Major Herm Issues, I need advice

CaptinFunk · Nov 18, 2019

Day 13 in flower
1000W DE's
3 gal Smart Pots w/ Coco

I've been growing in this building for a little over a year. First few harvests had 0 herm issues. Fast forward to now, and I have strains that didn't used to herm, start herming (Full blown pollen sacks at the nodes where caylixs should be)

The plants look super healthy, with a strong healthy root system, no visible signs of deficiencies, root damage, etc...

I check security cameras daily for light leaks, and theres nothing. (other than the green 'Exit' sign which has been on since the beginning)

Day temps are around 77F and night temps are 71/72F. HOWEVER, when the lights kick on, the temp spikes to low 80's before HVAC can keep up and when the lights turn off, temps break into the high 60's before HVAC can start heating. but this this is nothing new and our HVAC has been acting this way since the beginning.

I'm growing the same cuts as a friend who has zero herm issues. Could it be over watering in Coco? My plants stay fairly wet, but the roots look great.

Strains giving me problems:
Birthday Cake
GMO
Motor Breath
Yuck Mouth

Any ideas?

I'mback · Nov 18, 2019

CaptinFunk said:
Day 13 in flower
1000W DE's
3 gal Smart Pots w/ Coco

I've been growing in this building for a little over a year. First few harvests had 0 herm issues. Fast forward to now, and I have strains that didn't used to herm, start herming (Full blown pollen sacks at the nodes where caylixs should be)

The plants look super healthy, with a strong healthy root system, no visible signs of deficiencies, root damage, etc...

I check security cameras daily for light leaks, and theres nothing. (other than the green 'Exit' sign which has been on since the beginning)

Day temps are around 77F and night temps are 71/72F. HOWEVER, when the lights kick on, the temp spikes to low 80's before HVAC can keep up and when the lights turn off, temps break into the high 60's before HVAC can start heating. but this this is nothing new and our HVAC has been acting this way since the beginning.

I'm growing the same cuts as a friend who has zero herm issues. Could it be over watering in Coco? My plants stay fairly wet, but the roots look great.

Strains giving me problems:
Birthday Cake
GMO
Motor Breath
Yuck Mouth

Any ideas?

Wet should never be a word utilized when referring to cannabis, or any other plant etc... moist yes, wet no!

CaptinFunk · Nov 18, 2019

I'mback said:
Wet should never be a word utilized when referring to cannabis, or any other plant etc... moist yes, wet no!

So they get wet, like fully saturated when they’re watered. But they only get watered once or twice per day. So they are never dry, always moist, occasionally at field capacity.

hayday · Nov 18, 2019

I have never seen this mentioned but I believe pouring cold water on the plants causes some stress and hermi tendencies.
I use a fish tank heater or two in the winter, in the water to balance out the ambiant temps and my water temps.
No peer review,straight up bro science. Your results may vary but every year on this forum for over a decade, when the temps drop, people start up with hermi issues.
Hope you work it out...

I'mback · Nov 18, 2019

CaptinFunk said:
So they get wet, like fully saturated when they’re watered. But they only get watered once or twice per day. So they are never dry, always moist, occasionally at field capacity.

Yes but the words you used were "[FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]My plants stay fairly wet"

A plant only needs as much water as it evaporates during the day. Soggy roots = trench foot... for the lack of a better word. We kill our plants with love.

Buddy in one of your replies mentioned watering at room temp. My water drum sits at room temp, something else to think about.
[/FONT]

dddaver · Nov 18, 2019

I don't portend to be any "expert". In fact "experts" annoy me because they get proven wrong so much but then deny ever saying what they said. :woohoo:

The wild card here is your friend who is growing the same cuts but not getting hermi's. Throws this theory off. But I just wanted to point out that, especially when growing clones, the hermi gene, once in the genetic makeup of that strain, WILL rear its ugly head. And more and more that gene, even when not apparent, exists in the genetics of that strain and gets passed on so with more and more plants being grown these days, more and more of the hermi gene is becoming commonplace.

GOT_BUD? · Nov 18, 2019

dddaver said:
I don't portend to be any "expert". In fact "experts" annoy me because they get proven wrong so much but then deny ever saying what they said.

The wild card here is your friend who is growing the same cuts but not getting hermi's. Throws this theory off. But I just wanted to point out that, especially when growing clones, the hermi gene, once in the genetic makeup of that strain, WILL rear its ugly head. And more and more that gene, even when not apparent, exists in the genetics of that strain and gets passed on so with more and more plants being grown these days, more and more of the hermi gene is becoming commonplace.

Hell, it seems hermies are becoming almost accepted in some circles.

Kinda like real life - gotta accept everybody.

Well, my garden ain't real life. No ladyboys allowed! Harumph!

GreenGuy · Nov 18, 2019

I wouldn't overlook that exit sign that lights up in green.. ..also, any other tech devices in your room that light up with green light, or any other colors..

I would black them out completely.

