Hemp (Cannabis sativa L) tissue nutrient analysis data

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maryanne3087

Active member

• Jul 15, 2010

• #21

I'd assume you would need some tools used by analytic chemists to assess what nutrients have been removed by the plants in what quantities.

One thing that could work but is a rather "crude" experiment is adding back nutrient solution and maintaining the same pH and concentration. When you get deficiencies you know you're not using enough of whatever element, when you get burn you know you're using too much of whatever element. If you never get deficiencies or burn with say a given formulation of say the 3:2:1 mix ratios you know you're fairly close to what the plant needs!

 

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Carl Carlson

• Aug 12, 2010

• #22

http://pubs.caes.uga.edu/caespubs/pubcd/b1182/b1182.htm#Fertilize

 

habeeb

follow your heart

ICMag Donor

Veteran

• Aug 14, 2010

• #23

I love how people think you need high P levels..

 

habeeb

follow your heart

ICMag Donor

Veteran

• Aug 14, 2010

• #24

maryanne3087 said:

After reading that Maximum yield article on nutrient ratios by Erik Baska (sp?) I can only wonder what methods they used to assess nutrient uptake/demand in 1945 and 1970. Do you think they grew the hemp hydroponically and then analyzed the solution to see what nutrients were removed by the plants from the solution?

Click to expand...

I bet an ash test. as if you look at the book, bread from stones, a very old book, they were using ash tests to see mineral content.

it is easier to see what the plant has in it, then to see what's left ( as in theory of hydroponic water left )]

I am sure the future is leaf test its at home, but then the future might be better established at nutrients, and you might even be able to use..

also keep in mind, that not everyone uses chemical, and thus a whole different system needs to be in place when we talk about nutrients I believe ( mycos , microbes... )

 

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freeon

New member

• Aug 14, 2010

• #25

This should show everybody that PK boosters are a waste of money. If your base nutrients don't have the proper ratios than move on to another company.

 

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Carl Carlson

• Aug 14, 2010

• #26

habeeb said:

I love how people think you need high P levels..

Click to expand...

Yep.

Higher P for soil where loss via runoff is a concern, but not for containers or hydro systems that are being fed constantly with nutrients....

 

calstar

Member

• Aug 19, 2010

• #27

so.... is Maxibloom 5/15/14 regarded by some as too high in P for an outdoor smart pot soil grow?
How would it negatively affect mj with a high, but not toxic level, of P? great thread

 

Last edited: Aug 19, 2010

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Carl Carlson

• Aug 19, 2010

• #28

calstar said:

so.... is Maxibloom 5/15/14 regarded by some as too high in P for an outdoor smart pot soil grow?
How would it negatively affect mj with a high, but not toxic level, of P? great thread

Click to expand...

a lot of ppl use Maxibloom with success, so it seems that level of P isn't toxic. maybe less P is more optimum growth though.

It strikes me that "Heath Robinson", he of the super massive hydro grows, uses Ionic Grow and Bloom.

The ratios for those bottles are 3-1-5 and 3-2-6.

 

Gsizzle

Active member

ICMag Donor

Veteran

• Aug 21, 2010

• #29

Very nice thread just sitting back enjoying the view.

 

Dorje113

Member

• Aug 21, 2010

• #30

It's pretty obvious with some simple testing. A $20 soil test kit is enough to monitor how much nutrients to add to your soil, and most premixes have too much P in the NPK ratio so you end up with excess P building up over time...You end up using less P in mixes with separate NPK components. The plant uses N well into flowering too.

 

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Carl Carlson

• Sep 3, 2010

• #31

Hat-tip to JackTheGrower

http://books.google.com/books?id=cD...&resnum=1&ved=0CDMQ6AEwAA#v=onepage&q&f=false

check out table 2.2

108 N - 42 P - 114 K - 74 Ca - 22 Mg - 17 S

Hemp-stems + Hemp-flowers

 

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Carl Carlson

• Oct 21, 2010

• #32

37 crops

http://www.sul-po-mag.com/english/general/cnu.htm

Find out what nutrients are taken from the soil...every time a crop is raised.

 

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maryanne3087

Active member

• Oct 23, 2010

• #33

Very cool link. Thank you for your contribution

 

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orange juice

Member

• Oct 23, 2010

• #34

this thread has inspired me to try a new nute

I've been using maxibloom forever, I noticed my place has a hydro formula that's even cheaper but was really low on P so I had been avoiding it, thinking it wasn't optimal.

playing with canna stats with 3.5g (~half teaspoon) fert and 1.5g calcium nitrate per gal I get-

106 N - 46 P - 200 K

hoping it works great, at $1.50 a lbs for the stuff... It ends up being 1/10th the cost of maxi, and maxi is like 1/3 the cost of liquid nutes...

