Growing in Coco 10 years. Lost my way

siftedunity · Jan 20, 2018

gaiusmarius said:
wow, can i have your old bulbs? just kidding, but really change every run? i have bulbs that have been running non stop for 2 years lol, just started switching them out, lmao.

Ha I think the most I will run them is three grows. Probably quite wasteful but you notice the difference of light they put out when new. I've never used a light measuring sensor though so dunno how much difference a new bulb makes..

But 2 years? Jeez. Maybe I should run them longer..

p0opstlnksal0t · Jan 21, 2018

I still can't wrap my head around the salt buildup in your runoff. Is it.still higher now? I use botanical blocks and never rinse or preload it. I get high ec runoff the first 2-3 feeds and after that it's usually all gone. I'll feed at 1.2 ec and runoff is usually .5-.6 ec. I've only experienced high ec runoff when I water once or twice a day and my coco dries out. I use .2 ec high calcium well water too.

siftedunity · Jan 22, 2018

I'm not sure.. I will do another run off test when the lights are on.
Got the ro filter up and running so it will be good to see the difference..

gaiusmarius · Jan 22, 2018

3 runs is what recommended for optimum output with old hps bulbs.

i noticed i can still get my yields if everything else is ok even with 2 year old bulbs. in fact i had a couple of bulbs actually stop lighting up on my digital lamps, so i changed them all now. but yeah, the recommendation i got with these was to change them every year. every run is not worth it for sure. specially not with the new gavita style digital lamps.

Bush Dr · Jan 22, 2018

siftedunity said:
you notice the difference of light they put out when new.

It's called spectral burn it as the impurities in the sodium get burned away and the lamp settles into the enclosure tube, approximately 115% of rated output after 100 hrs then drops off to rated output at 8-900 hrs

The spectrum is also different, its like looks more pink than orange as there's more red in the light

If you can afford it then it'll probably pay for itself they're so cheap these days

Best time to put a new lamp in is around 4 weeks into flower and use a SON-T, Philips used to make a SON-T+ which put out 105,000 lumens instead of the 90,000 Grolux put out

gaiusmarius · Jan 22, 2018

Bush Dr said:
It's called spectral burn it as the impurities in the sodium get burned away and the lamp settles into the enclosure tube, approximately 115% of rated output after 100 hrs then drops off to rated output at 8-900 hrs

The spectrum is also different, its like looks more pink than orange as there's more red in the light

If you can afford it then it'll probably pay for itself they're so cheap these days

Best time to put a new lamp in is around 4 weeks into flower and use a SON-T, Philips used to make a SON-T+ which put out 105,000 lumens instead of the 90,000 Grolux put out

you saying the maths says it's worth changing for every run ?

Bush Dr · Jan 22, 2018

gaiusmarius said:
you saying the maths says it's worth changing for every run ?

Depends on what you value what you grow, you should at least look at any difference you get when you change the lamp, all other factors being equal a 15% increase in available light should give measurable increase

After 2,500 hrs the lamp output drops off noticeably

gaiusmarius · Jan 22, 2018

the only numbers i look at is the gpw, in my over 20 years of growing i never noticed a lamp making or breaking the yield. if i do everything right i expect at least 1 gpw, ideally i get 1.3gpw, but when i don't get it, it's not the bulb, cause i will get it again next run if you know what i mean. thats why over the years i stopped being so strict with my bulb changes. i'd need to be so perfectly dialed in every run, to be able to even calculate any differences, specially when you add variables like season, temp and rh. in the end a new bulb won't make or break your grow in my experience.

Bush Dr · Jan 22, 2018

True Gaius, just answering your question

siftedunity · Jan 22, 2018

gaiusmarius said:
3 runs is what recommended for optimum output with old hps bulbs.

i noticed i can still get my yields if everything else is ok even with 2 year old bulbs. in fact i had a couple of bulbs actually stop lighting up on my digital lamps, so i changed them all now. but yeah, the recommendation i got with these was to change them every year. every run is not worth it for sure. specially not with the new gavita style digital lamps.