I would also physically check the room for light leaks.. get in there, let your eyes adjust for 5 or 10 minutes and see if you can find anything that jumps out at ya.. Especially if your dark cycle is during any daylight hours.. would not be trusting cameras when it comes to light leaks.

I ran into a similar situation - some plants being ok, others not.. some far away from the display, some close.. some that never had a problem with it before, suddenly become effected..

I found the problem to be my Co2 controller that had a green light display.. ..and my green AC status light.. I've blacked those out and haven't had a hermie issue since..

No matter what those 'experts' say, I'll never trust green light again!

Good Luck!

Del_9_THC · Nov 20, 2019

hayday said:
I have never seen this mentioned but I believe pouring cold water on the plants causes some stress and hermi tendencies.
I use a fish tank heater or two in the winter, in the water to balance out the ambiant temps and my water temps.
No peer review,straight up bro science. Your results may vary but every year on this forum for over a decade, when the temps drop, people start up with hermi issues.
Hope you work it out...

I have my doubts about this explanation....rain water is quite cold and does not cause hermies....so how cold are we talking?.....Maybe, 1 - 3 degrees C (33.8 - 37.6 degrees F), but that is hella cold, much colder than tap water.

If you are absolutely sure there are no light leaks and you are not opening up the room/grow area when lights are off to have a peak at them, then it is, indeed strange.....Are you doing anything different this grow, nutrient wise, overwatering/ feeding....

If anyone else has access to grow area have they been fucking around in there when it is lights off time?

I would second the green light thing, even if cannabis plants aren't supposed to absorb green light....all lights in grow room off in dark period, even if they did not affect previous grow....
If the problem persists with the zero lights in dark period, then it could be ruled out as the cause.

mrlucky405 · Dec 18, 2019

Couple things I can add... First, colder water holds more dissolved oxygen. Room temperature isn't the best for feeding. Besides not holding the same oxygen, it also allows for more growth of pathogens. I keep my chillers at 68. Personally, I'm good with anything between 66 and 70. Second, how often are you watering? Most coco has perlite added. Typically 70/30 coco to perlite. I use Cyco, and it lists right on the bag how often to feed. They recommend up to 4 times daily. Coco is really tough to over water. Lastly, if all else fails, try using Optic Foliar Switch. I grow from fem seeds, and hermies are always a potential issue. Not one seed since I started using it. Spray on day 7 and day 17. Hope this helps...

Douglas.Curtis · Dec 18, 2019

What type of nutrients are you using? Any B1, superthrive or other vitamin products being used? What are you using which your buddy is not?

What type of herms are you seeing, every plant herming at every node site? If it was the exit sign, the plants closest to it would show more pollen flowers. Is it in several spots only? If so, are these spots closer to moving air or potential light leaks which have appeared over time. Tape failing, building warping with temp changes, etc...

RB56 · Dec 18, 2019

GOT_BUD? said:
Hell, it seems hermies are becoming almost accepted in some circles.

Kinda like real life - gotta accept everybody.

Well, my garden ain't real life. No ladyboys allowed! Harumph!

There's a sub forum for morons to freely spew hateful shit. Did you forget where you are or is the shit in your head expanding so quickly you can't control yourself? You are wrong. We don't have to accept the likes of you in the general forums.

Fitzera · Dec 18, 2019

RB56 said:
There's a sub forum for morons to freely spew hateful shit. Did you forget where you are or is the shit in your head expanding so quickly you can't control yourself? You are wrong. We don't have to accept the likes of you in the general forums.

Whoa there cowboy, where did that come from? I tried reading that with sarcasm because it's so far out of left field. That was not hate that you are responding to, it was not wanting anything less than 100% female in his flowering space. There is absolutely nothing wrong with that. Let's keep gender politics out of the grow talk

TychoMonolyth · Dec 18, 2019

dank.frank · Dec 18, 2019

RB56 said:
There's a sub forum for morons to freely spew hateful shit. Did you forget where you are or is the shit in your head expanding so quickly you can't control yourself? You are wrong. We don't have to accept the likes of you in the general forums.

Woah. Slow your roll. Got_BUD is a good dude.

Clearly, he is saying he has different rules for society than he has for his garden.

I too, agree with his particular opinion about keeping the hermaphrodite plants out of the flowering room. Only makes sense if you are trying to grow sensimilla.

dank.Frank

gorilla ganja · Dec 18, 2019

Any flowering hormones being applied? Flower boosters etc.
Like Douglas.Curtis said I would look to what you are adding that your buddy is not.

Peace GG

CaptinFunk · Dec 25, 2019

Douglas.Curtis said:
What type of nutrients are you using? Any B1, superthrive or other vitamin products being used? What are you using which your buddy is not?

What type of herms are you seeing, every plant herming at every node site? If it was the exit sign, the plants closest to it would show more pollen flowers. Is it in several spots only? If so, are these spots closer to moving air or potential light leaks which have appeared over time. Tape failing, building warping with temp changes, etc...

