Plants dying overnight

issack · Aug 3, 2017

This happened on my last run. Plant will start yellowing super fast and within 2 days it just dies. This is with pineapple chunk. I had to pull early last run cause about 4 plants died and one was all the way in the back and impossible to extract.
I'm thinking heat stress.? My temps are kinda high. 85 86 with co2. But above the canopy I'm sure it's hotter. This is at 36 days flower. The mountain apple OG on the left you can see the leaves starting to yellow where the hot spot is from the light. And the pineapple chunk on the right there is hardly any yellow leaves. I have a 18k mini split running now for 8k of lights .. and a 36k btu in the box waiting to go in for the next run.. So will a plant just up and die in a matter of 24 hours due to heat stress.? There is no burnt curled leaves anywhere. Idk the only thing I can think is heat stress. And when the leaves start to yellow. It's like within hours it gets all the way totally yellow. This plant was fine yesterday when lights were on.. I go in this morning at lights off and this plant was dead.. that fast it happens.. I have no pests. No RAs no mites no nothing in this room. My first time ever in all my years of growing this has happened. But this is the first time I've ever had temps this hot too.

This is the left side. Mountain Apple OG. You can see the yellowing on the hot spots.

Right side is pineapple chunk. With hardly any yellowing. Last run was all pineapple and where I had 4 plants within a week just die literally overnight.

Andyo · Aug 3, 2017

fans/circulation

fans/circulation

I dont see any fans for circulation of air.
The amount of air movement up through the plants from ground level is important.
It will even out the hot spots, enabling the plants to breath better an cool themselves.A

issack · Aug 3, 2017

It's a wind tunnel in there. I have 2 860cfm blower fans over the canopys and it moves a lot of air. And 2 oscillating fans on hi at each end. The plant that just died is in a spot where it's not in a hot spot at all and it's under the A/C where it's the coolest. I thought of that but couldn't see where a dead spot was with air anywhere. It kinda perplexes me now because this plant isn't in a heat area where some are close and yellowed. I vegged a week too long on this run.

Andyo · Aug 3, 2017

observation

observation

Ok understood ,i guess your observation will have to work it out.
process of elimination of possible causes. space taken up by over veg made it worse than the time before?
Fact the problems in a group of plants .
And again i say getting air up through the plants is still advantageous more than over the canopy
Even if lack of is not the cause.
Maybe your blowing a gale made the effected plants over transpire.?

What are you growing in , coco drip feed or ebb/flow hydroton ?

issack · Aug 3, 2017

You're right. Just going to have to sort it out with all possible causes. All my plants are swaying in there from the air that the two oscillating fans pump out. Maybe I might need to get some more fans like floor fans to push up or something.. Or maybe it's not heat issues. Maybe it's slime build-up. But I clean my rez well and it's chilled at 64 and I use biowar in my feeds with sm90. My roots looked white and nice on the dead plant. This is coco drain to waste.. I hate troubleshooting this crap. Lol

microbe · Aug 3, 2017

bonjour. fusarium ou pythium ....si la plante meurt rapidement . vous pouvez essayer eau de javel pour sauver ce qui reste a sauver.

issack · Aug 3, 2017

microbe said:
bonjour. fusarium ou pythium ....si la plante meurt rapidement . vous pouvez essayer eau de javel pour sauver ce qui reste a sauver.

Sorry bro but I can't translate that. Might be the answer and I can't understand . Haha

A.C.A.B · Aug 3, 2017

Hi !

He said something like "it could come from a fungal infection such as fusarium or pytium, you could try to treat it with some bleach (sodium hypochlorite)."

I agree with him, this kind of fungi could very well kill the plant all of a sudden without previous signs. It develops inside the stem and once it disrupted the sap vessels the plants dies very fast.

