Kratom

Douglas.Curtis said:

Anyone else get sinus issues using tea with the grinds in it? Other foods cause the same type of reaction, so I'm thinking kratom may not be for me. I tried 4 different varieties. Though they have positive effects, I can't get past the thick nasal mucus thing.

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Have you tried making the tea then running it through a coffee filter? Also, make sure you avoid inhaling or breathing through your nose any dust that might be coming off. It can be a fine powder, fine enough to float off and irritate mucus lining if you inhale it. I make pills with mine. The tea hits too hard and lasts shorter than doing gel caps filled with it. Just a personal preference. But you'd need a mask on while filling them if it is the dust causing you grief.

redlaser said:

There is a guy in Hawaii that has better prices, 40-50$ for six inchers and 75$ for 10-12 inch ones.
Militia420 found him for me, I picked up a couple and they were shipped very well.
That price includes shipping, but it was a few months back so haven’t checked prices lately.
He has a website I can’t find, think it’s like zodiacbotanicals like in militia420’s sig line.

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Yeh, zodiacbotanicals.org . The last link on the main page has the prices and shipping, none of it's changed. Ebay created price gougers by banning the sale of powder and plants. The cheaper price is for 6-10" plants and the higher price for 12-22 or 24 inch ones. zodiacbotanicals.org/get_some.html


He's got some rooted pink indonesians finally but isn't shipping until they get bigger so they don't get wrecked by the postal service.


There's a lot of heavy shit going on behind the scenes though guys. One forum I'm on stays on top of the news and it looks like the FDA is trying to fuck us from behind. Word is they're trying to get the Indonesian government to ban growth and sale and farming of the plant because something like 90% of the powder market comes from Kalimantan Indonesia. I would get plants now and treat it just like weed. Don't tell any one who doesn't need to know because these assholes are liable to try another ban at some point.



https://www.change.org/p/presiden-s...lCLqCf7lTmhYlL72ma8a2-zGAo7uxa3rUtnLY0cMslIWo


Copy and paste that Indonesian into Google Translate. There's probably some hits if you do a search on "FDA indonesia kratom ban". I have no clue how this will pan out. The US tends to leverage either international loans to other countries to change their behavior, or they'll fake some bombing and claim the Indonesian government was behind it, time to send in the troops. The kratom thing is big enough for this IMHO just because there were enough people who rallied in 2016 to keep the feds from scheduling it Class I. I think they want more people fucked up and hooked on hard opiates any way which is partly why the poppy production went through the roof when the US went in and removed the Taliban from power.


Any way, any one thinking about growing should at least keep track of potential plant bans so you can snag em before it happens.

i used Kratom to help me go cold turkey off years and years of the doc shoving pain killers in my face. was up to 280 20s a month. all natural now

Dr. Purpur said:

I think I paid 60 for mine. The important thing, as is the case with our beloved Cannabis, is getting a clone from a proven strong Mother. That is what caught my eye when I got my clone, and it turned out to be true. I can munch one leaf when Im out watering my pot plants and feel it within 10 minutes. Its uplifting. I feel happy and energetic. I don't get dopey at all. I do sleep real good, and have vivid dreams. Those can be kind of wild at times. Dreams every night that you remember. Some are awesome and over the top. There is a scary one on occasion, but not too bad

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I haven't had any bad luck so far with any vendors. I think it really comes down to feeding them well. Who knows what the variance is between one plant and another if they come from the same region, like the Green Malaysian. But between regions there's a definite difference in the quality, with the Malaysian having more of an upper quality and the Thai reds more of a sedating quality, but even then they've all been good and unless you're doing extracts I don't think I've noticed a huge difference. If you feed them fish emulsion they go nuts. The leaves feel slightly thicker and look and taste richer. I just apply what I know from growing weed to Kratom, except Kratom does like wet roots and more humidity. What would cause root rot in weed doesn't effect Kratom. This stuff grows in rain forests in Indonesia. If you only have one kratom plant you ought to clone the shit out of it so you have back ups in case life happens.