I'm using regular hps and they are cheap sunmaster dual spectrum. Tbh they are cheap to replace. I'd probably say the average is every two or three runs. I gave done every run before and keep the used ones as spares for a rainy day..
From what I've heard about gavitas I'm sure they last way longer!

siftedunity · Jan 22, 2018

gaiusmarius said:
the only numbers i look at is the gpw, in my over 20 years of growing i never noticed a lamp making or breaking the yield. if i do everything right i expect at least 1 gpw, ideally i get 1.3gpw, but when i don't get it, it's not the bulb, cause i will get it again next run if you know what i mean. thats why over the years i stopped being so strict with my bulb changes. i'd need to be so perfectly dialed in every run, to be able to even calculate any differences, specially when you add variables like season, temp and rh. in the end a new bulb won't make or break your grow in my experience.

Even if I got 1oz extra I'd pay for the bulbs and some change so it's probably worth it for me.
Not very ethical though.

siftedunity · Jan 22, 2018

Bush Dr said:
It's called spectral burn it as the impurities in the sodium get burned away and the lamp settles into the enclosure tube, approximately 115% of rated output after 100 hrs then drops off to rated output at 8-900 hrs

The spectrum is also different, its like looks more pink than orange as there's more red in the light

If you can afford it then it'll probably pay for itself they're so cheap these days

Best time to put a new lamp in is around 4 weeks into flower and use a SON-T, Philips used to make a SON-T+ which put out 105,000 lumens instead of the 90,000 Grolux put out

Tbh I've never really thought about switching them at an optimal point.
Definitely q good idea though because I veg under t5s then slowly acclimatise them to hps so it would make sense to do that with older "softer" light than waking them under new bulbs. Then I could add them in at peak flowering.. Good plan

gaiusmarius · Jan 22, 2018

siftedunity said:
Even if I got 1oz extra I'd pay for the bulbs and some change so it's probably worth it for me.
Not very ethical though.

i suppose that is true, if you really are getting an extra onze because of the new bulb and not some other reason. in the end the maths doesn't lie though.

i just wonder how many of our grows are so perfectly dialed in, that the age of the bulb (within 3 runs) will actually influence the end yield.

but i do get whats being said. you want to give yourself every possible chance to get the best possible outcome. and it certainly is true that only 20 extra g would more then make up for the price of the bulb.

siftedunity · Jan 24, 2018

Well I think a bulb is about £20
So £100 for 5 bulbs. So 1 full grow of bulbs.
And an Oz here is £180-240
So yeah an extra Oz on the entire grow only, would pay for the bulbs and change.
And by no means am I perfectly dialled but getting there. I'd say the most dialled you can get is probably sealed with co2 and climate control down etc.

Lester Beans · Jan 25, 2018

Did you try ph'ing your nutrient solution to 6-6.1? That's commonly agreed upon as the proper pH for coco. pH 5.8 in coco in my experience can results in N toxicity.

gaiusmarius · Jan 25, 2018

i pay 90 euros for my electric 600 watt bulbs, still thats not much in the grand scheme of things, don't think anyone selling them for 20 over here.

siftedunity · Jan 25, 2018

Lester Beans said:
Did you try ph'ing your nutrient solution to 6-6.1? That's commonly agreed upon as the proper pH for coco. pH 5.8 in coco in my experience can results in N toxicity.

Hello man.. Tried Ph of 6 to, 6.2. That run had the same issues if not worse. And looking at the availability chart for nutrients and ph, Nitrogen is easily accessible at quite a wide ph range. And know many who stick around the 5.8/5.9 with great results. And I did at one point have great results at one point. Used to stick with 5.9...

dansbuds · Jan 25, 2018

my plants do much better at 5.8 to 6.0 range too , anything higher or lower for to long & i get defs .

Lester Beans · Jan 25, 2018

I wasn't just trying to suggest if the plant looks like it has too much N raise the pH.

Quite the conundrum here. I'll re read the thread. Gotta be a solution.

Vibes

dansbuds · Jan 25, 2018

i'm still thinking the RO water will make a huge difference . tap water has to many changing variables depending on the time of year .

Growing in Coco 10 years. Lost my way

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