Honeycomb Oil BHO Budder Wax

purrpullkush · Mar 13, 2011

Hey,
I have been seeing Budder / Wax around the Bay Area Cannabis Clubs that looks like honeycomb.
Here is a youtube video showing the stuff I am talking about:

http://youtu.be/Aso0jDXSQ8k

This stuff is obviously BHO, everything about it is exactly like your traditional budder/earwax except this honeycomb thing. Does anyone know how they are achieving this honeycomb look? I'm guessing its something to do with heating/cooling/aeration but I'd love to hear what anyone thinks or knows about the subject.

dope_roor · Mar 13, 2011

some oils just do that overnight. usually the ones that budder up automatically. possibly residual butane or something in the oil that evaporates as it sits overnight. could be some other component evaporating/dehydrating. sorry i don't have an exact answer not 100% myself

blood-shot-red · Mar 13, 2011

purrpullkush said:
Does anyone know how they are achieving this honeycomb look? I'm guessing its something to do with heating/cooling/aeration but I'd love to hear what anyone thinks or knows about the subject.

I don't know how they do it but i can take an educated guess.

1. The honeycomb structure is made by gas bubbles forming inside the wax.
2. The bubbles do not collapse or move(as in carbonated drinks). This indicates that it happens at relatively low temperatures.
3. The degassing takes place faster than regular diffusion to the surface.
4. It is quite a lot of work foaming this up with a gas like nitrogen. Wouldn't make sense to to me

So I suppose it is regular good quality BHO, degassed under vacuum. This lowers the boiling point of the butane(in mixture) and it bubbles out without the wax melting.

medicalgreen · Mar 13, 2011

blood-shot-red said:
I don't know how they do it but i can take an educated guess.

1. The honeycomb structure is made by gas bubbles forming inside the wax.
2. The bubbles do not collapse or move(as in carbonated drinks). This indicates that it happens at relatively low temperatures.
3. The degassing takes place faster than regular diffusion to the surface.
4. It is quite a lot of work foaming this up with a gas like nitrogen. Wouldn't make sense to to me

So I suppose it is regular good quality BHO, degassed under vacuum. This lowers the boiling point of the butane(in mixture) and it bubbles out without the wax melting.

Agreed 100%. albeit, i'm sure it's made from decent quality bud to begin with, includes small popcorn, BTW.
It's poorly purged BHO, whipped up, with Butane caught in between the bubble bursts, and slowly purged, but not completely or efficiently, so as to leave the structure intact, as it cools, with bubbles slowly escaping. A CHEAP way to make a fancy looking, but poorly purged BHO. Still retains butane I would imagine, and that is the reason it always decays rapidly, as far as strength and flavor. Some of the worst, but looks cool enough to try, and if you get it fast and early, it can still be a BHO blessing.

Around 2002, this stuff, or something similar, called "peanut budder" started popping up in the bay area clubs. It was also poorly purged, but slightly less "whipped". It crackled every time you hit it. From remnants of Butane. of course. Still, 3rd street carried it and sold out all the time, and it was a favorite around town for a long time. Most likely made from a slightly less quality material than the latest Budder is now a days. Some Budder is even purged very well, but still retains it's physical characteristics. Undoubtedly, there is still butane caught in the material. But i'm not sure of that.

Now that I look at it again, YES, it's likely done with a vacuum purge, at about 30, with BUD.
I have a commercial vacuum that pulls 30. It's a food sealer, but high quality, I got for this purpose. That's what it does to the material. Most likely they start from good bud to begin with, thouth. It never fully purges the material though, or it takes many sessions. There are better ways.

Budder Shatter is BHetter!

Bottom Left = Budderscotch

purrpullkush · Mar 18, 2011

Appreciate the responses, anyone else with any experience, insight, or theories?

Tela · Mar 21, 2011

some people i know, that's all they smoke. ive been trying to figure it out for awhile how to make it. best smoked on plain white ashes. usually tastes bomb. the better stuff tastes better than plain oil. easy to handle. flies off the shelf

cured2perfect · Jun 5, 2011

lol this is an easy one guys.. when im done purging my budder and im ready to take off my dish from the double broiler and let it sit i put another dish right over it it bakes it all the way through as it cools off and can look like that if u leave alot of lil bubbles in it before letting it rest it happens to me quite often hope this helps.. experiment with putting lids over the dish when letting it sit
half the time i dont even need to scrape my dish i can just roll it all right off and roll it around with my hand
EVERY RUN I MAKE IS WITH FLOWERS NOT TRIM

Tripsick · Jun 5, 2011

mine does that all the time... it happens when you purge with low heat.

and then if you dont pop all the bubbles that are mostly terps they do that hole look as it sits in the open.

i call it auto waxing.. High Quality buds will do that.

stevefrench · Jun 5, 2011

made a good few runs of BHO/budder myself and my guess is that it might be BHO that is purged and then heated up again until it bubbles then flash frozen/thrown in the freezer

that oil posted above does look very similar though.

jump117 · Jun 5, 2011

Tripsick said:
all the bubbles that are mostly terps

No offense to adherents of this view, could you give convincing arguments for this assertion?

