Lucas Formula and Method(s): Step by Step

lysol · Oct 2, 2009

furley said:
all plants showed signs of nute burn (this was at 900ppm .5conversion)... So I diluted my res to 400ppm... There doesn't seem to be anymore burning (its been 2 days), but half the weak clones (the blueberries) are still getting worse, they appear to have all sorts of deficiencies! (And are additionally now clawing... it only appears the bottom leaves are getting worse)

900ppm -> 400ppm may have over corrected the problem. I have found that deficiencies can affect plant turgor, causing the leafs to look like they are "bear clawing", if it is over nitrification it will usually look more like an upside down canoe then a bear claw

furley · Oct 2, 2009

Ya, I'm beginning to think they all need more nutes now, some of the blue dreams are getting yellowing leaves on the very bottom node, with very light patches of necrosis (phosphorus defic.?)

Should I bump my ppm back up to full strength?

Hydro-Soil · Oct 2, 2009

furley said:
Should I bump my ppm back up to full strength?

Yes

furley · Oct 2, 2009

Hydro-Soil said:
Yes

bah! I'm pretty sure I have been confusing potassium deficiency with nute burn!! Got my ppm to 700 now, and will raise to full strength very soon

Ioni Botani · Oct 2, 2009

Two days ago transplanted a clone into DWC (Hydroton) and I have my ppm at about 370 (.5 conversion @ 3/6 ml Flora per gal RO)
This brought my pH to 5.69....the clone looked sluggish this morning, leaves slightly curling down....will this turn out to be a deficiency?
I figured starting this low of ppm would allow the clone to get rooted and situated before slowly raising my ppm...bad idea? Is she too young to have the ppm this high?

furley · Oct 21, 2009

Would just like to update anyone that was curious, all my plants that were running FloraNova Grow and now bloom on lucas formula look absolutely stunningly healthy!

slowandeasy · Oct 21, 2009

What ppm do you have them at now? How about pH? Blueberry is supposed to be a very light feeder, glad they are doing better. How far along are you now? Good luck!

dc2bar · Oct 22, 2009

I love the lucas method. Short, simple, and well balanced.

Another added bonus of the 3 part is that you can nuke it with H2O2 and SM90 if you get any outbreaks since they're not organic.

2fast4u2 · Oct 22, 2009

lucas formula works perfectly everytime, no matter the strain, so far!

Instead of topping off/ adding back, i just use a little bit bigger reservoir than i need and let it go about 2 weeks between res swaps, plants tend to use the water and nutes in pretty close ratios and my ph never deviates more than .3 at any given time.

I use RO water, and i cant tell you how important that is.

if you guys are fucking this up, you really shouldnt be growing pot, seriously.

Longhair · Nov 14, 2009

Hello,
This Was Stupid. I Found My Answer

Thank You
Longhair

furley · Nov 17, 2009

It seems my FNB ALWAYS levels itself out at 6.0ph, no matter what I do. Someone told me there are pH buffers inside FloraNova that make it do this. My plants I posted about awhile back here (Blueberry and Bluedream both running on JUST FNB) are doing Great! Although my cut of blueberry turned out to be a weaker pheno, the blue dream looks absolutely amazing and dense.

My reservoir maintenance couldn't get any simpler... I don't get why people even do reservoir change outs to be honest, seems like a giant waste of nutrient money. My procedure has just been to top off the res every few days with tap water, then re-add FNB to my desired PPM and re-adjust pH to around 5.5 (it is back to 6.0 within an hour always)

so just saying Hydrolized, I'm running FNB and I CANNOT get my pH to stay that low even if I wanted. (I'm aware it's the swing from 5.2-6.0 that is beneficial, but it happens within an hour, which does not affect the plants in an E/F setup since they do not get watered during that time.

Hydrolized · Nov 18, 2009

Hydro-Soil.....I'm still stuck on the whole 5.2 pH thing. 10K stopped posting here months ago, and he never got around to explaining WHY such a low pH works.

Someone I used to know grew NLxBB, and any time he went below 5.5, he would get crazy K lockout, purple/yellow leaves until he brought it back up to 5.8/6.0. I'm not understanding how STARTING the res at 5.2, will prevent this from happening. I saw the whacky 80's colored nutrient availability chart which 10K and yourself (HydroSoil) agreed was misleading....and I also saw the black and white chart which does seem to indicate running your pH at 5.2 would be fine. If that is the case, why do soooo many people on here run 5.8-6.0 and never have problems, until the pH drops and they start getting purple leaves/K defs?

I'm understanding the two sides, but not getting the "science" behind it all.

RewTheJew · Dec 16, 2009

I run a 7 bucket recirculating DWC. When I mix up my nutes (using lucas's methods of course) do i just mix it for the 15 gallon resevoir, or do I compensate for all the water including the buckets? I figure all the water, because once it makes its way back to the 15 gallon rez, the solution will be diluted.

help?

thanks

Nortin · Jan 22, 2010

Wow great info, you just saved me 100 bucks i need to buy seeds with. I am doin dwc and im a rookie so im just going to do the change out method till I get my head around hydro basics, and I already have a ph pen so thanks to this great info I dont gotta run right out and buy a EC meter. Peace!

