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GreenintheThumb

fuck the ticket, bought the ride
Veteran
Not in the DUDs unless it's one of these:

If possible, try to get pictures of eggs if you believe they reproduce in cannabis, as none of the literature supports this. You can do it with your scope. A single female lays between 200-500 eggs, so ought to be easy to find with the scope.
Alfalfa Stem Nematode (ASN) may not reproduce in Cannabis but what about the other 20 races of Ditylenchus Dipsaci besides ASN?
That is what I was saying do likely reproduce in Cannabis. The eggs are small and do not wiggle so hard to see. A lab will answer this for us. Please someone send a sample with nematodes in to be ID and to tell if they Ditylenchus Dipsaci reproduce in Cannabis or not. I will bet they can, not ASN but one or more of the other 20 races of Ditylenchus Dipsaci.
If the lab can't tell the race of Ditylenchus Dipsaci have them send it to a nematode expert for the ID, they can send just the nematode that is legal every where and even federally funded labs can take them and ID them for the A L & L folks if they send them in.
-SamS

I do not see it.
I have varieties that have overlapping blades, they do not have BM. I know Cannabis pests better then anyone I have ever met, I fought them for decades using IPM, and am very sucessful. I did write a book about Cannabis and pests.
If this plant has a virus or other pathogen spread by broad mites, I don't see it. I do not see any BM damage, but I would need to use a scope and check out the leaves undersides. Yes, viruses and other pathogens can be spread by seed, but remember many Cannabis viruses are symtom free in Cannabis. If it is a disease then maybe farmers in Colorado can go to the Colorado State Department of Agriculture Biochemistry Laboratory and ask for help, they can ID BM and/or maybe find if the plant has a virus, from here I am just guessing.
Maybe in Calif you can use state Agri labs like the State Plant Health & Pest Prevention Service that will help with Cannabis grown by legal medical users? I do not know, but it can't be hard to check, give them a call.
I use the state agri labs here in the Netherlands, they have helped quite a bit in the past. I also worked closely with Kopert here, they tested several new controls with Cannabis in my greenhouse before introducing the controls to everyone.
Good luck, and do not presume you know the problem or the solutions, find the problem then find solutions, if there are any.
-SamS

OTHER POTENTIAL CAUSES OF DUDS BESIDES BROAD MITES, CYCLEMEN MITES, RUSSET MITES:


Quote:
Originally Posted by xxxstr8edgexxx View Post
virus can be cleared in a lab setting

Which viruses, which lab? How do they confirm the plant had a virus and confirm it is now gone? I know it can be done in theory.
Cannabis can get a lot of viruses....
Most info from the book "Hemp Diseases and Pests"

VIRUSES:
TRSV, Tobacco Ringspot Virus ELISA, nematode spreads and a little by insects
TSV, Tobacco Streak Virus Thrips
TomRSV, Tomato RingSpot Virus PCR, Yellow Vein — Tomato ringspot virus — ToRSV
 causes yellow vein disease. A similar disease is caused by tobacco ringspot virus. These viruses are transmitted by several species of nematodes including X. americanum, X. californicum,
and X. rivesi.
CMV, Cucumber Mosaic Virus ELISA, PCR, aphids, nematodes? seeds can transmit
ERSV, Eunoymous Ring Spot Virus
AMV, Alfalfa Mosaic Virus ELISA, aphids, seeds can transmit, Envirologix kit maybe? http://www.envirologix.com/artman/pu...lantpath.shtml
http://www.envirologix.com/artman/pu...icle_370.shtml
EMV, Elm Mosaic Virus
TMV, Tobacco Mosaic Virus PCR,
FMV, Foxtail Mosaic Virus
BBWV, Broad Bean Wilt fabaVirus ELISA,
ArMV, Arabis Mosaic Virus ELISA, PCR, Several nematode species can transmit
ArMV the most common being Xiphinema diversicaudatum. seeds can transmit
HSV, Hemp Streak Virus, seeds can transmit
RRV, Rasberry RingSpot nepoVirus “nepovirus” “ne” for nematode, “po” for polyhedral.
PVX, Potato Virus X ELISA,
PVY, Potato Virus Y ELISA,
HMV, Hemp Mosaic Virus, seeds can transmit

Spread by plant sap, pollen, seeds, insects even bees, nematodes, soil borne zoosporic protozoatools, tools, people...
HSV, AMV, CMV, ArMV, HMV are all spread by seeds.



