SWC Tub's

been working on the these tubs for a while. hardest part was finding something non toxic to waterproof the lids i fabricated out of 1/2'' birch. after numerous venues, a 2-part epoxy properly cured works marvelously, and should last almost a lifetime.

i cut the 4x8' sheet in half for 2 4x4' sections that would have 16 5.5'' sites per piece. these lids would then sit over a shallow hydro tub with a 1-2'' gap from the bottom of the net pots to the tub. i wanted these system to be as versatile as dwc is in regards to allowed temps(70f-90f) and the efficiency of a rdwc system without root rot issues running multiple sites. using a 1k hps per 4x4' swc tub for a total of 4k in the flower room. decided on 16 sites; figure at least 1 ounce per site, the worst i could do is 1lb per light, even though im sure final weight will be much better.


after drilling the holes in each section, i sanded the cuts baby smooth, as this would be a point of contact that any water intrusion would ruin the lid. painted first couple of coats with latex acrylic, both sides, then for the wet side down i used 2 coats of the epoxy. then i braced the lid with pvc pipe accordingly. all too familiar with buckling with big plants. wanted this system to be as simple and pain free as possible.


each tub holds around 50-60 gallons, and will be heated by a 200w heater and 2 60g air pumps. water temps will be a constant 78f. running kali mist, white russian, ELE(ak47 pheno), serious 4 & serious 6, and double dutch.




here are 2 lids finished.



used epoxy glue for the braces. strong stuff, i can pick up the entire lid by a piece of brace and trying to shake it off- it doesnt even budge.

that looks awesome lets see some ladies in there now

shit yeah
totally digging your setup
how shallow will your shallow water tubs be
top feeds like med man or something else
how much light for each tray???
damn i cant wait to see it come together

by shallow i mean just enough water to immerse the pots, each net pot sits roughly 1'' above the bottom of the tray. its basically dwc except much less water. here is one tub i finished last night of kali mist. PH is 6.0 and EC of 1.15, even though thats still a little high for these sativas. next tub is of ELE, which god knows im the most excited about. she is an ak47 pheno of unmatched quality... 1 hit and she will wipe you off the face of the planet, completely lost in space. also doing a tub of double dutch and some ak47 fems i picked up. the 4th tub will be mostly white russian, serious 4 and serious 6.

each 4x4' tub will have its own 1k hps. there will be 4 tubs with a total of 4k for flowering. im tinkering with another 4x6' tub for a 72 site sog that i will attempt to get 4lbs from a 1k. the 72 site lid is in 2 3x4' sections with 32 5'' holes per section. let me tell you, using a 5'' hole saw to cut 72 holes is a fucking art form.

you using airstones, how many do you use, what size??

man that looks great!
Cant wait to see how well she performs.

I think your going to be topping off quite frequently. Why are you heating the water?

singularity said:

been working on the these tubs for a while. hardest part was finding something non toxic to waterproof the lids i fabricated out of 1/2'' birch. after numerous venues, a 2-part epoxy properly cured works marvelously, and should last almost a lifetime.

Click to expand...

Excellent solution, very strong work!

I really like the idea of making a waterproof, durable, non-toxic, easily cleaned, lid/tray cover. I have drawn up several designs for a lid myself; but the cost of suitable wood or foam, sealant, and Epoxy resin in addition to labor makes all of my designs/ideas seem relatively expensive. In addition to wood/foam, sealant, and resin; in my experience, laying out the hole pattern and getting holes cut and smooth requires a significant investment in time with any material. I personally can not picture completing a lid with less than 8hrs of labor; unless producing several at once by drilling two or more in one shot. But I have only thought about it, you actually did Work!

If you don't mind answering some questions to help make my estimations more accurate, I would be forever grateful...

1. Do you have any experience or opinions about using coroplast(plastic cardboard) as a lid material? I ask because I believe MedMan's "MFT-tables" use coroplast as a lid material. Coroplast looks like it eliminates the need to use sealant or epoxy resins. Although I believe some structural support is required to prevent sagging.

2. Do you have any opinions regarding the use of 2"thick,4'x8' sheets of rigid foam insulation(Blue/pink 40psi) as a lid, laminated with epoxy+ possibly fiberglass or Carbon fiber cloth. I like the idea of insulating the root zone from heat/light.?too much labor compared to covering wood with reflectix i think?