Good luck !

issack · Aug 3, 2017

Seems as though that might be it. I've ruled out heat. My res water is at 64 i clean it once s week. Could be build up in my pvc lines like bacteria. I use mills nutrients and also sm90 in my feed as well as of bio war microbe tea. I thought I was doing good from preventing bacteria slime with This regimen. This might very be a fungi.

This is coco DTW. And I feed every hour and a half with slight run off. Plants look amazing and are packing on weight by the day. Then one will just die out of no where. Must be some kind of fungus.

HereIgrowagain · Aug 3, 2017

Just wondering, have you by any chance been spraying any foliage feed?

bigganjabud · Aug 3, 2017

Man there was a case like this ages ago it came down to some off gassing by some dodgy pvc pipe

Snook · Aug 3, 2017

bigganjabud said:
Man there was a case like this ages ago it came down to some off gassing by some dodgy pvc pipe

unless something was changed (plastic) recently in this grow, off gassing would have showed up long ago.

most off gassing years ago was from cheap tents and N-P-K brand hose.. maybe other stuff.
might try switch a bad plant position with a new plant form a good space; does the bad plant continue to get bad or the new 'healthy' plant starts to go bad?

Snook · Aug 3, 2017

BTW, sorry to see/hear this, they look beautiful. :tiphat:

microbe · Aug 3, 2017

fusarium:confort: arret les innoculants microbiens et tous ce qui est organique. de eau + javel pour quelque jours et voir ce qui ce passe. sinon superbe salle et plantes. bravo

gaiusmarius · Aug 3, 2017

this is a nice set up, i can't see any reason for whats happening. i never read of root rot in coco and he said the roots were white and healthy. as for the off gassing, he would have noticed it in the last runs too, also it doesn't only effect one plant, i had this issue so believe me, all the plants would look bad with the best ones near the fresh air intake.

one part i'm not sure of is the feed, you mentioned a brand, is that a coco specific nute? have you been using it successfully before in this set up? but again this wouldn't be effecting just 1 plant.

i know that when i run to waste in coco i use the coggr a&b for best results, while my re circulating coco set up uses coco A&B for best results, but neither one kills the plants when use the other way round, just less good weight, so thats not much use. have you examined the dead plant with a magnifier?

best of luck finding the problem.

DunHav`nFun · Aug 3, 2017

Hey bro...been lurkin your thread since the start , and much respect for the hard work you`re doin.....now....

Gonna start with there`s no need for a big ass chiller to hold rez temps @ 64 for optimum dissolved O2 runnin Coco DTW , and actually the rootzones respond with more explosive growth if root temps are warmer , and my rooms ran in the mid 80`s for yrs with dialed results.....plus.....

With SM-90 for rootzone protection plus rootborn critter protection @ 5 ml per gal , plus OG Biowar as fungal and airborn pathogen protection , I`m gonna go off my gut and say that from the pics I looked at.....

It appears that the affected plants sat in runoff too long maybe from tables out of level or buckling like flood tables have always done , but with as many feeds as you`ve been doing , if there are places in the table that hold juice even after runoff has ceased , then the plants are staying too wet from wicking up the runoff till the next feed , and never exchange gas as in good O2 to roots in and bad stagnant shit never goes out , and what happens...?..

The plant drowns and falls over dead from overwatering....especially since you said the dead plants roots were white and healthy lookin....also makes no sense it`s only affecting certain plants.....but again....I`ve been wrong before.....just not much....lol....

Andyo stated fact above about the airflow "beneath" the plants being very important , and hey.....Your setup is tight with the commercial blowers up above both sides of the room and I`m sure it`s a wind tunnel in there , but.....

I learned long ago that air blowing "on" the plants is no Bueno but rather "above , below and around" the plants keeps em from transpiring/sweating too much that causes excessive nutrient uptake with ph imbalances and lockouts right behind....and ....

Since you`re runnin sealed instead of air exchange twice per minute with lung rooms like I did for many yrs , here`s a lil tip the commercial guys don`t like known that`ll save wear and tear on your dehuey....

