Why do i always get Hermies?

You know what's funny... back in the 60's when I first started growing I would covet a hermie. In fact, I specifically bred for hermies.

I had a plant that I called #3. It was a Colombian latitude strain (determined by the 'sundown' test in Ed's very first bible). And, I inbred this strain for years. Decades, in fact. At one point, I discovered that the plants that had these little banana shaped pollen sacs would produce an occasional seed. And EVERY TIME, that seed would produce a female plant. Often, that resulting plant would also produce a nanner.

Keep in mind, this is before the internet, before e-books were everywhere. Nobody knew shit and the ones who did were not talking about it. At least, not in this country. Information was all from what you learned through experience. Seed banks were all in fantasy land.

Never heard the word hermie back then. Wasn't in my book (which I still have, by the way. LOL). I don't know if there was such a thing in Amsterdam yet but feminized seeds were unheard of here. I doubt they had them anywhere. I had certainly never heard of them.

But, I would specifically breed the plants that were hermies. And, use the seeds from the hermies to produce more hermies. It was an awesome source of feminized seeds.

I was on top of the fucking world. LMAO I had developed feminized seeds. LMAO

I never got more than a few nanners per plant. And, not on all plants. The plants that got spermed would produce just a few seeds. Perfect for the next crop.

Yep, hermies were the cream of the crop. A true sign of an experienced and knowledgeable grower. LMAO

Just thought that might be amusing to toss that out.

Ringodoggie said:

You know what's funny... back in the 60's when I first started growing I would covet a hermie. In fact, I specifically bred for hermies.

I had a plant that I called #3. It was a Colombian latitude strain (determined by the 'sundown' test in Ed's very first bible). And, I inbred this strain for years. Decades, in fact. At one point, I discovered that the plants that had these little banana shaped pollen sacs would produce an occasional seed. And EVERY TIME, that seed would produce a female plant. Often, that resulting plant would also produce a nanner.

Keep in mind, this is before the internet, before e-books were everywhere. Nobody knew shit and the ones who did were not talking about it. At least, not in this country. Information was all from what you learned through experience. Seed banks were all in fantasy land.

Never heard the word hermie back then. Wasn't in my book (which I still have, by the way. LOL). I don't know if there was such a thing in Amsterdam yet but feminized seeds were unheard of here. I doubt they had them anywhere. I had certainly never heard of them.

So, I would specifically breed the plants that were hermies. And, use the seeds from the hermies to produce more hermies. It was an awesome source of feminized seeds.

I was on top of the fucking world. LMAO I had developed feminized seeds. LMAO

I never got more than a few nanners per plant. And, not on all plants. The plants that got spermed would produce just a few seeds. Perfect for the next crop.

Yep, hermies were the cream of the crop. A true sign of an experienced and knowledgeable grower. LMAO

Just thought that might be amusing to toss that out.

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After 3 grows with hermies all making an appearance I must be a genius grower by that reckoning.

I can see them days it was a great thing, in this day and age when we do have fem seeds it's just a trifle annoying.
I know I buy fem seeds for convenience and the 99.9% female rate that's claimed.

I understand there's always that chance of a rebel seed not wanting to go along with it's programing. Like one of these non binary sorts we see in human modern society but it just seems to be happening more and more frequently with fem seeds lately.

When I first started growing it was always with female seeds and stayed this way for years.
I would maybe get 1 herm a year from 3 grows.
Now it seems I'm gonna get at least 1 a pack.

Of course I started ruling things out such as light leaks early on but as the list of possible reasons were crossed off, I figured it had to be down to genetics.

Budley Doright said:

and you should....balls types can release much more pollen because they are in fact just like male flowers.... they open....dry and can release into the air a surprising amount of pollen....

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So theres a difference between the Pollen production of a Nanners and a male flower? I cannot see Sacks on the branches of my Plant, only nanners on the tops of the top buds and dying off stigmas at week 5^^
Do you think i should just let them flower to the end and pick of the nanners?
Maybe that would be enough that not every bud is getting pollinated from the nanners and i still can get some smokeable product out of it..but still i have to find the problem for the hermie action before the next grow starts lol

VerdantGreen said:

you are right
how many times have you had this problem?
what genetics are you using? have you used he same clone variety each time or have they been different genetics with the same hermie problem?

VG

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Hi VerdantGreen! Ok that´s some good info now i know they did not hermie because of pollen from the last grow because if that had happened they would produce pollen and not nanners

This is the third time in a row i got this problem, but i searched some pictures for you guys from my last grow.

That was a Sugar Black Rose (Delicious Seeds) from feminized Seed and after that there is a Shark Shock from Clone..the Clone came from the same shop where i buy them for years and it looks much more female than the Seedplant.



So i think Genetics are also not the Problem in my case because i tried it with seeds as well and on the first picture of the SBR i can see a nanner now (did not see them during growth) and on the dry bud pic i think i see 2 big balls.

I always grow with 250 HPS (sometimes 400 HPS during flower) in a 80x80 cm tent in 2 Gallon Pots with Biotabs and Guanokalong for fertilizer in BioBizz Light Mix Soil.

The nanners appear only on the "tops" of the Top Buds, all the buds below have no nanners..

So..this is really a great discussion here guys, i learned some really interesting stuff so far but still have no descrete answer to my specific problem.