Here's a sweet pic I saved from the guy at zodiacbotanicals.org :


If your plants are flowering you must be doing something right!

JonathanT said:

i used Kratom to help me go cold turkey off years and years of the doc shoving pain killers in my face. was up to 280 20s a month. all natural now

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Do you remember any physical side effects that went away when you got off them? I don't mean withdrawal but like, did you ever get food sensitivities or other weird shit as a side effect on your liver?


I'm still working down off of hydrocodone. I'm on 6 2.5mg doses spread through the day now. I tried working kratom in before but I wound up doing the same amount of hydro PLUS the kratom at rough spots and for now I'm just keeping it straight hydrocodone so every other week I drop another dose. In 12 weeks I should be completely off unless I decide to change it up and try to go with nothing but kratom, which is a strong possibility. So sick of some side effects. My liver and kidneys are fucked and need a permanent vacation.

Zodiacbotanicals.org

I got my kratom plants from this guy. They were both healthy and gave me a really good chance at pulling them through.

I would advise any buyers to be ready with a humidome or 10 gallon fish tank to keep them in very humid conditions. I had to gradually harden them off to my dry arid conditions. I'd take them out of the humidome and 30 minutes later the leaves would be wilted, so back in the humidome. The Green Malaysian wasn't too hard to acclimate but the Red Thai Rifat was very sensitive, it eventually didn't wilt and started growing vigorously.

I plan to buy his other varieties too.

Thanks Zodiac Botanicals!

Here's some news.

LEXINGTON, Ky. (WKYT) - Kratom is a plant from the coffee family. It has been under siege by the Federal Drug Administration for a couple of years now.


FDA officials said kratom hits the same brain receptors as morphine and other opioids. Recently, they ordered Indonesia to stop growing the plant. Kratom supporters believe will be a death sentence for kratom in the United States.

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https://www.wkyt.com/content/news/F...J1G7vJkvM-cbXI8s9pWIsF4vvJzzzOoq8H8kVYlumIGDQ




Big pharma wants this plant and its powder inaccessible.

militia420 said:

Here's some news.



https://www.wkyt.com/content/news/F...J1G7vJkvM-cbXI8s9pWIsF4vvJzzzOoq8H8kVYlumIGDQ




Big pharma wants this plant and its powder inaccessible.

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Can’t believe they can make Indonesia quit growing it, I guess they probably threaten to withhold financial aid or something.

That article said a few kratom sellers are putting heroin or fentanyl in it, pretty messed up if true.

I did some minor research on Kratom overdose deaths in the United States. Official numbers vary from 11 through 47. All but one were a mix of drugs. A full drug screen was not done on the one.
Tramadol was the villain in almost every case. Opiates were involved in one or two cases but Tramadol was in over 90% of the victims.

Tramadol is a second pass drug. Tramadol itself has very little effect, but after the liver breaks it down one of the pieces has roughly 200 times the effect of Tramadol.
Small changes in liver function, even transitional changes, can have extreme effects. Normal dosages of Tramadol can kill when that happens. The warning that comes with Tramadol mentions this can happen even after years of use, it is liver dependent, not dose dependent.

Tramadol is an inexpensive synthetic that is easy to obtain and has fewer legal penalties than opiates. But although rare, the deaths it directly causes are real.
If more boost is needed, genuine opiates are a much much safer mix than Tramadol adulterated Kratom.

redlaser said:

Can’t believe they can make Indonesia quit growing it, I guess they probably threaten to withhold financial aid or something.

That article said a few kratom sellers are putting heroin or fentanyl in it, pretty messed up if true.

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I think they're lying about it being cut with stuff or it was an isloated incident. Fentanyl is so strong it could very easily kill someone relying on something so much weaker like kratom. Plus, I doubt they can give a case where they KNOW it was being cut. I don't believe this story and think it's anti-kratom pharma propaganda. They can throw money at any one and corruption is rampant in our society now even though many are unaware or don't acknowledge it.


