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What changes did you make to go from 1 to 2 pounds per 1000w light?
- Thread starter Biologist
- Start date
1. Identify your limiting factors and improve them. No point adding CO2 if your lighting is at 300μmol/m2, and no point having μmol/m2 lights if you you don't have CO2, and no point buying lights or co2 if your temps and vpd aren't under control, etc etc....
2. Rock solid consistency. Automation is your friend here.
2. Rock solid consistency. Automation is your friend here.
I am not pulling 2 lb. per light. But in my opinion the single biggest difference I see in super high yielding gardens is canopy management. Learning the plants you are working with so you can the most well lit bud sites and no larf.
Absolem
Active member
The biggest change needed is in ones thinking about growing. Understanding the big picture and how all the little pieces fit in place to get the most out of your plants.
It takes being on your A game from the moment clones are taken to the day the plants are harvested.
The people who tend to suffer from mediocre yields are the ones who change stuff every harvest with no understanding how those changes may negatively effect the grow later on.
Lets take a world renowned chef who gives 10 average cooks the recipe to one of their famous entrees. Ingredients needed, cook time, etc.
When the average cooks try and replicate what our famous chef does none will get the same quality food as the chef. Even if they have all the information. Does this mean the chef gave the people the wrong or bad information? Hell no.
I see so much great advice on this site from growers. When people take their advice and fail they blame the advice instead of themselves. Another thing I notice is they take the excellent knowledge and change it ever so little........in their minds but in reality the minor changes have drastic effects.
If you find a grower on here willing to help take their advice and follow it to a T. Then the person helping can start to rule out what is causing problems in people's grows and they start to rule out what is going wrong.
The one thing I've found in the cannabis community is they are the worst direction followers out there. If a top notch grower says use 1 gram of a product the cannabis community will add 2 grams. They take about 70% of what a person says then they wonder why the grow didn't go like the person they asked.
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I don't believe a 1000w light has any use on it's own. It's the first thing to change. If you continue, you end up with a light so high, it's covering a useful area, plus a huge peripheral area that's useless. 1000s are for installations where you have many lights in as row, so they all support their neighbours. Leaving the outer edge of the space as the only weak area.
We can move forward though, by putting it on a light mover. Allowing a lower mounting position. Giving us tighter control of it's spread.
Now we have 2 meters illuminated to around 50,000 lux. Perhaps a space 1.8 x 1.2 to make use of the common material lengths of 1.8 and 2.44 To give (calculator) 2.16 meters. That's a serviceable space. It will try and lump up in the middle, but it's only a short reach for training purposes. Which you must do, or you will be setting your lights for the taller canopy under the lamps track. Causing the outer edges to drop below a useful level of illumination. That would be half your space growing stuff to fill your waste bin. Canopy management to ensure good use of your light is a must.
So we know how to use our silly light. What shape we want this to take. And have a figure of 16oz per meter to reach.
This is a seed vendors site, so lets go with seeds. They need to reach a fair level of maturity before flowering, so we won't fit in 16 per meter. You can try, but it's just not needed. We don't even need 9. Our meter is 1.2 x 0.9 so I would give each 45cm x 40cm of space. 6 per meter. Maximum. Because filling that space is just a case of letting them grow 6" too tall, and snapping them down to size once. With just minimal training you could have 4 plants per meter instead. Which I would rather do.
Now the number of plants has a great effect on the shape of the task ahead. It has bugger all effect on the weight though. Not in this grow. 4 plants, 6, 9, jungle of nightmares, same yield. We will have a 2 meter carpet of buds at the end. The number of pots isn't relevant.
Now to pick seeds.
The seed business has a number of operators that stay hidden from any governing body. Operators who are not law abiding citizens. Some may be outright liars. Entire seed banks have popped up selling hemp to people that won't do anything about it. It's entirely plausible that the advertised expected yield might be massaged a bit. At some seed banks it's quite obvious, that everything they do is 30% better than other banks. Which isn't possible. This leaves the other banks needing to compete, to get perhaps better stock to you. You might, just might, find a little massaging of the figure's is done at even reputable outlets. Which stops us buying from the outright liars, who sell just lies.
This means, we can't pick seeds rated at 16oz per meter. They likely won't do it. And we ourselves may only perform at 80%. We need the seeds that are reported around 20-25oz per meter. Then we can expect that 16oz. Don't get the 30-35oz seeds though. There is no golden egg.