 

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Carl Carlson

• Oct 23, 2010

• #35

orange juice said:

playing with canna stats with 3.5g (~half teaspoon) fert and 1.5g calcium nitrate per gal I get-

106 N - 46 P - 200 K

hoping it works great, at $1.50 a lbs for the stuff... It ends up being 1/10th the cost of maxi, and maxi is like 1/3 the cost of liquid nutes...

Click to expand...

nice work. I've might have mentioned it earlier in the thread, but am using the Peters Hydroponic + Calcium Nitrate + Epsom salts.

 

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YosemiteSam

• Oct 23, 2010

• #36

Carl Carlson said:

Hat-tip to JackTheGrower

http://books.google.com/books?id=cD...&resnum=1&ved=0CDMQ6AEwAA#v=onepage&q&f=false

check out table 2.2

108 N - 42 P - 114 K - 74 Ca - 22 Mg - 17 S

Hemp-stems + Hemp-flowers

Click to expand...

Carl...I am not totally sure I understand how you arrived at this...I mean I understand you added the ppms for stems and flowers. Do you think he included leaves with flowers? roots with stems?

Not doubting you but just wondering if there is enough info to really reach a conclusion.

And if that is the case, and I wanted to send a sample to JR Peters for tissue analysis what should I send? I was thinking about a ground up bud...thinking that is what I care about. Then again if I don't support leaf, stem and root growth with my nutes am I going to get the best results?

do you have an opinion?

 

Avenger

Well-known member

Veteran

• Oct 23, 2010

• #37

I like to give my opinion, even when it is unsolicited.

For tissue analysis generally you take recently matured leaves, and they test the petoile sap. You would want to take and test samples at various milestones, like veg, flower initiation, late flower. That way you can trend the data.

 

Avenger

Well-known member

Veteran

• Oct 23, 2010

• #38

.,.

 

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Carl Carlson

• Nov 2, 2010

• #39

veg and bloom tissue analysis

veg and bloom tissue analysis

excellent stuff

N - P - K - Ca - Mg - S

Bloom 5 - 1 - 5 - 2 - .5 - .5
Veg 5.5 - 1 - 4.25 - .5 - .5

ShroomDr said:

ive posted this elsewhere, but it certainly belongs here.

AN commissioned a study, its 15-20 pages long, here's a link, and images of the first 4 pages.

http://www.growersunderground.com/PhosphorusMyth.pdf

Click to expand...

 

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Carl Carlson

• Nov 7, 2010

• #40

YosemiteSam said:

Carl...I am not totally sure I understand how you arrived at this...I mean I understand you added the ppms for stems and flowers. Do you think he included leaves with flowers? roots with stems?

Click to expand...

Oh yeah it was just a stab in the dark, your questions are all valid...

And if that is the case, and I wanted to send a sample to JR Peters for tissue analysis what should I send? I was thinking about a ground up bud...thinking that is what I care about. Then again if I don't support leaf, stem and root growth with my nutes am I going to get the best results?

do you have an opinion?

Click to expand...

I've no experience with this other than reading about it. You should check out what they do with vegetable crops. Does that sound right?

Here are two for example:

Plant Tissue Analysis and Interpretation for Vegetable Crops in Florida1 (Crop Management) (.pdf)

What to Sample

There are several types of vegetable plant reference tissues including petiole, leaf, but rarely fruits. Some work has been done with vegetable plant petioles for nitrates in greenhouse crops and some field vegetable crops, but the standard vegetable reference tissue is the leaf. It is essential to use the same plant part as the one used to develop the interpretative data.

It is not practical to harvest and prepare entire plants for chemical analysis. Therefore, a plant part is used for convenience. However, it is essential that the plant part selected for chemical analysis accurately represents the nutritional status of the plant during its entire life cycle. For many vegetable crops, the most-recently-matured leaf (MRML) provides the most sensitive indicator of the nutritional status of the plant, sometimes only the petiole of this leaf is used for plant analysis. Specific plant parts for sampling each vegetable crop are specified in the section on sampling.

For most crops, and for many nutrients, mature, physiologically active leaves should be sampled. This is often referred to as "the most-recently-matured leaf" (MRML) including the blade and its petiole. The MRML is the leaf that has turned from a light-green juvenile color to a darker-green color and has reached full size. The exception to the rule of the MRML is the analysis of Ca, Cu, B, and S, which are relatively immobile in the plant. Therefore, an analysis of the mature leaves in this case may not reveal the Ca, B, Cu, or S deficiency in the younger leaves. When a nutrient deficiency of this nature is suspected, young (not fully expanded) leaf tissue is needed for analysis.
​

and

Sampling for Plant Tissue Analysis

Guide A-123

Robert Flynn, Extension Agronomy Specialist
Shane T. Ball, Extension Agronomy Specialist
R.D. Baker, Extension Agronomist
College of Agricultural, Consumer and Environmental Sciences New Mexico State University


Table 3. Tissue sampling techniques for specific plants...