Who's going to deal kratom illegally when so much more money can be made for the same risk selling the hard stuff? If it's a class a felony in some states, being categorized as schedule 1 with heroin, etc, then it has the same criminal penalties for possession.


And it's not going to be common that a dealer wants to kill a user because they lose money so intentional attempts to O.D. aren't likely.


There's a clear campaign under way against kratom. County councils are passing bans in many states. These people are actually communists. People really need to pay attention to their county councils, district attorney's and judges. Once people realize the corruption that's going on spreading the word and getting voter recalls in place should help or this shit is going to get unbelievably bad.


They don't have the authority to do this just like banning weed is outside of the governments scope of authority.


These people are gangsters. They're used to breaking the law and getting away with it, "because they are the law". That needs to change.

I thought the same thing about the fentanyl and morphine being added to kratom, sounds like fentanyl laced weed stories.

The guy making the claim is named Harrow or Hadow, and he is the head of the American kratom society or similar name.
In the story you posted he makes the claim then goes on to say there are millions currently being spent in research on kratom and he wants there to be standards in place for purity.

He doesn’t sound anti kratom so it makes his fentanyl claim a little different.

Still sounds like bs, and if he had evidence it would be nice to hear it.
Maybe he is trying to get support for regulation by inventing some desperate situation with the fentanyl.

Fentanyl is dosed in micrograms, making it an unlikely adulterant, overdose too easy.

redlaser said:

I thought the same thing about the fentanyl and morphine being added to kratom, sounds like fentanyl laced weed stories.

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Agree. Spot on!

redlaser said:

The guy making the claim is named Harrow or Hadow, and he is the head of the American kratom society or similar name.
In the story you posted he makes the claim then goes on to say there are millions currently being spent in research on kratom and he wants there to be standards in place for purity.

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Yeh I was thinking about this guy and the story and I'm gonna call it like I see it. I don't trust this guy. It smells like the whole National Rifle Association scam. Many people who are NRA members but who don't look at their history don't realize the NRA backed several major pieces of legislation that created more and more restrictions on access to guns. It's like Lenin's comments about leading the opposition.


Every one of these asshole organizations pushing for various legislation and things that put rights into "legal" and "privileged" / "licensed" areas. Not one pushes to keep legislation off the books or for decriminalizing. So far as pushing for purity goes, that's a load of shit. The leaf isn't potent enough to cause ODs period. And the cases of salmonella or what ever we hear about in the news, how do we know some of these assholes pushing for criminalizing or legalizing the stuff aren't behind putting out bad batches to help their agenda. The outcome of these agendas all result in them sticking their hands in our pockets. Big pharma and the FDA pushed too hard too fast for me to believe this shit.


The same people who run the legal system do this sort of thing all the time. They set up charities and all sorts of stuff that has poor over sight where skimming or outright theft can occur.

redlaser said:

He doesn’t sound anti kratom so it makes his fentanyl claim a little different.

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No but the flavor he presents is still not a flavor that backs the people. The fentanyl claim is outrageous and exactly the sort of lie someone would use to help get regulations in place. If someone has the truth on their side no need to lie or exaggerate.

redlaser said:

Still sounds like bs, and if he had evidence it would be nice to hear it.
Maybe he is trying to get support for regulation by inventing some desperate situation with the fentanyl.

Fentanyl is dosed in micrograms, making it an unlikely adulterant, overdose too easy.

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I think you hit the nail on the head with the inventing a situation. Most people don't question things like this but his claims are outrageous and hearing him say he wants purity controls smacks of helping the government get regulations passed to stick their greedy fucking hands in our pockets. People with medical issues don't have a lot of spare money and getting the powder from indonesia has been a lifesaver for many. Throw in $5 tax on every weeks worth of purchases and people are out $20 in a month, $240 in a year. That's not pocket change for those of us who are broke to being with.


