What's new
  • Happy Birthday ICMag! Been 20 years since Gypsy Nirvana created the forum! We are celebrating with a 4/20 Giveaway and by launching a new Patreon tier called "420club". You can read more here.
  • Important notice: ICMag's T.O.U. has been updated. Please review it here. For your convenience, it is also available in the main forum menu, under 'Quick Links"!

CANNABIS CLASSIFICATION METHODS

Sam_Skunkman

"RESIN BREEDER"
Moderator
Veteran
Actually all high THCA varieties of Cannabis are Indica, be they NLD or WLD, all Sativa is Hemp be it NLH or WLH.

NLD- Narrow Leaf Drug
NLH- Narrow Leaf Hemp
WLD-Wide Leaf Drug
WLH-Wide Leaf Hemp

Then there is Ruderalis (AUTO) which is not Indica I suspect it is Hemp unworked by man or escaped from cultivation by man but I do not have proof, yet. Most Ruderalis are age determinate, unlike most Cannabis that is Photoperiod determinate. Apparently a F1 hybrid that has a full auto parent X a photoperiod determinate parent will produce progeny to express earlier flowering and maturation.

Most Cannabis is Dioecious, all is Heterozygous, Wind Pollinated, and an Obligate Outcrosser, man can create a Homozygous Cannabis variety but they are not found in nature. Any Monoecious Cannabis made by man must be maintained by man, in the wild they will soon revert to Dioecious with many intersex individuals.

Hybrids of NLD X WLD are Indica hybrids.
Hybrids of NLH X WLH are Sativa hybrids.
Hybrids of a Drug type X a Hemp type are basically still a Drug type with lower THC values.

Another way to list them are by Chemotype:
Type 1-THCA-dominant with a concentration of >0.3% and CBD content of <0.5%.
Type 2-a mixed ratio profile with CBDA and THCA in varying moderate concentrations, almost always presenting as CBD-forward.
Type 3-CBDA-dominant with low THCA content that provides little to no intoxication.
Type 4-CBGA-rich profile with low levels of other Cannabinoids
Type 5-little to no cannabinoid content (cannabinoid-null or -zero). These often have a non-functional CBG synthase so the Cannabinoid synthesis never happens.

Type 6-should be a CBCA dominate plant. I propose.

Type 1v
Type 2v
Type 3v
Type 4v
Type 6v
Type 1p
Type 2p
Type 3p
Type 4p
Type 6p
Type 1b
Type 2b
Type 3b
Type 4b
Type 6b
Type 1h
Type 2h
Type 3h
Type 4h
Type 6h

CBM TYPE
?

That makes about 20+ Types based on Cannabinoid contents.

Also, the propyl versions could be listed as Type 1v, etc. The same with the newly discovered CBDPA and THCPA that have a seven alkyl chain the THCPA could be Type 1p or CBDPA as Type 3p and the also newly discovered THCBA and CBDBA with a 3 alkyl chain listed as Type 1b & Type 3b I am sure there are also others like CBCBA & CBCPA they can be expressed the same way.
THCA and CBDA has a 5 alkyl side chain, I am not sure about CBMA, Cannabimovone, the newest discovered Cannabinoid with a rearranged 2(3→4) abeo‐terpenoid skeleton and a biological profile similar to that of cannabidiol. It looks like a 5 chain like THCA? But I am not a chemist.

Also the new series of phytocannabinoids listed as Type 1h etc. that fills the gap between the pentyl and heptyl homologs of CBD and Delta-9 -THC, bearing a n-hexyl side chain on the resorcinyl moiety that we named cannabidihexol (CBDH) and Delta-9 -tetrahydrocannabihexol (Delta-9 -THCH), respectively. I suspect there are others like CBCH.

