Blah's First Ppk

Mr Blah · Jun 3, 2016

WOw! trying to size the system I need for my 24 buckets is harder than I thought.
I am factoring about 200gpd unit.
I never owned one of these.....Do these have it's own pressure or do they use the facet pressure? I know it says that I can add a booster but do I need one? Anyone using this system and could elaborate there findings?
http://hydrobuilder.com/growonix-ex...eHWo5xlZctWr6-DSuTrqaMcuAFNJo-zq-QaAl6r8P8HAQ

OG Tree Grower · Jun 3, 2016

You need at least 60 psi, preferably 80 psi to make the unit produce the rated 200 gpd. If you have a well water and a large expensive pump that runs your well you defiantly want the boost pump and just set up pre Ro holding tanks to drawn from.

Mr Blah · Jun 3, 2016

OG Tree Grower said:
You need at least 60 psi, preferably 80 psi to make the unit produce the rated 200 gpd. If you have a well water and a large expensive pump that runs your well you defiantly want the boost pump and just set up pre Ro holding tanks to drawn from.

Thanks, I am reading this as we speak.
What unit do you use? Any issues? Any shoulda/woulda's/coulda's?

Is there any way to measure psi that I have now on my facet?
Is it have to do with flow rate?

Mr Blah · Jun 3, 2016

What about just adding an inline filter or two from Home Depot? Will this knock out a few of the nasties or must I go farther into micron level land?
The most biggest problem I have is the calcium level.
http://www.homedepot.com/p/GE-Whole-Home-Water-Filtration-System-GXWH04F/100471282

or this with two or three inline with each other;
http://www.homedepot.com/p/DuPont-Standard-Whole-House-Water-Filtration-System-WFPF13003B/203444288

Mr Blah · Jun 3, 2016

delta9nxs said:
you probably will have issues with that water. i would automatically go to a ro filter.

What issues do you think I will have? Plug up in drips, or?

delta9nxs · Jun 3, 2016

it all depends on what exactly is in the water but usually it's excessive calcium. this will interact with the calcium in your nutrients and cause stimulations or antagonisms with the other elements. these will show up as "deficiencies". it will also make ph control a real mutha.

i have found that a small ro filter running 24/7 into a large container with a float valve works fine. the one you show looks ok but you might want to look at

http://aquariumsupplies.marinedepot.com/search?w=ro filters&modaf=undefined

something around 100 gpd like you show is fine as long as you run collection tanks. all you need is a simple 2 stage for plants. you should probably get one with an inline pressure gauge.

you will need at least 60 gals to fill the plant sites. plus your reservoir volume.

maybe two drums or two large trash cans like the brute 44's.

delta9nxs · Jun 3, 2016

this will make you lose sleep!

Mr Blah · Jun 3, 2016

Thanks D9. Looks like I am going with this;
http://www.marinedepot.com/AquaFX_D...ilter_Systems-AquaFX-5V27877-FIROROSH-vi.html
This is ready to go?
Or do I need a pump? Not sure what the psi is on my facet right now but I can't image it being less than 50psi.

How much top off water will I need for vegging 12 of these monsters?
And doesn't the top off water need nutes in that water?

Down stairs I just add raw water to each of the 4 control buckets via 1/2" tuning and float valves. Gravity fed. Which in turn is feed by me with a hose to the 2-32 gal trash cans but every other day I am filling these ressys. Was going to add a saddle with a 1/4" line to the incoming water to the facet.

OG Tree Grower · Jun 3, 2016

I run the stealth 200 for the exact reasons d-9 said. To much calcium in my well water showing mag deficiency.

No problems but a few tricks I have learned

To save waste water I recycle my waste line into my pre ro holding tanks one time. This gives me a 2-1 good to waste ratio. I only recycle once tho then the second time around gets sent to waste as the ppm is about 400 on that run and it would get hard on our filter after that.

House filter , carbon or sediments won't catch the calcium . Pretty well stuck with RO if your showing deficiency

I don't use RO often, only twice over the last few decades actually. I hate everything about RO. But if your chasing deficiencies while all your stuff is good then it may be a necessity

If you wanna know your pressure just hook up a gauge to your garden hose tap

Mr Blah · Jun 3, 2016

Thanks for the reply OG Grower.
What do you mean that you haven't used the RO system for a couple of yrs?....Doesn't hook right in to your water line? Did you bypass it and why? Thought you had a build up of Calcium like D9 stated?
I have never used a RO system, so this is brand new.
I am new to this PPK system (run all UC systems) all together but as I have been asking people around Maine if they have heard of it..they reply with a PPwhat????
I think it is/will be a game changer for me.

OG Tree Grower · Jun 3, 2016

If I don't show deficiency I don't use ro water because it's expensive , a pita, and wasteful. But two places I grew at absolutely needed RO water because I had mag deficiencies caused by to much calcium.

I do currently use the RO water at my new spot

Mr Blah · Jun 3, 2016

I don't show any deficiencies with my UC set up that I have been running with the strains and don't fuck with the PH.
BUT D9 wouldn't of said it if he didn't know what he was talking about.
Just not sure with whole new nutrient regiment. Don't know how it will react with my water.

OG Tree Grower · Jun 3, 2016

Jacks probably has tons of cal mag so RO would be best. Probably why d-9 said that.