Whether it is time to recognize the error of this view?

Excuse me. Thank you.

dope_roor · Jun 5, 2011

jump117 said:
No offense to adherents of this view, could you give convincing arguments for this assertion?

Whether it is time to recognize the error of this view?

Excuse me. Thank you.

yea seriously someone needs to look into this. noticed another thread on this site with someone claiming terpes which was clearly unpurged oil, didn't wanna hate tho

there may be some truth to the statement but it is clearly overused as an excuse

Gray Wolf · Jun 5, 2011

dope_roor said:
yea seriously someone needs to look into this. noticed another thread on this site with someone claiming terpes which was clearly unpurged oil, didn't wanna hate tho

there may be some truth to the statement but it is clearly overused as an excuse

May I third that insightful observation?

The turpeens and the cannabinoids are all aromatic *(benzene ring) hydrocarbons, so they steadily give off molecules of themselves, hence their being classified as aromatic.

Heating speeds up that process, but molecules are pretty small and of themselves, do not produce bubbles and heating them up to boiling point so that they do, would most likely result in them boiling off in fractional distillation order.

Some turpeens would indeed leave before the cannabinoids and some afterwards, but no major ones besides Caryophyllene at 246F, boil under 300F, so where is the boiling occurring below that temperature?

I see three other possible sources, besides turpeens. One is retained solvent of course, and the ones that I think sometimes get called turpeens besides residual solvent out gassing, are water vapor and the C02 bubbles from decarboxylation.

I've noted in my processes at least, that the solvent bubbles tend to be larger and of multiple sizes, where water vapor smaller and less so, and the C02 bubbles are very small and of more even size.

Turpene bubbles should also ostensibly be flammable, as all of the cannabinoids and turpeens are flammable hydrocarbons.

Note the difference when purging a pool of oil in a 250F hot oil bath, if you wave a flame over the top of the pool when the large bubbles are forming, it will flash and later when there are only small bubbles left it will not.

What gases are ostensibly present in quantities large enough to produce simmering size bubbles that don't burn, besides water vapor and C02?

I have always inferred (ass-u-me?) that it was C02 at those temperatures, but never took the time to fractionally distill it to prove it to myself one way or the other.

Not to say that heating below 300F doesn't significantly reduce the levels of turpeens, because the rate that aromatic hydrocarbons give off molecules dramatically increases with heat all the way up to their exploding into bubbles at boiling point, so what has worked best for me thus far when I am trying to preserve the maximum turpeen flavors, is using freshest frozen material possible and the least amount of heat in processing.

More to the question at hand however, perhaps we could demonstrate what it is not easier than what it is. IE: whether it is flammable or not. Put some in a test tube with a pipette in the one hole stopper, stick it in a hot oil bath, and see if the discharge from the pipette burns as it exits.

* I usually avoid using the word benzene on public forum, because it scares the shit out of everyone in the same breath as health, but having a benzene ring simply means the molecule is in ring form.

It is called a benzene ring because the ring form of the aromatic hydrocarbon molecules was first discovered analyzing benzene.

purrpullkush · Jul 14, 2011

Just curious if anyone has had any other personal experiences with this honeycomb thing. Still seems a little bit mysterious, and I am wondering whatthe important variables are as far as genetics, temperatures, etc etc.

Logan710 · Feb 5, 2013

It's a vacuume purge process the air is being sucked from the degassing chamber making the errl bubble once purged fully will dry with the bubble holes still

HighBurn8 · Feb 14, 2013

purrpullkush said:
Just curious if anyone has had any other personal experiences with this honeycomb thing. Still seems a little bit mysterious, and I am wondering whatthe important variables are as far as genetics, temperatures, etc etc.

.... the mystery is to simply fuck up your oil.

420mike · Feb 14, 2013

I have seen the honeycomb thing in some shops but never tried it. Upon closer examination it just looks poorly purged to me.

Infinitesimal · Feb 14, 2013

I have heard people that make high quality shatter say that most shatter will honey comb over time and from the outside-in... which I have observed once or twice through me making small small batches, and led me to believe it was likely do to oxidation of the resins... similarly observed in pressed hash where the resin glands have been ruptured by pressure as apposed to a solvent extraction in this case.

but I have no data to back this up, its just my ideas

BassDrip · Feb 26, 2013

haha i made the stuff in that vid the OP posted!

BassDrip · Feb 26, 2013

its all about low heat, whipping, and patience to get the honeycomb look. knowing when to stop whipping as well if you really want a lot of "honeycomb" holes

akula · Feb 26, 2013

A long steady vacuum purge with top of the line set-up seems to be the key. Here is a decent but long video on how one guy does it. I think with a longer vacuum purge he would of had better results.

http://youtu.be/9tEVOq4Fd_Q

http://youtu.be/En6V3pnUMMM

Honeycomb Oil BHO Budder Wax

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