The plants shit out all Co2 that wasn`t used during lights on while getting rid of excess water vapor not used as well during lights out , and that`s why CO2 levels and RH spikes during the dark period.....especially during late bloomage when they`re drinkin and swellin , so...

Exhaust all air out of the room with passive intakes to help refresh the grow area with new air during lights out , and with all the airflow you have , there`s no way the plants could develop anaerobic conditions above OR below in the rootzones IME....anyways....

Not tryin to tell ya what to do , but rather offer help from what I`ve seen over the yrs....and if it`s some kind of disease I have no clue about , I apologize for the long winded post , but in all my yrs of HARD croppin ....

Never had an issue with rootborn or airborn pathogens using air exchange twice per min 24/7 using SM -90 as the only additives in my regimen except cal/mag and Silicablast and base nutrients....and.....

Constant and continuous airflow around , above and below the plants but never on em.....regardless....I wish you Godspeed to find the culprit fast with an end to the problem immediately.....

Good luck and.....

Peace.....DHF..... :ying:

.....

gaiusmarius · Aug 3, 2017

i don't suppose the drip line to the dead plant was blocked? lol.

issack · Aug 4, 2017

thank you all for the replies and suggestions. all is food for thought and i'm trying to asses all scenarios.

HereIgrowagain said:
Just wondering, have you by any chance been spraying any foliage feed?

no i have not sprayed in 3 weeks anything.

Snook said:
unless something was changed (plastic) recently in this grow, off gassing would have showed up long ago.

most off gassing years ago was from cheap tents and N-P-K brand hose.. maybe other stuff.
might try switch a bad plant position with a new plant form a good space; does the bad plant continue to get bad or the new 'healthy' plant starts to go bad?

I cant move the plants i'm locked in with 2 nets. thinking about it now, the last grow the first plant that died was in the exact same spot. which might lead to air movement. but then again.. how does a plant die from this. ?

gaiusmarius said:
this is a nice set up, i can't see any reason for whats happening. i never read of root rot in coco and he said the roots were white and healthy. as for the off gassing, he would have noticed it in the last runs too, also it doesn't only effect one plant, i had this issue so believe me, all the plants would look bad with the best ones near the fresh air intake.

one part i'm not sure of is the feed, you mentioned a brand, is that a coco specific nute? have you been using it successfully before in this set up? but again this wouldn't be effecting just 1 plant.

i know that when i run to waste in coco i use the coggr a&b for best results, while my re circulating coco set up uses coco A&B for best results, but neither one kills the plants when use the other way round, just less good weight, so thats not much use. have you examined the dead plant with a magnifier?

best of luck finding the problem.

I'm using Mills nutrients. and the last run when this happened I was using Flora Nova. Mills is absolutely kicking ass. like i said the plants look perfect. just one will just die rapidly. this is my second run only in this new room. i feed every hour and half DTW with slight run off.

DunHav`nFun said:
Hey bro...been lurkin your thread since the start , and much respect for the hard work you`re doin.....now....

Gonna start with there`s no need for a big ass chiller to hold rez temps @ 64 for optimum dissolved O2 runnin Coco DTW , and actually the rootzones respond with more explosive growth if root temps are warmer , and my rooms ran in the mid 80`s for yrs with dialed results.....plus.....

With SM-90 for rootzone protection plus rootborn critter protection @ 5 ml per gal , plus OG Biowar as fungal and airborn pathogen protection , I`m gonna go off my gut and say that from the pics I looked at.....

It appears that the affected plants sat in runoff too long maybe from tables out of level or buckling like flood tables have always done , but with as many feeds as you`ve been doing , if there are places in the table that hold juice even after runoff has ceased , then the plants are staying too wet from wicking up the runoff till the next feed , and never exchange gas as in good O2 to roots in and bad stagnant shit never goes out , and what happens...?..