This paper:
Origin and evolution of the cannabinoid oxidocyclase gene family
Robin Van Velzen, Robin Van Velzen, Eric Schranz,
June 2021 Genome Biology and Evolution
Lab: Biosystematics Group Wageningen
DOI: 10.1093/gbe/evab130/6294932
https://www.researchgate.net/publica...se_gene_family

Localization and divergence of oxidocyclase genes in the Cannabis genome revealed two main syntenic blocks, each comprising tandemly repeated cannabinoid oxidocyclase genes. By comparing these blocks with those in genomes from closely related species we propose an evolutionary model for the origin, neofunctionalization, duplication, and diversification of cannabinoid oxidocycloase genes. Based on phylogenetic meta-analyses, we propose a comprehensive classification of three main clades and seven subclades that is intended to aid unequivocal referencing and identification of cannabinoid oxidocyclase genes. Our data suggest that cannabinoid oxidocyclase gene copy number variation may have less functional relevance than previously thought. Instead, we propose that cannabinoid phenotype is primarily determined by presence/absence of single-copy genes. Increased sampling across Cannabis’ native geographic range is likely to uncover additional cannabinoid oxidocyclase gene sequence variation.

Based on our new classification, every gene in this Cannabis-specific group can now be unequivocally referred to as a member of any of our seven subclades. We therefore hope that this classification will serve as a useful reference for the cannabis science community.

It is hard to specify “conventional thinking” in relation to these genes. Originally, based on careful examination of genetic crosses, THC and CBD synthase genes were generally considered two different alleles of the same gene. However, after the advent of genome sequencing, it became clear that these in fact comprised separate genes. More recently, some studies suggested that the variation in the number of gene copies has an effect on cannabinoid levels of the plant. However, our study showed THC and CBD synthase genes are strictly single-copy and that the variation occurs primarily in pseudogenes that cannot have a direct effect on cannabinoid production. We therefore hypothesize that levels of THC and CBD are the result of presence or absence, sequence variation, and expression of these two genes.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------


I would also include flowering induction and maturation times as they can be Autos that start flowering almost immediately or Late varieties that that do not start flower until years end outdoors under natural photoperiod. All Cannabis is Annual and wind pollinated.
As for maturation, there are 5 weeks-20+ weeks for maturation somewhat dependent on lumens and for sure photoperiods. Commonly called early, medium, late maturation, as well as the Autos.

Science now has a deeper understanding of Cannabis botany so the use of Indica and Sativa are just a very small part of any variety description. Or should be, it is not really as useful as other newer methods that reflect more science.

Terpene super classes dependent on the dominate terpene is another way for Classification of Cannabis, there has been a lot of work on this lately much done by NAPRO the makers of the PhytoFacts. I have many listed in my BIB look in the IC TERPENES part of the BIB. See

Sexual expression is another form of descriptions. Monoecious, Dioecious, Unisex, Intersex Dioecious, be the Intersex expression from just Intersex genetics that always express intersex or from other maybe different genetics that requires stress of some sort to express intersex. There are also all Female varieties and all Male varieties can be made.

Maybe shape of the plant could be used as a descriptor as some are very tall with little branching while some are very branched with branches almost as long as the plant is tall. Leaf shapes, Stems, hollow or not?