I think you're right about him making up the fentanyl claim and the regulation push is what's got me livid right now. They've already tried taxing the air we breathe with carbon taxes. It never ends with these people.

Kratom is some interesting stuff! I'm having great results at doses as small as a gram. General sense of well being, euphoria, energy and focus. It's also calming my digestive issues, which is always a welcome effect. I've been using Red Bali and have some Green Maeng Da coming in the mail. I haven't tested any higher doses yet since I'm doing good in the pain department, for for future reference, what's a good dose for moderate-severe pain?

Green Squall said:

Kratom is some interesting stuff! I'm having great results at doses as small as a gram. General sense of well being, euphoria, energy and focus. It's also calming my digestive issues, which is always a welcome effect. I've been using Red Bali and have some Green Maeng Da coming in the mail. I haven't tested any higher doses yet since I'm doing good in the pain department, for for future reference, what's a good dose for moderate-severe pain?

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2 tablespoons is my dose

Earlmarne said:

2 tablespoons is my dose

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Dreaming much?

I need to pick up some kratom powder to try, anyone have a preference on a company, or any that should be avoided?

I have a couple new plants but would rather not take any leaves because they are only two foot tall and wide. Plus I’m wanting to get cuttings off them soon

I’m not very experienced, but I’ve been happy with Krackenkratom in the US. Get in the mail 2-3 days after ordering. They’re expensive but shipping is included in the price. The big negative is that they don’t take plastic.

Green Squall said:

Kratom is some interesting stuff! I'm having great results at doses as small as a gram. General sense of well being, euphoria, energy and focus. It's also calming my digestive issues, which is always a welcome effect. I've been using Red Bali and have some Green Maeng Da coming in the mail. I haven't tested any higher doses yet since I'm doing good in the pain department, for for future reference, what's a good dose for moderate-severe pain?

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This other forum has a table of conversions that I think is pretty accurate based on other peoples own experiences.


https://drugs-forum.com/threads/relative-strength-of-kratom-to-opiates.234395/

A helpful chart, once again this is all an estimate, Kratom strength does vary.

10 grams of Kratom = 200 mg Codeine
10 grams of Kratom = 200 mg Tramadol
10 grams of Kratom = 20 mg Morphine
10 grams of Kratom = 20 mg Hydrocodone
10 grams of Kratom = 13.3 mg Oxycodone
10 grams of Kratom = 5.7 mg Methadone (acute exposure)
10 grams of Kratom = 4.5 mg Heroin
10 grams of Kratom = 4 mg Hydromorphone
10 grams of Kratom = 2.9 mg Oxymorphone
10 grams of Kratom = 0.5 mg Buprenorphine
10 grams of Kratom = 0.25 mg Fentanyl

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I've had to use hydrocodone for almost 10 years at this point. I've weened off of it a few times but I have permanent tissue damage so I usually find myself in pain. I fill gel caps with my powder usually and then weigh a bunch out and subtract the gel cap average weight from the total to get the average pill amount. So I usually need about 3-4 pills every 3-4 hours to maintain effective pain relief that is likely on par with the hydrocodone which I would dose either 2.5mg/ ~2 hours or 5mg/ ~4 hours. Still trying to work down off the hydrocodone permanently but it's tough.


As with any thing, the above reference is not 100% accurate. Dose lower and work up a dose to where things feel right without over kill. Over kill cost more money and you can wind up doing things you shouldn't that make your pain worse from further injury. This last part can be a huge contributor to failing to heal.

Does chewing the Kratom leaves produce a pleasant effect ?

I wouldn't mind getting some seeds. I got a coffee tree. The Kratom could live next to her maybe.

I didn't really like the Green Maeng Da. I found it too edgy and stimulating, although it was helpful for making a batch of bubble hash lol. I think I'll stick with the Red Bali, although I'm also going to test the Red Borneo.