I’m using new millennium nutrients, not sure exactly what they put in it. So it’s possible they’re are bio stimulants. We are using pretty much exactly the same nutrients, I run my plants with a lower EC than him, but nothing too low, 1.8 - 2.2 max.

The only differences are how we irrigate (I water 3 times daily for 7-8min each feed, he irrigates 7+ times daily for 2-3 min) and our brand of coco. I use Mother Earth.

This time around the plants look fucking perfect, and I’m STILL seeing herms pop up, this time day 12 into flower.

The herms I’m seeing are full blow staminate flowers. Some are clusters like it’s a male. They are located at the nodes, where those single caylix’s should be (I’ve heard them being called primordial caylix). Not every node has a herm, many do tho.

The last room, when I made this post, almost everything hermed out. Some of the strains I’ve never grown before, others I’ve grown for over a year without herms. This time around, all the new strains I grew last time are still herming out. Other strains seem to be fine, so I’ll update this post as the room matures.

The locations of the plants that are herming out is pretty random throughout the room, the plants closest to the exit sign surprisingly do not seem to have any herms. I have gone into the rooms at night to check for light leaks and didn’t see anything... it was pretty much pitch dark other than the exit sign.

I’m so stumped, I’ve never expected this before. Like I mentioned, the plants look incredibly healthy. Dense white roots, no leaf deficiencies, or anything that seems to be wrong.

I have noticed some unusual growth on the plants other than herms. Sometimes, where you would expect to find a primordial caylix (or in my case, a cluster of male flowers) is a little shoot, like a little meristem with little leaves. Other times, near the base of a branch will be a node with a single small leaflet. I suspect this unusual growth is related to the herm problem.

Any and all input is appreciated.

Fitzera · Dec 25, 2019

CaptinFunk said:
I’m using new millennium nutrients, not sure exactly what they put in it. So it’s possible they’re are bio stimulants. We are using pretty much exactly the same nutrients, I run my plants with a lower EC than him, but nothing too low, 1.8 - 2.2 max.

The only differences are how we irrigate (I water 3 times daily for 7-8min each feed, he irrigates 7+ times daily for 2-3 min) and our brand of coco. I use Mother Earth.

This time around the plants look fucking perfect, and I’m STILL seeing herms pop up, this time day 12 into flower.

The herms I’m seeing are full blow staminate flowers. Some are clusters like it’s a male. They are located at the nodes, where those single caylix’s should be (I’ve heard them being called primordial caylix). Not every node has a herm, many do tho.

The last room, when I made this post, almost everything hermed out. Some of the strains I’ve never grown before, others I’ve grown for over a year without herms. This time around, all the new strains I grew last time are still herming out. Other strains seem to be fine, so I’ll update this post as the room matures.

The locations of the plants that are herming out is pretty random throughout the room, the plants closest to the exit sign surprisingly do not seem to have any herms. I have gone into the rooms at night to check for light leaks and didn’t see anything... it was pretty much pitch dark other than the exit sign.

I’m so stumped, I’ve never expected this before. Like I mentioned, the plants look incredibly healthy. Dense white roots, no leaf deficiencies, or anything that seems to be wrong.

I have noticed some unusual growth on the plants other than herms. Sometimes, where you would expect to find a primordial caylix (or in my case, a cluster of male flowers) is a little shoot, like a little meristem with little leaves. Other times, near the base of a branch will be a node with a single small leaflet. I suspect this unusual growth is related to the herm problem.

Any and all input is appreciated.

I wonder if it's in the strain. Like due to maturation, maybe it's possible that theres a long term hermaphrodism? I cant say I've ever read of this, but it's what came to mind.

thailer · Dec 25, 2019

well i used to run GMO and i can tell you a little about her tendency to herm. she will herm if you don't water her enough, feed her enough, give her a peek of light, breath on her wrong. plus she is super pollen beast when nanners appear.

but in the full year i tried to run her perfectly or in the end when i didn't care anymore so she got neglected, she never once grew the pollen sack type of flowers and only had nanner bananas. i've only had that happen on one plant and it was due to a light leak.

another thought about herms i've dealt with in my garden. i run my lights at night and day time they are off. i built a new room and suddenly had problems when summer light hours extended to 16 hours of daylight. so in the beginning during the short light hour part of the year, i didn't have lots of herm problems but in summer, the daylight that poured into the garage where i built my room at was letting in a light leak that wasn't as bad in winter. so when i checked, i didn't notice and didn't have much problems, except for when i had the garage light on. anyways, it was tricky to figure out and i thought i didn't have a light leak and was searching for alternative reasons to herm problems.

seems to me like it has to do with light because of your buddy and it is effecting multiple strains. i'd cover the Exit sign just because i read somewhere that they can see green light but it's not like other spectrums.

GOT_BUD? · Dec 25, 2019

Do you have air blowing directly on them?

That was my issue with my room. I think I've got it sorted now by increasing the size and number of my passive intakes.

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