Cannabinomics:
Cannabinoids vs. whole metabolome: relevance of cannabinomics in analyzing Cannabis varieties https://www.researchgate.net/publica...abis_varieties
Several good ideas for classification, over 600 constituents have been reported in Cannabis plants, including 200 terpenes (mono-, di-, sesqui-and triterpenes), 25 flavonoids, 150 cannabinoids, and other compounds like stilbenes, lignans, phytosterols, alkaloids, and amides, DNA analysis, phenotyping and genotyping, all combined. AI analysis Plant Phenotyping automation, including i3D and multispectral information infra red, xray for roots, belts in greenhouses, called what? https://www.sciencedirect.com/sdfe/r...4220310877/pdf Machine Learning in plant science and plant breeding.
  • Digital biomass
  • Plant height
  • Plant height max
  • 3D leaf area
  • Projected leaf area
  • Leaf inclination
  • Leaf area index
  • Leaf Angle
  • Light penetration depth
  • RGB Color
  • NIR Color
  • Greenness
  • Normalized Digital Vegetation Index (NDVI)
  • Normalized Pigments Chlorophyll ratio index (NPCI)
  • Plant Senescence Reflectance Index (PSRI)
  • Disease quantification
  • Plant healthiness
  • Plant senescence
  • Chlorophyll levels
  • Carotenoid content
  • N-Content
Chemotype: 1-20 Types
Genotype: DNA tested?
Phenotypes: Both Chemo and visual traits
Cannabinoids
Terpene Super Class
Flavonoids, Thiols present
Sexual Expression: Dioecious, Monoecious,
Form: height, type of branches, roots, leaves, resin type (size and viscosity) and amounts
Maturation aspects
Heterozygous/Homozygous
Ploidy: Diploid, Triploid, Tetraploid, Pentaploid, Hexaploid, Heptaploid or Septaploid, Octaploid, Decaploid, Dodecaploid, or even Aneuploid, Autopolyploid, or Allopolyploid, maybe doubled Haploids made by man?

for classification thread in IC (1).pdf Via Chimera

9k=



Excuse any mistakes I think I did this correctly but most is just off the top of my head from memory.
All of the new Cannabinoids have papers about them I listed in My CANNABIS BIBLIOGRAPHY SORTED AND ALPHABETIZED BY SUBJECT found here: https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=363481 in the IC CANNABINOIDS section.
I look forward to any comments, this will keep improving in the next decades, by me and others.
-SamS
 

Attachments

  • for classification thread in IC (1).pdf
    117.5 KB · Views: 57
Last edited:

El Timbo

Well-known member
Good luck with getting the average grower/smoker/dispensary to comply... in the UK lots of people call all homegrown cannabis "skunk"
 

Roms

.bzh
Veteran
The varines are the propyl's the three carbon chain, we developed a variety that was almost all THCV back in the late 90's
Also varieties with only CBDV, CBCV, CBGV. Today many others are repeating the work we did 20 years ago.
-SamS


Hi SamS,

Thank you for the work and compilation!

Another thing very important to mention is the varine group of cannabinoids : THCV, CBDV, CBCV etc. It's the next global medecine revolution!

About the classification we also can seriously consider the ancestors NLD and WLD. It's all about the geographic location and the ultra violet intensity. I think that many historic things have to be understood in this way. I mean WLD ancestors is an adaptation to the Hindu kush high altitude/latitude and NLD ancestors are probably from the tropics/equator. (?) May it's be studied next years!
 
Last edited by a moderator:
T

TheForgotten

Good luck with getting the average grower/smoker/dispensary to comply... in the UK lots of people call all homegrown cannabis "skunk"

The 'average' grower/smoker couldn't comprehend much of that post, perhaps you should stop worrying about your particular demographic (average?), stop being negative and let other people worry about themslves.... :biggrin:
.
.
Hi SamS,

Thank you for the work and compilation!


Exactly.... :tiphat:
 

Cvh

Well-known member
Supermod
Why isn't NLD and WLD seen as a separate species? How can we now make the difference between the 2?

I personally belief the differences are quite big between the 2. Different structure, different appearance, different growcycle,....etc.

I guess the question is what makes a species? You can easily see the differences if you use a Chemoytype, terpene super class, as well as other classifications that I list. Cannabis species is a hard nut to crack, I am trying to help create a better method.
-SamS
 
Last edited by a moderator:

RoyalFlush

DEA Agent
Actually all high THC varieties of Cannabis are Indica, be they NLD or WLD, all Sativa is Hemp be it NLH or WLH.

NLD- Narrow Leaf Drug
NLH- Narrow Leaf Hemp
WLD-Wide Leaf Drug
WLH-Wide Leaf Hemp

Then there is Ruderalis (AUTO) which is not Indica I suspect it is Hemp unworked by man or escaped from cultivation by man but I do not have proof, yet. Most Ruderalis are age determinate, unlike most Cannabis that is Photoperiod determinate.