OG Kush is a big producer with credibility. That's why it's been crossed with so many low yielding pucker varieties. Critical Mass is another big producer, bred with lots of pucker to increase the puckers weight. Both of these are perfectly good on their own, and will bring in the numbers. It's why everyone breeds with them, looking for their own golden egg. There is no hype coming from me here. Just facts you can see. Another choice would be SK#1 or one of it's many phenotypes that have been isolated. It's not the current flavour right now, but the wheel will come around again. It's sativa content leads to a shorter growth time than the other two. It soon reaches the screen height, with little branching on the way up, that often gets removed anyway. You can flick the switch to flower, knowing it will at least double in size. So using 4 per meter offers little risk of canopy gaps. It will reach out for them.
Posts too long... Gotta stop somewhere..
We can move forward though, by putting it on a light mover. Allowing a lower mounting position. Giving us tighter control of it's spread.
Now we have 2 meters illuminated to around 50,000 lux. Perhaps a space 1.8 x 1.2 to make use of the common material lengths of 1.8 and 2.44 To give (calculator) 2.16 meters. That's a serviceable space. It will try and lump up in the middle, but it's only a short reach for training purposes. Which you must do, or you will be setting your lights for the taller canopy under the lamps track. Causing the outer edges to drop below a useful level of illumination. That would be half your space growing stuff to fill your waste bin. Canopy management to ensure good use of your light is a must.
So we know how to use our silly light. What shape we want this to take. And have a figure of 16oz per meter to reach.
This is a seed vendors site, so lets go with seeds. They need to reach a fair level of maturity before flowering, so we won't fit in 16 per meter. You can try, but it's just not needed. We don't even need 9. Our meter is 1.2 x 0.9 so I would give each 45cm x 40cm of space. 6 per meter. Maximum. Because filling that space is just a case of letting them grow 6" too tall, and snapping them down to size once. With just minimal training you could have 4 plants per meter instead. Which I would rather do.
Now the number of plants has a great effect on the shape of the task ahead. It has bugger all effect on the weight though. Not in this grow. 4 plants, 6, 9, jungle of nightmares, same yield. We will have a 2 meter carpet of buds at the end. The number of pots isn't relevant.
Now to pick seeds.
The seed business has a number of operators that stay hidden from any governing body. Operators who are not law abiding citizens. Some may be outright liars. Entire seed banks have popped up selling hemp to people that won't do anything about it. It's entirely plausible that the advertised expected yield might be massaged a bit. At some seed banks it's quite obvious, that everything they do is 30% better than other banks. Which isn't possible. This leaves the other banks needing to compete, to get perhaps better stock to you. You might, just might, find a little massaging of the figure's is done at even reputable outlets. Which stops us buying from the outright liars, who sell just lies.
This means, we can't pick seeds rated at 16oz per meter. They likely won't do it. And we ourselves may only perform at 80%. We need the seeds that are reported around 20-25oz per meter. Then we can expect that 16oz. Don't get the 30-35oz seeds though. There is no golden egg.
OG Kush is a big producer with credibility. That's why it's been crossed with so many low yielding pucker varieties. Critical Mass is another big producer, bred with lots of pucker to increase the puckers weight. Both of these are perfectly good on their own, and will bring in the numbers. It's why everyone breeds with them, looking for their own golden egg. There is no hype coming from me here. Just facts you can see. Another choice would be SK#1 or one of it's many phenotypes that have been isolated. It's not the current flavour right now, but the wheel will come around again. It's sativa content leads to a shorter growth time than the other two. It soon reaches the screen height, with little branching on the way up, that often gets removed anyway. You can flick the switch to flower, knowing it will at least double in size. So using 4 per meter offers little risk of canopy gaps. It will reach out for them.
Posts too long... Gotta stop somewhere..
gorilla ganja
Well-known member
These 2 quotes really say it all. It's not rocket science or magic, just the basics applied well.
Peace GG
GENETICS
Canopy management is up there on the list- if you can imagine a trellis with 4" squares hanging over the plants your going to want bud sites in just about every square to achieve 2lbs+ per light. Proper pruning and training really ties into canopy management, as well as understanding how many plants vs veg time and the stretch characteristics of each particular strain.
IMO the MOST important aspect of success is building proper environments. Plenty of air movement makes for healthy plants, and proper VPD levels with stable humidity provides maximum growth and reduces pest pressures. You want 800-1000 uMol at the canopy for best flower.
IMO the MOST important aspect of success is building proper environments. Plenty of air movement makes for healthy plants, and proper VPD levels with stable humidity provides maximum growth and reduces pest pressures. You want 800-1000 uMol at the canopy for best flower.
First dial your room. Coco or hydro. Soil you will need to veg for a few months and grow trees.Temps lights, ventilation, etc. Get that so your room doesn't change regardless of outside temps. Once that's done add the co2.