BACTERIA:

Most info from Hemp Diseases and Pests pg 144-147
Bacterial Blight, aka, Bacterial Leaf Spot

Pseudomonas syringae pv. cannabina


Striatura Ulcerosa

Pseudomonas syringae pv. mori


Xanthomonas Blight

Xanthomonas campestris pv. cannabis


Wildfire Leaf Spot

Pseudomonas syringae pv. tabaci


Wisconsin Leaf Spot

Pseudomonas syringae pv. mellea


Crown Gall

Agrobacterium tumefaciens


Bacterial Wilt

Erwinia tracheiphila


Phytoplasmas

Pseudomonas
A tumefaciens

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Molecular characterization of Aster yellows (16SrI) group
phytoplasma infecting Cannabis sativa in eastern Uttar Pradesh

http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j...66917471,d.b2k

New Disease Reports (2008) 17, 16.
'Candidatus Phytoplasma asteris' (group 16SrI) associated with a witches'-broom disease of Cannabis sativa in India
S.K. Raj*, S. K. Snehi, M.S. Khan and S. Kumar

Plant Virology, National Botanical Research Institute, Lucknow-2260 01, U.P., India

http://www.ndrs.org.uk/article.php?id=017016

Indian Journal of Scientific Research
Year : 2011, Volume : 2, Issue : 4
First page : ( 121) Last page : ( 124)

Witche's Broom and Phyllody Like Symptoms of Diseases in Acalypha indica L. and Cannabis sativa L.- A New Report from Champaran, North Bihar

Singh R.B.a,1, Gupta P.K.b
Cytogenetics Lab., P.G. Deptt. of Botany, M.S. College, Motihari, Bihar
Research Plantica, Near S.N.S. College, Motihari, Bihar,

http://iijfmt.indianjournals.com/ijo...=4&article=024

If you only focus on viruses or insects, you miss bacterial disease, nematodes....
-SamS

Also found similar problems in China and Iran.

Title: First report of witches’-broom disease in a Cannabis species and its association with a phytoplasma of elm yellows group (16SrV)
Authors
Zhao, Yan
Sun, Qingrong - TAIAN PEOPLES REP CHINA
Davis, Robert
Lee, Ing Ming
Liu, Qingzhong - TAIAN PEOPLES REP CHINA
Submitted to: Plant Disease
Publication Type: Peer Reviewed Journal
Publication Acceptance Date: October 15, 2006
Publication Date: February 1, 2007
Citation: Zhao, Y., Sun, Q., Davis, R.E., Lee, I., Liu, Q. 2007. First report of witches’-broom disease in a Cannabis species and its association with a phytoplasma of elm yellows group (16SrV). Plant Disease. 91:227.

http://apsjournals.apsnet.org/doi/ab...DIS-91-2-0227C


Characterization of Stolbur (16SrXII) Group Phytoplasmas Associated with Cannabis sativa Witches'-broom Disease in Iran
AUTHOR(S)Sichani, Fereshteh Vali; Bahar, Masoud; Zirak, Leila
PUB. DATEDecember 2011
Plant Pathology Journal;Dec2011, Vol. 10 Issue 4, p161

http://docsdrive.com/pdfs/ansinet/ppj/2011/161-167.pdf
http://www.oalib.com/paper/2284171


NEMATODES
You still need to ID the nematodes you found. As well as any other pathogens or pests you may have, take it to the lab OK?
There are some 500 species of nematodes that are plant parasites, but only a few effect Cannabis, Not all nematodes are bad news some are beneficial and prey on pests.

Root Knot Nematodes
Meloidogyne species include
Meloidogyne incognita, Southern Root Knot Nematode
Meloidogyne hapla, Northern Root Knot Nematode
Meloidogyne javanica, Java Root Knot Nematode

Cyst Nematodes
Heterodera schachtii, Sugar Beet Cyst Nematode
Heterodera humuli, Hops Cyst Nematode

Stem Nematode (this is the Alfalfa Stem Nematode) also called the Long Stem Nematode
Ditylenchus dipsaci

Root Lesion Nematode
Pratylenchus penetrans

Needle Nematode
Paralongidorus maximus

Spiral Nematodes
Heliocotylenchus & Scutellonema species

Reniform Nematodes
Rotylenchuls species

Cannabis was used in rotation with sugar beet crops in the Netherlands, to suppress the nematodes that caused problems for the sugar beets, worked great. There are bacterial and fungal bio-controls like bacterium Burkholderia (Pseudomonas) cepacia, against lesion, sting, lance, sprial nematodes.