Most Cannabis is Dioecious, all is Heterozygous, and an Obligate Outcrosser, man can create a Homozygous Cannabis variety but they are not found in nature. Any Monoecious Cannabis made by man must be maintained by man, in the wild they will soon revert to Dioecious with many intersex individuals. All Cannabis is Annual and wind pollinated.

Hybrids of NLD X WLD are Indica hybrids.
Hybrids of NLH X WLH are Sativa hybrids.
Hybrids of a Drug type X a Hemp type are basically still a Drug type with lower THC values.

Another way to list them are by Chemotype:
Type 1-THC-dominant with a concentration of >0.3% and CBD content of <0.5%.
Type 2-a mixed ratio profile with CBD and THC in varying moderate concentrations, almost always presenting as CBD-forward.
Type 3-CBD-dominant with low THC content that provides little to no intoxication.
Type 4-CBG-rich profile with low levels of other Cannabinoids
Type 5-little to no cannabinoid content (cannabinoid-null or -zero). These often have a non-functional CBG synthase so the Cannabinoid synthesis never happens.

Type 6-should be a CBC dominate plant. I propose.

Also, the propyl versions could be listed as Type 1v, etc. The same with the newly discovered CBDP and THCP that have a seven alkyl chain the THCP could be Type 1p or CBDP as Type 3p and the also newly discovered THCB and CBDB with a 3 alkyl chain listed as Type 1b & Type 3b I am sure there are also others like CBCB & CBCP they can be expressed the same way.
THC and CBD has a 5 alkyl side chain, I am not sure about CBM, Cannabimovone, the newest discovered Cannabinoid with a rearranged 2(3?4) abeo?terpenoid skeleton and a biological profile similar to that of cannabidiol. It looks like a 5 chain like THC? But I am not a chemist.

I would also include flowering induction and maturation times as they can be Autos that start flowering almost immediately or Late varieties that that do not start flower until years end outdoors. All Cannabis is Annual and wind pollinated.
As for maturation, there are 5 weeks-20+ weeks for maturation somewhat dependent on lumens and for sure photoperiods. Commonly called early, medium, late maturation, as well as the Autos.

Science now has the understanding of Cannabis botany so the use of Indica and Sativa are just a small part of any variety description. Or should be.

Terpene super classes dependent on the dominate terpene is another way for Classification of Cannabis, there has been a lot of work on this lately. I have many listed in my BIB look in the IC TERPENES part of the BIB

Sexual expression is another form of descriptions. Monoecious, Dioecious, Intersex Dioecious, be the Intersex expression from just Intersex genetics that always express intersex or from other maybe different genetics that requires stress of some sort to express intersex. There are also all Female varieties and all Male can be made.

Maybe shape of the plant could be used as a descriptor as some are very tall with little branching while some are very branched with branches almost as long as the plant is tall.

Excuse any mistakes I think I did this correctly but it is just off the top of my head from memory.
All of the new Cannabinoids have papers about them I listed in My CANNABIS BIBLIOGRAPHY SORTED AND ALPHABETIZED BY SUBJECT found here: https://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=363481 in the IC CANNABINOIDS section
I look forward to any comments, this will keep improving in the next decades, by me and others.
-SamS

So is this solely your Reclassification theory or are there actual acredited scientists behind this idea?