Hydro-Soil · Jan 22, 2010

Hydrolized said:
Hydro-Soil.....I'm still stuck on the whole 5.2 pH thing. 10K stopped posting here months ago, and he never got around to explaining WHY such a low pH works.

Someone I used to know grew NLxBB, and any time he went below 5.5, he would get crazy K lockout, purple/yellow leaves until he brought it back up to 5.8/6.0. I'm not understanding how STARTING the res at 5.2, will prevent this from happening. I saw the whacky 80's colored nutrient availability chart which 10K and yourself (HydroSoil) agreed was misleading....and I also saw the black and white chart which does seem to indicate running your pH at 5.2 would be fine. If that is the case, why do soooo many people on here run 5.8-6.0 and never have problems, until the pH drops and they start getting purple leaves/K defs?

I'm understanding the two sides, but not getting the "science" behind it all.

Kinda late responding to this but hope it helps folks that are reading.

10K doesn't suggest leaving the pH at 5.2 as it's merely a starting point. The plant doesn't suck up nutes and use them within minutes.... it takes hours to days, depending on the element, for those nutes to travel and saturate the plant.

As the pH slowly rises, the plant is given the opportunity to 'stock up' on the element that's most available at the given pH. By the time you reach day 30, the plants should have be able to tolerate the higher pH required for maximum magnesium uptake. During that time, certain elements aren't absorbing as well but your plants have a supply and they'll be fine.

This is why it's important to start with the 5.2 at the beginning of 12/12 as it gives the plants the maximum swing during the climb to bud-set.

Stay Safe! :tree:

GreenBizzle · Jan 23, 2010

Hydro-Soil said:
Kinda late responding to this but hope it helps folks that are reading.

10K doesn't suggest leaving the pH at 5.2 as it's merely a starting point. The plant doesn't suck up nutes and use them within minutes.... it takes hours to days, depending on the element, for those nutes to travel and saturate the plant.

As the pH slowly rises, the plant is given the opportunity to 'stock up' on the element that's most available at the given pH. By the time you reach day 30, the plants should have be able to tolerate the higher pH required for maximum magnesium uptake. During that time, certain elements aren't absorbing as well but your plants have a supply and they'll be fine.

This is why it's important to start with the 5.2 at the beginning of 12/12 as it gives the plants the maximum swing during the climb to bud-set.

Stay Safe!

So, how does this work in drain-to-waste....i fill reservoir 30gal water & nutes, using drippers into straight coco every other day (the entire 30 gallons for 36-3gal pots) I always adjusted the res to 5.8

So, in first week of 12/12 use ph down and adjust to 5.2?
then go up how often? My nutes mix to 5.8-6.1 in filtered
not RO water.

I am currently in week5 of flower, and been reading soooo much
about PH & EC, its driving me nuts (cuz im trying to understand)

should i ph down to 5.2...now in week 5?

ambertrich · Jan 23, 2010

Anyone try CNS-17 coco formula as a modified Lucas Ratio?

This is my first run with coco in E&F and have been using the CNS coco series (both grow and bloom-will switch to Ripe in last fwe weeks of flower). So far, everything looks good. No nute burn or lockout yet.

I do add 1ml/gal Flouralicious Plus at the first batch of nute soln for each res.

I have Mach Fly, Orient Express, White RussianxBB, AK48 and White Russian all on the same table atm and all look fine at about 3 1/2 weeks into flower. Can't wait to finish this round to see if any tweeks need to be made to the nute soln or my current setup.

K.I.S.S.=keep it simple silly

Hydro-Soil · Jan 23, 2010

GreenBizzle said:
So, how does this work in drain-to-waste....

Haven't got a clue. Sorry. I would imagine that your best bet there would be to pick a pH that works best with how your medium dries out.

As the medium dries... the EC/ppm rises and the pH will drop. I would suggest a much higher pH than 5.2 as it will be significantly concentrated just before your next drip, depending on your cycles that is.

Stay Safe! :tree:

Edit: The Lucas Formula is a nutrient profile that can be matched using different nutes. Known nutes that can be mixed properly are AN A&B, PBP and GH nutes. If you find a way to mix nutes so they match the Lucas nutrient profile... they may perform the same way when used according to Lucas' recommended res maintenance.

Additives are not part of the Lucas Formula and I personally don't recommend a grower touch them until after they've run a strain at least 2-3 times "Consistently" in an optimized setup.

Lazyeye · Mar 8, 2013

When mixing the nutes with the water the water obviously is colored by the nutes (Flora Nova Bloom). With me using GH drops to check PH I'm a bit confused. The water/nute mix is like brown/yellow, wich makes it hard to tell what PH I get. When I tested this time it said around 5, but now I'm a bit worried that the coloration from the nutes are making me unable to check it this way. PH from the tap is still around 8, can nutes really lower it that far down?

pip313 · Mar 8, 2013

Bleach a test cup with h2o2 a couple drops 35%

Lucas Formula and Method(s): Step by Step

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