3. How many ounces of resin did one of your 4x4 lids require?
**I have been estimating the amount of resin, by using the **weight of 4oz. fiberglass cloth required to cover the area...
** so approx. 5-6ounces resin per side for first coat, 50% for 2nd.
** My estimations use 4oz cloth+resin, seems high for just resin?

4. What brand and type of epoxy would you recommend for one of your 4x4 lids? Just two part laminating resin such as: West System, MGS, or Tap plastics? I feel like reinforced mold making resin, like an aluminum reinforced surface coat may be overkill by a very large margin. I just hate having to do work twice...

5. What is your opinion regarding the use of polyester resin vs. epoxy? Polyester Offgassing maybe?

6. How many hours of labor per 4x4 lid?
7. In your opinion, does it seem possible to tack multiple 4x4 lids together and drill 4 or more sheets/lids at once?


I mention the amount of work and money because i recently realized that a Botanicare 4'x4' flood tray lid w/o holes is $120ish.

Botanicare gives you the option of 16 or 64 sites, all centered and dimpled for quick/easy drilling with appropriate size hole saw. It appears that 3.75" netpots will fit into the pre-marked 64 site lid. Using 3" round netpots it may be possible to have nearly 144 sites in this lid if desired.
The lid also adds two inches of height providing 8-9" of separation between the underside of lid and tray bottom. This extra volume and height not only provides a larger buffer in terms of root zone environment, but also provides enough vertical clearance to add aeroponic misters inside the root zone more comfortably.
When fed by a dedicated high pressure pump from the common reservoir, the Aeroponic system in the root zone can function as a primary,secondary, and/or back-up nutrient delivery system.

I bought one to test recently, and I have to say, it is a nice lid if you have a Botanicare sized 4x4 tray, and extra cash.

I am currently building the test system to have both a 1/4" top-feed line/adj.-dripper at each site, connected to a main 1/2" drip loop fed by a dedicated pump in the reservoir for each 4x4 tray with 64 3.75" net pots. Basically a copy of the NFT feed system used in MedMan's "MFT-tables," with the addition of Aeroponic high pressure MistHeads to provide complete control of environment under the lid(not constant feed) and also add redundancy in the form of an independent feed system. Possibly with the use of a humidistat in the root zone to activate mist heads only when required? Top feed will be constant flow with individual adjustment at each location via adjustable flow drippers?

Sorry for the novel, and thank you for the inspiration to fabricate at least one lid of my own.
H

dubwise- im excited, too. to have an idea for years and finally aquire the resources to at least attempt it is extremely gratifying. now, whether it works or not, remains to be seen. while i am confident it will, i am also accepting if it fails. even miserably. then i will have an answer, which all i really want. these plants are actually a little bigger than i would intend to use for this system. ive had to move recently when i discovered the cop down the street moved up to k9 unit, and here i was 1 block away banging 90 plants. dueces lol.


socialist- yes, maybe even twice a day. this factor is an aspect of swc, ive noticed amazing growth when my clones outgrew their 2x2' tubs and were cycling water and nutes so fast everytime i topped off i had to use 100-150% nutes. ive never flowered this way, nor built something like this to use in this capacity. my goal is to have a sog with 16 colas that provide at least an ounce per site, giving at the bare minimum, a content 1lb. i say content, but i secretly aspire for it to work as well as 2lbs, but this is only wishful thinking.

flying high- i faced palm'ed so hard when you told me about the lids from botanicare, only because i thought, if these works, im rich, bitch! one thing these lids have over anything available currently is durability, which after years of growing, is not something to be neglected. the countless examples of mega hydro plants buckling lids and tops, tying up massive buds so they dont topple over, as left me wanting a system that was as simple as it was fool proof. im 6ft and 200lbs and i can walk on the lid easily to grab a corner plant. the tubs are nothing more than a shallow dwc bucket with multiple sites. no pumps, no recirculating water,
dont have to worry so much about water temps or root rot. i keep my res at 78-80f because thats where ive noticed the best growth. plus in this system, i always get rot anything below 71-69f.