Fungus, Myrothecium Verrucaria, for Meloidogyne, Heterodera, Pratylenchus, Xiphinema species.
Arthrobotrys robusta & Dactylaria superba species, for Ditylenchus & Meloidogyne species.

Bacterium, Pasturia (Bacillus) penetrans, for Meloidogyne, Heterodera, Ditylenchus, Paralongidorus, Pratylenchus species.

Fungus, Verticillium chlamydosporium kill many nematode species.

Fungus, Hirsutella rhossiliensis for Heterodera, Meloidogyne, Ditylenchus, Pratylenchus, Xiphinema species as well as killing beneficial nematode species Steinernema and Heterorhabditis.

Nematophthora gynophila, is an obligate parasite of nematodes in the Genus Heterodera.

Beneficial Nematodes
Heterorhabditis bacteriophora
Heterorhabditis indica
Heterorhabditis marelatus
Steinernema carpocapse
Steinernema kraussei
Steinernema feltiae is used against Root Knot Nematodes

Nematodes usually are introduced into new areas with infested soil or plants. (seeds can harbor nematodes on the outside) Prevent nematodes from entering your garden by using only nematode-free plants purchased from reliable suppliers. To prevent the spread of nematodes, avoid moving plants and soil from infested parts of the garden. Don’t allow irrigation water from around infested plants to run off, as this also spreads nematodes. Nematodes can be present in soil attached to tools and equipment used elsewhere, so clean tools thoroughly before using them in your garden.

-SamS

Stem Nematode:
http://utahpests.usu.edu/IPM/htm/fie...-stem-nematode


Nasty little beast!
Photos below at bottom of post:
The first photo (Fig. 4) Note the needle-like stylets in the heads of these alfalfa stem nematodes.
Next photo (Fig. 5) Dried, but still living nematodes on the surface of leaf debris in a sample of “brown bag” alfalfa seed.
Next photo (Fig. 6) Hair-like, dried nematodes (still living) on the surface of this alfalfa seed from a “brown bag” source of seed.
Next drawing is damage in Cannabis from stem nematodes.
Last is a drawing of a Nematode.

The truth is seeds can give you nematodes, but I have never seen these on Cannabis seeds. (maybe I need to look closer?)
-SamS




http://www.cabi.org/isc/datasheet/19287

All about how to ID, control, and find and remove from on seeds. Great Data!
They list Cannabis as a host plant along with a whole lot more plants.


Ditylenchus dipsaci
Stem Nematode (this is the Alfalfa Stem Nematode) also called the Long Stem Nematode

Natural enemies..................Type
Dactylella lysipaga................Predad or
Drechmeria coniospora.........Pathogen
Hirsutella rhossiliensis..........Pathoge n
Rhizoglyphus echinopus.........Predator

Witches Broom damage found in India, and stem nematode photos & drawings:

I think so also, if you only focus on viruses or mites, nematodes, or insects, you miss bacterial disease....
-SamS

Also found similar problems in China and India and Iran.

CHINA:
Title: First report of witches’-broom disease in a Cannabis species and its association with a phytoplasma of elm yellows group (16SrV)
Authors
Zhao, Yan
Sun, Qingrong - TAIAN PEOPLES REP CHINA
Davis, Robert
Lee, Ing Ming
Liu, Qingzhong - TAIAN PEOPLES REP CHINA
Submitted to: Plant Disease
Publication Type: Peer Reviewed Journal
Publication Acceptance Date: October 15, 2006
Publication Date: February 1, 2007
Citation: Zhao, Y., Sun, Q., Davis, R.E., Lee, I., Liu, Q. 2007. First report of witches’-broom disease in a Cannabis species and its association with a phytoplasma of elm yellows group (16SrV). Plant Disease. 91:227.

http://www.ncaur.usda.gov/research/p..._no_115=199976

INDIA:
‘Candidatus Phytoplasma asteris’ (group 16SrI) associated with a witches’-broom disease of Cannabis sativa in India