The plant drowns and falls over dead from overwatering....especially since you said the dead plants roots were white and healthy lookin....also makes no sense it`s only affecting certain plants.....but again....I`ve been wrong before.....just not much....lol....

Andyo stated fact above about the airflow "beneath" the plants being very important , and hey.....Your setup is tight with the commercial blowers up above both sides of the room and I`m sure it`s a wind tunnel in there , but.....

I learned long ago that air blowing "on" the plants is no Bueno but rather "above , below and around" the plants keeps em from transpiring/sweating too much that causes excessive nutrient uptake with ph imbalances and lockouts right behind....and ....

Since you`re runnin sealed instead of air exchange twice per minute with lung rooms like I did for many yrs , here`s a lil tip the commercial guys don`t like known that`ll save wear and tear on your dehuey....

The plants shit out all Co2 that wasn`t used during lights on while getting rid of excess water vapor not used as well during lights out , and that`s why CO2 levels and RH spikes during the dark period.....especially during late bloomage when they`re drinkin and swellin , so...

Exhaust all air out of the room with passive intakes to help refresh the grow area with new air during lights out , and with all the airflow you have , there`s no way the plants could develop anaerobic conditions above OR below in the rootzones IME....anyways....

Not tryin to tell ya what to do , but rather offer help from what I`ve seen over the yrs....and if it`s some kind of disease I have no clue about , I apologize for the long winded post , but in all my yrs of HARD croppin ....

Never had an issue with rootborn or airborn pathogens using air exchange twice per min 24/7 using SM -90 as the only additives in my regimen except cal/mag and Silicablast and base nutrients....and.....

Constant and continuous airflow around , above and below the plants but never on em.....regardless....I wish you Godspeed to find the culprit fast with an end to the problem immediately.....

Good luck and.....

Peace.....DHF..........

hey bro thank you . you brought up a good point. I think i need to add more airflow from bottom to middle of the grow.. and that makes sense about the passive air exchange. only thing i can do right now is open the door while lights are off and give the room fresh air. I've ran sealed rooms for years and I have never had this though ever. and I'm using Sm90 at 2mills a gallon. as well as Mad farmer silica. and bio war 24 hour brewed tea in every day.. I have a 50 galon rez and i have to add water to it every day. the room drinks about 30 gallons in 12 hours. so i just top off and add the correct nutes then about 3 gallons of tea. i don't have hardly any slime when i go to do a full cleaning of the rez which is every 5 days.. if i didn't have a chiller, my water would smell like a dead animal after just one day.. i tried that already.. my rez is outside in a shed. it gets super hot out there.. since the chiller was put in my rez stays clean smelling.. i use too many benies in there to play with warm temps.. this is just my observation though. i honestly am no expert. I dont think i could ever take my chiller out of the equation.
I'm still stumped.. because all the plants look great.. right now i just looked at lights out and no more have died yet.. thank god.! lol..

gaiusmarius said:
i don't suppose the drip line to the dead plant was blocked? lol.

dude i wish that was the case.. lol.. first thing i checked believe me.. all my drippers are working. they all get the same amount. i also rip out all the pvc and lines and make a whole brand new irrigation feed set up before each grow .. i dont wanna take chances with sludge left over in there.. and its impossible to clean pretty much so i just make a whole new one..

so thats in im still scratching my head.. going to try and add some more air right now.. I have more fans to use..

again thanks all for the advice.!! I'm just stumped as to why i have no bad symptoms showing on any plant at all.. and then one dies.. would not having good air exchange and not as good circulation from lower to middle of plants make a plant just die.? So weird.!!

mack 10 · Aug 4, 2017

What medium? Or you hydro, sorry if I misses it.

To die off in one day?
Must be some killer virus or root rot?

issack · Aug 4, 2017

Here is my bare bones shot of the irrigation. They all get the same amount. I make this from scratch before each run.. new pvc and lines.

Plants dying overnight

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