the epoxy was a 2 part paint, i used rustoleum epoxy for garage floors. its water based and chemically inert when it cures, then once cured 100% water/chemical proof. first step to making hte lid was aligning the holes. everyone i consulted with suggested smaller net pots, but i wanted something to anchor the plant down to the lid, because even these small colas will be heavy and i dont want them slipping or tipping over. so i used the 5.5 heavy duty. after aligning the holes, i used the hole saw to center and predrill the guide bit. then i cut the holes, then sanded the cuts perfectly smooth, as to not catch the roots when i took out plants and because any nicks in the wood would be a point of contact with the net pots, and after awhile wear down the epoxy and let water intrude int othe wood. which then would warp, causing the epoxy to crack and come off. which leads us to the next phase, painting with acrylic latex, between 3-5 coats both sides. used a 3'' roller for the holes, worked nicely, even with the epoxy. after that, epoxy the wet side down and then glue on braces. the epoxy has to cure for 5-7 days to become completely inert. after that, its almost indestructable and should last a lifetime. ive contemplated using aero and drippers, but that takes away from the versatility of the system in regards to how effortless i wanted this to operate. for myself, at least.

1. my friend wanted to use abs? plastic, however, all the examples he showed me were too flimsy imo. the epoxy was expensive, $80+, but it will last a years.

2. yes, you could use foam. i was wary of it before i found epoxy as a sealer, but as long as it was sealed and no water intrusion it would be fine. mold grows fast in foam, so do a good job!

3. i would say you could do 4 lids with 2 heavy coats each with 1 gallon of 2part epoxy paint.

4. any non colored 2 part epoxy works. coloring adds chemicals that will slowly but surely leach out. most of the information i used gathering ideas came from forums on reef keeping. i figured if it was safe for something as fragile as coral and exotic fish, it would be even more so harmless to my girls.

5. the epoxy is chemical resistant, not sure about the other.

6. lol oh man! i would say actual work- 6 hours. the worst is waiting for the paint to dry between coats.

7. yes, but no more than anything exceeding 1'' using a hand drill. only because extracting the wood from the saw would be a pain in the ass. if you had a press you could do has many as you wanted.




one thing i smiled about, was the acknowledgement after posting the lids, it would be only a matter of time before someone did it different/better. which is enouraging to me, because thats what i love most about this site, sharing ideas and always following the path of truth, one brick at a time. i finished another tub, this is of ELE, my prized ak47 pheno.

yes, i use 2 60g air pumps, each one is a dual hose for a total of 4 airstones per tub. and the tubs are only around 30 gallon, found this out filling them. then 1 200w water heater.

cool setup bro will be keento see how things turn out for yourself bro

what kinda/brand air stone specifically do you use??

also, how do you drain the tubs for fresh newts
thanks and good luck with the grow awesome setup!

top fin stones only, most all others are shit. you can get them in a pack of 6, i think. i change them out every week, otherwise they clog. no draining, water will cycle fast enough that water changes aren required.

love the idea of using the trays i was thinking about doing the same myself but im thinkin rswc might be a better way to go love ur lids mate might look into the same thing not really a fan of the plastic lids had more then enuff netpots fall through when they have weight

check out the buckling lids on those plants- been there and DONE with that.

Singularity, thank you very much for answering all of my questions; I appreciate your help immensely! Not enough people design and build for long term use and efficiency, I really like your lid designs durability. Also like the flexibility cutting your own allows in regard to size.
I just can't picture how I could efficiently lay-up eight lids at once... Location is the other hurdle because of the amount of space required to hang the sheets between/after paint/epoxy application; I would not be able to build these on site ...

The omnipresent time/money calculator in my brain has been spinning on this for a few days now, and I still can't decide if it is cheaper to buy or build what I need? I really want to build my own to exact fit; but the price of Botanicare's lid is dangerously close to the cost of materials, maybe less if you factor labor at the snail's pace I work

Thanks again... I'll post pictures if I decide to fabricate lids

more than welcome! last grow, once again, massive issues with plants toppling over/buckling/stem snapping, and i swore next round that shit would cease and desist. unlike college, i held true to my word this time and shot for something realistic. these lids are bad ass, if only that aboslutely nothing- i mean, NOTHING, is going to structurally fail on this grow. pest, disease, armageddon, ex wife, these are all more pertinent variables for failure than something collapsing or tipping.

i was gunna say arent u worried about that tray being overfull from root growth i know with dwc they get outa hand, bit of a worry to me but i hope im wrong because im looking at the same setup as u after deciding against a aero setup with the table, anyways Update update update! lol