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Tissue Culture : Micropropagation

led05

Chasing The Present
And in the wine industry why do you think all growers use virus free certified grape vines? No one grows wine from seed plants. Same with strawberries and other crops.
I agree that seeds are handy for breeding and finding new elite clones to mass produce. But in the future most Cannabis in the West may well be TC.
-SamS

Long lived Perennial vs an Annual, quite different animals... Strawberries, really?

I agree TC will play a larger & larger role but the more seeds, the more new creations and diversity... Canna vs grape suitability regions have a huge difference too, so many varieties of canna growing everywhere around earth, inside and out, grapes not so much ��

You as much as anyone knows the uniqueness of this plant, lets not turn it into another AG commodity like strawberries or corn which are extremely simple by comparison
 

Sam_Skunkman

"RESIN BREEDER"
Moderator
Veteran
I think you are mixing up production and how the plant will be bred in the future.
The plants will be grown from TC virus free certified clones, the new clones will be bred with seeds like grape vines and strawberries get their new clones.

I love seeds, I love male Cannabis plants, but I can see the future....
-SamS
 

led05

Chasing The Present
I think you are mixing up production and how the plant will be bred in the future.
The plants will be grown from TC virus free certified clones, the new clones will be bred with seeds like grape vines and strawberries get their new clones.

I love seeds, I love male Cannabis plants, but I can see the future....
-SamS

Good points, just don’t want to see this plant go the way of most all AG products, significant narrowing of selections into only a select few.., we’ve already seen far too much of this the past 3 decades, let’s diverge not narrow
 

beta

Active member
Veteran
Good points, just don’t want to see this plant go the way of most all AG products, significant narrowing of selections into only a select few.., we’ve already seen far too much of this the past 3 decades, let’s diverge not narrow

If you think legal cannabis will be anything other than another agricultural product, you're gonna have a bad time.
 

led05

Chasing The Present
If you think legal cannabis will be anything other than another agricultural product, you're gonna have a bad time.

I don’t for a second, why I’ve been hoarding seeds for decades, I do this for many species of plants... for example, there used to be thousands of varieties of apples grown in good ol America., a fraction of that nowadays, somewhat a resurgence going on but most of those old great varieties origins came from seed and cross pollination, naturally, accidentally ....

once the masses start relying on TC, it’s already too late... to trust AG business to maintain lines for the good and not focus purely on profit is ignorance, expect narrowing to continue big time, get worse.... it always amazes me how one day folks preach diversity, as soon as $$$ is on the line for them their attitude shifts, pure capitalistic focus., we are only human after all
 

beta

Active member
Veteran
It's not either / or. Nobody will ever prohibit you from germinating seeds and looking for your own phenos. TC is simply the -best- way to produce reliable, pathogen free cuttings on an enormous scale. It will be adopted because it works better than anything else.

Fun fact about apples - They are highly heterozygous, meaning that 99%+ of the apple seeds you will start are gonna suck - No flavor, poor yield, etc. It's very difficult to breed apples for specific traits, that's why people tend to grow clones of the rare unique individuals that have popped up over time.

People choose technology because it works. Results matter.
 

led05

Chasing The Present
It's not either / or. Nobody will ever prohibit you from germinating seeds and looking for your own phenos. TC is simply the -best- way to produce reliable, pathogen free cuttings on an enormous scale. It will be adopted because it works better than anything else.

Fun fact about apples - They are highly heterozygous, meaning that 99%+ of the apple seeds you will start are gonna suck - No flavor, poor yield, etc. It's very difficult to breed apples for specific traits, that's why people tend to grow clones of the rare unique individuals that have popped up over time.

People choose technology because it works. Results matter.

I'm currently prohibited from germinating and looking for my own phenos as we write right now...? !!

if folks were using TC 300 years ago, we'd have 15 apple varieties vs. the thousands we have avail today.... I think we're arguing apples to oranges here :)

good post btw, I mostly agree with you, playing dev advocate here some
 
im pretty sure theres already canna companies utilizing this tech. and they have been for a minute or two. check out big foot clones
 

Sam_Skunkman

"RESIN BREEDER"
Moderator
Veteran
I don’t for a second, why I’ve been hoarding seeds for decades, I do this for many species of plants... for example, there used to be thousands of varieties of apples grown in good ol America., a fraction of that nowadays, somewhat a resurgence going on but most of those old great varieties origins came from seed and cross pollination, naturally, accidentally ....