Now for the most important, genetics. Once your grow space is dialed in find genetics that are capable of yielding those numbers. 100% for sure, White Russian serious seeds. Easy to get two pounds a light. Don't think you will get two lb with cookies.
Lastly 1000hps for the win. I have not seen anything yet out perform a 1k.
Good luck!
Now for the most important, genetics. Once your grow space is dialed in find genetics that are capable of yielding those numbers. 100% for sure, White Russian serious seeds. Easy to get two pounds a light. Don't think you will get two lb with cookies.
Lastly 1000hps for the win. I have not seen anything yet out perform a 1k.
Good luck!
White Beard
Active member
From my armchair over here, it seems that in order to have consistency, one would need to do three grows, echo with the same everything. Even without meaning to change anything, humans are variable enough by ourselves: we can change the outcomes ourselves just by being more practiced. Human performance improves quickly and markedly with practice, so I’d be looking to run the same setup with the same seeds (strain, batch, vendor), looking for less-variable results each time.
After 3 runs, I’d think you’d have the drill down and could then start tweaking individual factors in successive grows going forward.
Does that make sense?
After 3 runs, I’d think you’d have the drill down and could then start tweaking individual factors in successive grows going forward.
Does that make sense?
Sorry buddy. CO2 enrichment isn't needed at all. The police in the UK expect everyone to make that yield, based on their findings at the scene of many grows. Personally, I have not yeilded so low since a major disaster about 15 years ago.
New growers is the right place for this topic. I do remember my first hydro grows getting 12oz per meter, using 400w in shades made from old fridge linings. NFT and a cooker hood extractor for 4 lights was streets ahead of other growers around me. The expectations here are low. Although I could quite easily pick plants that would perform poorly, if weight is the only measure.
Our skills, like someone said, are used to create the right environment. We can also train plants to fill it. It's the plants that grow the buds though. We don't make plants. We just choose them. Some are rated around 12oz per meter, meaning you would be damn lucky to get 12oz. Others are rated at double that, so should do 16oz easily.
Barnies are on the list here, so I should be ok to talk of them. They took a big kush and crossed it with the afore mentioned cookes to create the cookies kush. It's rated around 600g per meter, and I just put up some pics in the barnies photo thread. It's a bit open in it's bud structure like kush tends to be for me. It's my lowest yielding variety at around 5.5oz each, but I'm putting 4 in a meter. It's easy doing the required 16oz asked for. But the Kush mum does about 7. I would be 20% down using a 1000 over 2 meters though. More inline with the requirements here.
1000w is a very big light for a newbie to handle. I couldn't wait to get rid of mine, and wouldn't have them back. I melted a shade with one ffs. I came back to find the alloy drooped over the lamp like a wet face cloth. There is a big movement of people moving from 1000w son's to 630w chm lamps. Which isn't only driven by the lower number of phonto's.. the 630 emits. I believe the fact is we would all like a 12" penis, and believe it's much better than our 9. But if we actually had 12" our girls would run away and hide, because we would hurt them with it. Insisting that it was better. When actually some girls would prefer an asian penis.
anyone read that book 3lb a light curious if it was legit
Getting a 2lbs per light with no CO2 is simple if your entire goal is to get some arbitrary number. Just doing the old 2004 era vertical cylinder with a large 8 foot radius and 2000w in the middle will yield over 4 pounds no problem. 5 or 6 is very doable. The thing is you'll get a lot per light but less total out the space than you would with other methods.
Back when that was the new hype I set up a room with two of those circles (so 4k of lights) and got 8.5 on the first run, 10.5 on the second once I knew what it would run like. No CO2, no additives beyond basic GH lucas formula. That sounds great right? But I could've easily got 12+ out of the same space if I did a boring old horizontal grow with a lot more lights so like I said before it all depends on what you limiting factors are. If I was limited to 4k of lights that would've been the strat, but since I wasn't there was better ways to go.
Are you limited to certain amount of space? Are you limited to a certain amperage on your board? Are you limited by temperature? Are you limited to a specific set of equipment because there's no budget right now to add/upgrade? There's no shortcut where you can just take something that improved someone else's grow and then copy it. You have to do the math of your own situation and make changes that will cause an improvement given your specific limiting factors.
bsgospel
Bat Macumba
Nope. It's a picture book. And the growers don't even do the things they say to in the book. May as well have made it all up.
Genetics and patience are 2 more important factors- a ton of people, myself included, are constantly running new genetics just out of human curiosity. This is fun, but to really start cranking out 2.5lb a light you need to run your strains a few times before you really understand how they like to be pruned and trained, if they have any nutrient sensitivities, etc...
i figured it was bs