So it can be mainly genetics, stress and light leaks from what i read in the previous posts.
Genetics should be no Problem because as i told you the seeds hermied as well and some clones from this shop like the shark shock did not hermie at all and many of my friends grew the same strains from the same shop and did not got any problems with it.

So it must have something to do with my enviroment..i checked the timer again yesterday and the 12/12 light cycle is ok , no problems there.

So today when everything is dark i will check again for light leaks but this time for at least 10 minutes in every corner of the room and every corner of the grow box^^

I also do not think that the girls are stressed that much by me..no over or underfertilizing and watering, constant temperature between 68 und 80°F, light are not to close, ventilation is good..i really dont know^^


Greetz

Nanners put out just as much pollen as the balls do. The reason they usually don't do much damage is that nanners usually occur late in flower and really don't have time to affect things.

Both are more genetics than anything. Stress and light leaks can definitely cause these traits to show more readily but I don't think they are the cause. I have grown plants in perfect conditions that hermied because of genetics and I've also grown good genetics in shitty conditions with light leaks with never a hermie.

Howdy mate,

I had recently checked my setup for light leaks again and stuff.

When I had my flower room completely dark, it finally hit me ...

The power light from the power strip might have been it ...
Sure it's a weak source of light and red but it was on 24/7 and during the night-cycle as well.

I taped it with black masking tape and expect to no longer have that issue.

Just maybe something to consider, I knew I was like "duh, can't believe I didn't notice that for years..."

Could be I guess..... but the incidence would be higher closer to the light if what you say is true....

i found some herm stuff on my SSH last night... right near my light leaks... I guess I was wrong... have to spend some time caulking up the leaks... ugh

RockinRobot said:

Nanners put out just as much pollen as the balls do. The reason they usually don't do much damage is that nanners usually occur late in flower and really don't have time to affect things.

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IMO there is zero true about that comment.....

Cannabis pollen is normally spread in the wind....

WHen a male cannabis flower opens it doesnt release pollen immediately..... it must dry then it splits open to release its pollen....

because nanners do not dangle....they dont dry and split.... they are kept moist by the female bits....

Pollenation takes a few hours at most..... and the seeds will begin to grow immediately.....

MrBungle said:

i found some herm stuff on my SSH last night... right near my light leaks... I guess I was wrong... have to spend some time caulking up the leaks... ugh

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seed plants or clones????

Let me make a point about light leaks....

The best proof for this is a mono crop...... using clones...... same genetics....different environment....

If you are doing a monocrop and have some plants make male flowers....while other clones dont....

Thats some real good proof......

anyone know of a good example????

Budley Doright said:

IMO there is zero true about that comment.....

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You obviously haven't ever used STS, or another chem-femming agent. Drops mic...

I would have thought by now you would have stopped posting due to how much misinformation you throw around.....

for example...

Common mistake, fostered by non-growers and inexperienced growers. They're the exact same flowers, zero genetic difference. Why the different shape? Well gee, one is squeezed between female flowers and takes on a banana shape.

If I were going to prove that light leaks cause male flowers......here is how I would do that....

Take some seed plants.... take clones and grow them 10 wks or so....

Grow them where there are zero light leaks......you would have to be anal about it....

Examine them very carefully for male flowers...... if they have any....these are genetic hermies....


If they have no male flowers then...

We are going to test for hermies caused with light leaks....

When the non genetic clones are put into flower we are going to give the plants light leaks.... plenty of them......

These would cover the environmental hermies.....well one aspect anyway.....

Im sure you would agree its just not a difficult experiment.....

You guys are reading this too, right? LOL (yeah, I'm out of this thread. The facts have been posted and the rest is ludicrous. lol)

Budley Doright said:

IMO there is zero true about that comment.....

Cannabis pollen is normally spread in the wind....

WHen a male cannabis flower opens it doesnt release pollen immediately..... it must dry then it splits open to release its pollen....

because nanners do not dangle....they dont dry and split.... they are kept moist by the female bits....

Pollenation takes a few hours at most..... and the seeds will begin to grow immediately.....

Click to expand...

Pollination does indeed immediately but if happens 2 weeks or less before you're planning to chop almost no actual seeds form and very little desegregation in potency compared to pollen from balls that usually form much earlier in the flowering process.

Everyone is familiar with those white immature seeds..... they are the worst....

In 2 weeks....cannabis seeds are well formed....

These are clones, but I haven't seen herm stuff on this strain in over 5 years.. only recently I made some major changes to the environment... and haven't completely sealed out every light leak..

Budley Doright said:

Let me make a point about light leaks....

The best proof for this is a mono crop...... using clones...... same genetics....different environment....

If you are doing a monocrop and have some plants make male flowers....while other clones dont....

Thats some real good proof......

anyone know of a good example????

Click to expand...

GG4 is a clone only strain that came from plants that hermied, and many with light leaks get hermies.

As does ogkb 2.0..... Im not sure I get your point.....

Does gg4 hermie????


What I said was.... if a plant does not hermie in its first flower.....it is unlikely to hermie as a clone due to light leaks......

MrBungle said:

These are clones, but I haven't seen herm stuff on this strain in over 5 years.. only recently I made some major changes to the environment... and haven't completely sealed out every light leak..

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Im not going to say it never happens....Ive never said that..... it is however quite unlikely compared with the incidence in seed plants....