once the masses start relying on TC, it’s already too late... to trust AG business to maintain lines for the good and not focus purely on profit is ignorance, expect narrowing to continue big time, get worse.... it always amazes me how one day folks preach diversity, as soon as $$$ is on the line for them their attitude shifts, pure capitalistic focus., we are only human after all

I hope you are not saving apple seeds, that is generally a waste of time unless you are planting tens of thousands looking for a new clone to keep. Apple seeds are heterozygous and no one grows apple seeds for apple crops, when Johnny appleseed gave out and sold apple seeds and trees they were not for eating apples they were used for cider, still a good idea, I love trees.
Nothing wrong with TC, it is just another tech that can be used.
Apples need to be maintained as a tree or by TC, you can't maintain apple varieties by seeds....
-SamS
 

led05

Chasing The Present
I hope you are not saving apple seeds, that is generally a waste of time unless you are planting tens of thousands looking for a new clone to keep. Apple seeds are heterozygous and no one grows apple seeds for apple crops, when Johnny appleseed gave out and sold apple seeds and trees they were not for eating apples they were used for cider, still a good idea, I love trees.
Nothing wrong with TC, it is just another tech that can be used.
Apples need to be maintained as a tree or by TC, you can't maintain apple varieties by seeds....
-SamS

I have 15+ varieties of apples, 10 are cider based on stock at least a couple of hundred years old.... Apple seeds, nope - scions grafted on root stock, most developed at Cornell, I'm in apple country out here and it makes sense to use that base root stock, damn cold here in winter !

I agree TC is a great tech, inevitable and already widely in use, especially in other AG space. I'm just simple stating that historically when the mass relies on a few to develop or maintain their AG products (which is exactly what TC lends itself to), it narrows immensely and before we know it, our choices and variability are diminished or gone and the only option left is to buy the crap or grow your own from hopefully still a wide pool of avail seed stock, or what you've been hoarding yourself....

The good & bad of advancement....
 
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ambertrichome

Well-known member
Veteran
With TC, you can also culture from culture, and have 0 Genetic Drift. It takes it back to the embryonic stage.

IMHO, like a lot of stuff.

It can be used for good, or bad.
 

beta

Active member
Veteran
With TC, you can also culture from culture, and have 0 Genetic Drift. It takes it back to the embryonic stage.

IMHO, like a lot of stuff.

It can be used for good, or bad.

There is zero evidence that 'genetic drift' is a thing.
 

Palindrome

King of Schwag
Hello Bubbleman, long time no see.

10 years ago when I had to leave growing, I was looking into TC and in the middle of building a lab. Just for private use, but it have huge potential! As a aquarist, I have for years been buying TC aqua plants. For the very reason, that they are 100% virus and pest free.

Would love to be able to work at home with TC cannabis, maybe have gel cultures shipped over seas.
 

guineapig

Active member
Veteran
Viruses and bacterial invasion as well when cloning is a less-than-laboratory environment....

Not to get off topic, but does the tobacco industry do this as well, in order to prevent the dreaded Tobacco Mosaic Virus? Hate to bring up tobacco, but the science behind tobacco cultivation might be applicable to the future of cannabis....

:ying: kind regards from guineapig :ying:
 

marmarb

Active member
I'm looking at these kits and just going to buy parts separately. Put up a 5x5 tent which I'm going to use my lab zipped up inside air flow would be limited with a diy laminar hood.
 

Pédetoddy

Well-known member
Cannabis micropropagation attempt showing fungal and bacterial contamination.
picture.php

Virgin culture medium
picture.php

I am experienced in cloning mushroom, have a SAB (Still air box).
 

hamstring

Well-known member
Veteran
There is good and bad in all technological advances . There is no free lunch or yin/yang. Pick your proverb.

I am not really commenting on the technology more on the use of it. I am not a huge fan of loosing genetic diversity. The implications of monocropping are well documented.

Yellow dent #2 for instance. It worked so well that they had to build a bunch of fake industries to support the huge crops.

Corn sweeteners have taken over every processed food in the market.

They decided feeding it to cattle would be a good idea. It turns out cows on exclusively corn diets get sick a lot. More antibiotics are used in the commercial meat industries than on humans.

Subsidizing farmers didn't help either but the true explosion of use was because the shit works. Grows fast ,need less water, pest, heat and drought resistance. I'm from the midwest you cant kill ole yeller dent #2.

Just because you can doesn't necessarily mean you should. No free lunch:tiphat:
 

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