Undoubtly RO is better but I'm a minimalist these days and it's just a whole other system to take care of

Mr Blah · Jun 3, 2016

OG Tree Grower said:
Jacks probably has tons of cal mag so RO would be best. Probably why d-9 said that.

Undoubtly RO is better but I'm a minimalist these days and it's just a whole other system to take care of

I hear ya brotha...I hear ya.
I like to do things as simple as possible and with the least amount of effort. :biggrin:

delta9nxs · Jun 4, 2016

yep, jack's has quite a bit of calcium and over 6% mag, which is more than any other brand i know of.

i'm a little suprised that you were able to run a uc system with that 220 ppm water so maybe it will work with the jack's. you don't know until you try but i've been running jack's since oct 2010 and usually anything over about 150 ppm and you will have problems.

your filter choice looks good. the nice thing about ro water is that you have a known starting point every time.

it will ph low initially right after mixing but will climb from there even in the mixing container and by the time it gets into the working part of the system it will be in the mid 5's and climbing slowly.

mix at 600 ppm at .5 to start with and see which way it goes before adding more.

mix by meter not by weight. all you have to do really is find the number of tbs of jack's it takes to reach 360 ppm and then add the same number of spoons of calcium nitrate. always add the jack's first.

during veg the working part of the solution will be pulled down in strength up to the end of stretch. sometimes as low as 450 ppm. and then in flower will tend to accumulate. i don't like to let it get above about 1250 ppm or 6.4 ph.

you can just run a load of water into the system to steer it back down rather than doing a complete change out.

also, if you want to conserve water it would be better to mix your tap and ro to about 100 ppm after the filter rather than running the ro waste through again. you will get more life from your filters.

Mr Blah · Jun 4, 2016

So you are saying that I am looking for a 600ppm after adding both nutes for vegging plants, don't worry to much about the PH as it will climb gradually, and end about 5ish?
I do have a question about the auto top off...Do I mix nutes into any extra water that enters the system during the week. Or is it straight RO water? If yes, how am I suppose to accurately mix when more water from the RO system is constantly adding more water?
Can you explain your top off system and how it is suppose to be done?
Thank you for your patients and mentoring.
If done right this thread should be the end all of the questions. Or you're gonna have to write that book we mentioned earlier. :tiphat:

delta9nxs · Jun 4, 2016

in this system you don't do the standard add back top off routine.

the best way to operate for long term solution stability:

use a feed tank with a line plumbed to your float valve. i have used up to 4 brute 44 trash cans daisy chained together so i didn't have to mix every day. create the volume you need for the time frame you want. you want the line plumbed as low as possible in the tank so as to nearly drain it each time.

when it is completely drained and only then, refill with water and mix nutes. this way you are adding a stable, dilute solution to a stable, dilute solution. this minimizes any unwanted reactions that might occur.

i like to fill to about 2" down from the rim to give room for stirring with a boat paddle. use the same level every time.

once you find the number of spoons of jack's to add to hit your target simply add the same number of spoons of calcinit. from then on you don't need a meter.

if you are going to do a ph correction now is the time. using ro water don't touch it as it will climb slowly on it's own. never use ph up in a ppk system as it will quickly cause it to rise beyond the desired cap of 6.4. most precipitation events occur at 6.5 or above.

your ro water should be collected in a separate tank and then fed into your mixing/feed tank only when mixing a new batch.

Mr Blah · Jun 4, 2016

WOW! This will be a big set up when done.
Vegging alone (like you say) I should have a couple 44gal Brutes where all mixing will take place than dumped into control/buckets, Than fill both brutes up again and mix for what they will be eating all veg cycle. All the while two more Brutes (total 4 if you are counting so far) filling up with RO water collecting waiting to be dumped into vegging tanks (2 Brutes) or another 2 brutes for the flower room mix Brutes..which will be three rooms. So a total of 6 Brutes.

I will draw it out and post it.

Mr Blah · Jun 5, 2016

This is the basic pattern I will follow. From the RO system on the wall to the RO holding tanks (88gals total), to the mixing tanks (88gals total) and out to the control bucket.
Question is it wise to hook multiple control buckets to this mixing tank or should 88gals be dedicated to one control bucket?
Meaning I will have 3 other rooms (flower) with 4-3.5gal buckets each. Total 12 buckets to match the vegging room.
I will probably have 2 more 44gal brutes to take care of the flowering formula. Feed from the RO holding tanks.

Mr Blah · Jun 6, 2016

Got the AquaFX 100gpd on it's way to the grow.

Thought long and hard about what is said about the RO water.
The base line PPM's will remain the same each grow no matter what time of year it is unlike my well water. This is a good investment.

Just got to get a device to measure water pressure.

Also got the Jack's and Calcium Nitrate coming by the end of the week.

All ready got my Milwaukee pens for ppm's and PH. I never use them anymore as I know how the water is and nute level, been doing it for a few yrs now. Hope the batteries are fine. :biggrin:

Also going to throw a screen (same that is on the bottom of tailpipe) on top of the tailpipe on the bottom of the top bucket as in another thread states to help prevent tailpipe clogging up.

Thank you again D9, for all your help...couldn't of done it thus far without your help. :tiphat:

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