I have worked with most at the forefront of Cannabis classification, I gave a financial grant to fund Karl Hilligs work, and supplied him landrace seeds for his studies, he came up with NLD & WLD, and NLH, NLH. I worked with RCC and Merlin, as well as John McPartland, I have known them for decades. I know and have helped Ernest Small, I helped Napro's Mark lewis, that came up with Terpene super classes, it is a small world of Cannabis expert OG's I have been doing this since 1965. Grew my first auto in the late 80's, have grown hundreds of landraces and hemp varieties, be they Monoecious, Unisex, or Dioecious, I am friends with many Cannabis breeders both hemp and drug, like Dr Bocsa who was the premier hemp breeder until he died in 2007, I had my own laboratory with HPLC and GC-Fid for Cannabinoid and terpene analysis, it is my life. -SamS
 
Last edited by a moderator:

El Timbo

Well-known member
The 'average' grower/smoker couldn't comprehend much of that post, perhaps you should stop worrying about your particular demographic (average?), stop being negative and let other people worry about themslves.... :biggrin:
.
.



Exactly.... :tiphat:

Wishing someone luck is being negative now? And I think most people would know what average means in this case.
 

Douglas.Curtis

Autistic Diplomat in Training
Definitely a mess out there, both the scientific and layman's.

I'm interested in some of this getting sorted out. It's a royal pain to even broach the subject with most folks. Education against prohibition nonsense is a rough uphill battle.
 

Roms

.bzh
Veteran
The varines are the propyl's the three carbon chain, we developed a variety that was almost all THCV back in the late 90's

Also varieties with only CBDV, CBCV, CBGV. Today many others are repeating the work we did 20 years ago.
-SamS
^^ Afghan and Hindu farmers/breeders have also done it since centuries! You have repeat their work too brotha. History keeps repeating itself anyway but we have to constantly improve and better understand.

The ancestors NLDA and WLDA are at the heart of the matter/question cause they very probably already had the varines declinations!There

The varieties from Afghanistan and India are certainly not single Cannabinoid varieties I grew thousands of seeds I imported from Afghanistan and India and never saw that ever. I did use varieties from S Africa, Thailand, Afghanistan, as well as Calif Orange that had around 1% THCV but I bred them for years and upped the THCV levels to over 15% with little to no other Cannabinoids, that is not found in nature. We bred it from seeds I had collected myself.
-SamS
 
Last edited by a moderator:

SUPER_HAZE

Active member
Hi Sams.

I would like to ask you something.

If you had to choose a landrace variety from the current seed banks, which one would you choose?
 

Sam_Skunkman

"RESIN BREEDER"
Moderator
Veteran
I have no idea what they sell, I collected landraces in situ myself and used the varieties for my grows. You need to ask people that buy from the seed companies.

-SamS
 

SUPER_HAZE

Active member
I have no idea what they sell, I collected landraces in situ myself and used the varieties for my grows. You need to ask people that buy from the seed companies.

-SamS

And of those varieties that you obtained, was there a special one?

Thanks for your reply.: tiphat:

Too many to name, I love Thai for example. - SamS
 
Last edited by a moderator:

MindEater

Member
Leaf shape changes with environment and feeds. I don't think dropping pH or changing lights turns indica into sativa. I've got both on the same roots if that's the case.

Fatty acid profile determines cannabinoid and thioester profile. Of course that's epigenetic also. Different strains have a different holobiont, and unlike other,more easily patentable plants, that demographic changes with the soil.

Terpenes, I can't smell any past veg as thiols are much more pungent by many orders or magnitude, don't know why so much importance is put on them,they have zero direct or indirect cb receptor activity unlike sugars and alcohols
https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S0014299998003926


Terpenes are what modulates and potentiate THC, they are really important, if you haven't learned this yet what can I say? Try 100% pure THC and then maybe you will see.-SamS

Unrelated because Cannabis is a fast evolving highly epigenetic plant,but still interesting.

Authentication of Citrus fruits through a comprehensive fatty acid profiling and health lipid indices: a nutraceutical perspectives

https://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s11694-019-00141-4
 
Last edited by a moderator:

Roms

.bzh
Veteran
The varieties from Afghanistan and India are certainly not single Cannabinoid varieties I grew thousands of seeds I imported from Afghanistan and India and never saw that ever. I did use varieties from S Africa, Thailand, Afghanistan, as well as Calif Orange that had around 1% THCV but I bred them for years and upped the THCV levels to over 15% with little to no other Cannabinoids, that is not found in nature. We bred it from seeds I had collected myself.
-SamS
Ya respect for the selection process and success with the different cannabinoids zoom! Great work Sams thank you again!

