much that increases EC. Then you can say: every ml/L raises EC by, lets say 0.4 EC. Yes, it works like that - so if you were to add 5 ml/L that would be the same as adding 2.0 EC in this case.
Click to expand...

brother thank you i very much understand how its done now. the light also is not 600w as i suggested it is indeed the mars hydro which another suggested there. Ive not had a prob with this light ever but i can tell you ive burnt a lot of seedlings :(, most likely now because my EC has been incorrect. I can get an Ec meter tomorrow. This all has been more than informative to me and i thank everyone again for their knowledge.
 
S

stevebe

New member
i suppose the final question now is what EC values should i be aiming for though-out my grow ? i imagine something close to 1 anyway for seedlings ?
 
SuperBadGrower

SuperBadGrower

Active member
No problem, read that website I linked there is much to learn :good:
The calibration liquid for EC meters is 1.4 EC.. if you get a meter, get a few packs or a bottle of that stuff. You dont need to calibrate EC meters often, its a simple cheap technology. calibrating mine once per year they are off by less than 0.1 EC. Even if you can't calibrate it, it's nice (or essential) to know if your meter is off. i.e. if you read 1.3 EC in the test liquid you know it's about 8% low.

1 EC = 500 ppm (typically)
some manufacturers use 1 EC = 700 ppm

if you test a TDS/ppm meter in that liquid it should read either 700 ppm or 980 ppm depending on which scale it uses. I have one in the collection that reads 315 ppm. That's why it's important to check what you get

The EC depends on your situation really, something like this is average for DTW coco

Seedlings 1.2
Veg 1.4-1.6
Peak flower 1.8-2.0

my numbers way higher, seeds 1.6, veg 1.8, flower 2-3.
but giving high EC if I miss one watering or let them dry out Im looking at 5 EC runoff. Many ways lead to rome.
 
S

stevebe

New member
Thank you very much, ive seen most are 3 or 4 in 1 pens. have you any recommendations ? or does it really matter ? just buy a pen for 15 euro and calibrate ?
 
SuperBadGrower

SuperBadGrower

Active member
ph meter.PNG

^As far as affordable ones go these are good and can be calibrated (EC as well as PH). The PH probe actually lasts a long time if you keep it in storage solution.
If you get one that cannot be calibrated, make a video to prove it and get a refund


crap.PNG

^These are crap, avoid them
 
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