S. K. Raj*, S. K. Snehi, M. S. Khan andS. Kumar

http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/1...8.01920.x/full

Witch's Broom and Phyllody Like Symptoms of Diseases in Acalypha indica L. and Cannabis sativa L.- A New Report from Champaran, North Bihar

Singh R.B.a,1, Gupta P.K.b
http://iijfmt.indianjournals.com/ijo...=4&article=024

Indian Phytopath. 64 (1) : 75-77 (2011)
Molecular characterization of Aster yellows (16SrI) group
phytoplasma infecting Cannabis sativa in eastern Uttar Pradesh
SMRITI MALL1, G.P. RAO*2 and P.P. UPADHYAYA1
RESEARCH ARTICLE

http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j...66917471,d.b2k

IRAN:
Characterization of Stolbur (16SrXII) Group Phytoplasmas Associated with Cannabis sativa Witches'-broom Disease in Iran
AUTHOR(S)Sichani, Fereshteh Vali; Bahar, Masoud; Zirak, Leila
PUB. DATEDecember 2011
Plant Pathology Journal;Dec2011, Vol. 10 Issue 4, p161

http://docsdrive.com/pdfs/ansinet/ppj/2011/161-167.pdf
http://www.oalib.com/paper/2284171

Call and ask them. If the state Agriculture Dept. will help with Cannabis or not. I do not know if the headquarters in Sacramento or one of the local offices in a more Cannabis friendly county are better to call, call Davis and/or call several more if you need to...
Have a phone number to give them, and a name or business name. Maybe an email? Tell us if you get lucky....
http://www.cdfa.ca.gov/Field_District_Offices.html

Or

Address
Oregon Department of Agriculture
Plant Program Area
635 Capitol St. NE
Salem, OR 97301-2532 USA
Hours of Operation 8:00 AM - 5:00 PM
Contact
plant-info@oda.state.or.us
Phone: 503-986-4644
Fax: 503-986-4786

Or

Oregon Agricultural Experiment Station
138 Strand Agriculture Hall, Oregon State University,
Corvallis, OR 97331- 8521
541-737-4251

It might be easier in Colorado and Washington, as well as each different state agris may only help state residents, maybe.
-SamS

I have never had BM, CM, or RM, I have grown a lot of plants in a dozen countries. I have had various viruses, bacterial and fungal disease pathogens most vectored by insect or other pests like nematodes etc even some by the wind I bet.
If you suspect pests or pathogens and if you are in Calif these people are in Davis near the bay area.
You might contact:
http://www.allcropsolutions.com/
And see if they can help, they are Cannabis friendly and say they have a lot of experience with Cannabis pathogens, they told me that.
If anyone uses them please post about anything was good or bad.
-SamS
 

Snype

Active member
Veteran
Only thing I found was this:

I did confirm the Davis lab you listed does Cannabis pathogen testing, the folks were super nice.
We need to have a list of Cannabis pathogens listed by catagories, species and by priority so we can get the labs that will test for pests or pathogens to do all the tests that will help the most.
see my post #574 in this thread.
1. Insects and Mites and nematodes
2. Fungal diseases
3. Bacterial diseases
4. Other Cannabis Pests and Pathogens
5. Abiotic Diseases
To me this is revolutionary, it could help change the way things are.

Thanks RetroGrow,
Your help has been really important to help get to the bottom of this dud phenomenon.
If any other labs are doing Cannabis pathogens and pest testing we need to know who and where, I know it could be done in Colorado and Washington, maybe elsewhere?
-SamS

If it's not that it's probably what Infinitesimal posted above:

Please folks lets get samples sent to http://www.allcropsolutions.com/ The more different sources the better, If we cant answer all the questions I bet we will answer many.
One of the first things to ask them is about "BM toxin", what is it? Someone must have an idea?
Also we can find out which of the Viruses they test for, which bacterial and fungal pathogens they test for, as well as pests they can ID, I posted a list of all the Cannabis viruses I know of in post #23 in this thread. If they are good at it we should get them to expand their searches to include any/all pathogens that effect Cannabis, they sound ready.
I think this is the only way to get to the bottom of all this and understand what is going on, be it one problem or several as I suspect.
-SamS
 
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