I wonder how much was the THC average level for the 15% THCV? Because it seems that at start the THCV appears to limit the THC level and potency?

To complete i think that some THCV dominant plant are still present in Nature, rare but existing in some few good climat locations and where the man works and selects it for drugs since longtime. I also experienced some rare potent THCV specimens with some landraces imports like the Mazar, the Thai and the Swazi also.
wink.gif


Btw here is 3 differents result from one strain landrace, the Mazar!
smile.gif
Nice THCV presence for one of them isn't it?



I never used TLC for analysis I used GC-Fid or HPLC what was the level of THC:THCV? I cannot tell. Most ganja growers select against THCV and keep the seeds of the plants they smoke and like the best. THCV is not psychoactive it is a CB1 antagonist, Hash makers that dry sift whole fields keep the seeds from plants with the most resin regardless of what the resin is because they do not smoke individual plants they have no idea if it is THC, CBD, THCV or what -SamS
 
Last edited by a moderator:
T

TheForgotten

Terpenes are what modulates and potentiate THC, they are really important, if you haven't learned this yet what can I say? Try 100% pure THC and then maybe you will see.-SamS

-SamS

.
If i remember my ICMag correctly, Sam stated in the past that 100% THC doesn't work so well, that adding terpenes to THC makes all the difference....
 

f-e

Well-known member
Mentor
Veteran
Type 1-THC-dominant with a concentration of >0.3% and CBD content of <0.5%.

That ratio includes some of your type 2 plants, being CBD dominant not THC
 

art.spliff

Active member
ICMag Donor
[FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]all some author legal language it doesn't mean anything to most people I think sounds like you have some point to illustrate or agenda preaching something or other[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]
[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]Type 2-a mixed ratio profile with CBD and THC in varying moderate concentrations, almost always presenting as CBD-forward.[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]
[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]The other part difficulty understanding[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]
[/FONT]
[FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]test example grow India Afghanistan Pakistan Columbia etc seeds in Thailand greenhouse and switch the other way, see how many years does it take for the plants to appear similar or different. Are they the same or still what they are? easy not so challenging
[/FONT]
 

El Timbo

Well-known member
Just a thought but isn't plant classification done in Latin? WLD and NLD etc are English... why should the classification of cannabis be in English?
 

therevverend

Well-known member
Veteran
Actually all high THC varieties of Cannabis are Indica, be they NLD or WLD, all Sativa is Hemp be it NLH or WLH.

Last I heard all the East Asian strains were Indica, the Chinese, Korean, and Japanese wide leaf hemp and seed types. That's how Robert Connell Clarke and Mark D Merlin split them in Cannabis: Evolution and Ethnobotany. Everything would be Cannabis Indica except for Eurasian wild, cultivated, and feral types which make up Cannabis Sativa. I'm guessing there may be new genetic evidence?

I helped RCC and MM with their ideas, and they borrowed the NLD & NLH system from Karl Hillig whom I gave a grant to fund his Taxonomy Classification work, I do not care what you think you read or what they wrote, Indica is high THC be it WLD or NLD to me. Sativa is Hemp probably from Europe/Russia I think. Time will tell, but regardless the old Indica/Sativa is dead replaced by a system based on DNA, Form, Type 1,2,3,4,5,6, Cannabinoid contents and terpene contents as well as sexual forms.

I have collected NLH types in Asia with low THC are they really Indica? I doubt it. Cannabis Taxonomy Classification is full of contradictions, but I am attempting to help create a system that makes sense and is usable so that by looking at a varieties Classification you have a better idea what it can be used for, where it can be grown, and what and where it came from. We keep getting closer and closer.

-SamS
 
Last edited by a moderator:
Top