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A question for the growers using Jacks 5-12-26

Y

YosemiteSam

TommyTwoColas said:
For those using Jacks straight through with no boosters, do you adjust your ratios as flowering winds down? I.e., less calcinit and more of the Jack's "base"?

Also wondering (for those who use additives), what change if any they make to the base formula when using said additives. Am going to do a heads up of Jacks (straight through, run at 1/2 tsp/gallon of each) vs. the same base + Big Bud and Overdrive.

Conditions are identical for each group, the addition of Big Bud and Overdrive will be the only variable.

Thanks.
Click to expand...

that is exactly how you achieve a Mg deficiency with Jack's...it already has the upper limit of K in it, add a PK booster and you end up with so much K you lock out Mg. and then the tail chasing begins

Jack's is absolutely not designed to be used with a bloom booster

It is also not designed to be used with high alkalinity water...I would not recommend it for water over say 30 ppm alkalinity

check out the formulas guys use to grow absolute monsters outside...they have less K than Jack's
 
T

TommyTwoColas

Member
YS, thanks for checking in - have followed your grows at a few different sites (and have been meaning to get some of that Calcum-25 for some time now).

So, long story short - don't bother trying to add any bloom boosters to Jacks? Sure seems like that's what you're trying to say but I just want to make sure I'm understanding you correctly...............so you don't adjust your formula at all to where you are in flowering?

Thanks,
Tommy
 
Y

YosemiteSam

Do not add a PK booster to Jack's. K is important for bud formation but enough is enough and Jacks has as much as you will ever need.

It is about the balance of minerals...get that right and you can push a little or go light and pretty much get the same result...except the light feed will be healthier and the smoke will taste so much better.

Every time you jack the EC up you cut transpiration of the plant...which totally dictates the uptake of Ca and Boron and it just so happens the uptake of Ca is the single most important thing to your plant.

And that is why I believe additives are a horrible, horrible idea...the nute companies would be doing you a favor doubling the price of their base nutes and stopping all of those fucking snake oil additives

At least that is the way I see it...I am sure others will have different opinions.
 
dubwise

dubwise

in the thick of it
Veteran
I switched over to jacks a while ago and find it to be much easier to work with, and a lot cheaper. I use 1tsp/gal w/ 3/4tsp calcnit all the way through and have no problems with any deficiency. So glad this place taught me about jack's!
 
J

Jabapc

Member
a quick note after the first grow..I went with Jacks at the recommended 3 grams jacks 2 cal nit with just 5 ml protect added.. no weight as things were just cut down but there was a problem with this grow using the Jacks .. the buds got big enough that some plants fell over branches broke some in more than one place it was a mess lol but even that didn't stop them I tied things back up and finished the grow
 
Y

YosemiteSam

Jabapc said:
a quick note after the first grow..I went with Jacks at the recommended 3 grams jacks 2 cal nit with just 5 ml protect added.. no weight as things were just cut down but there was a problem with this grow using the Jacks .. the buds got big enough that some plants fell over branches broke some in more than one place it was a mess lol but even that didn't stop them I tied things back up and finished the grow
Click to expand...

Try it without the protekt and I promise you will be happier. I know it is called silica but it is potassium silicate...the Jack's absolutely does not need extra K
 
HG23

HG23

Member
YS,

I have been using full strength Jacks for the past couple runs and about mid way through flowering I start to see symptoms of calcium deficiency (rusty spots) and leaf tissue necrosis that seems to start at the leaf tips. I use Roots Organics soil in one room which has it the worst and my other room with coco only has it slightly. My water was tested at 59 mg/L CaCO3, do you think the high alkalinity could be causing a problem?

leaf.jpg

leaf2.jpg

leaf3.jpg
 
B

black_thumb

Member
I just started using jacks 5-12-26 450 ppm with calnit 300 ppm @ .5 per gallon im having the same problem but mine looks like p def drak crispy brown that starts at the tips about 4 weeks into flowering in coco.

My tap water comes out @ 25 ppm .5 & 6.0-6.2 ph and i have to add alot of pro-tekt to get the ph back up to 5.8-6.0.

So could the pro-tekt along with the already high k level of the jacks be locking out the p?

can you get silica without all the k?
 

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Jbonez

Jbonez

Active member
Veteran
Def P def....

4 weeks is about the time I hit em hard with P... Looks like you need to boost your p, Id say if your ph is upper 5's your issues is lack of nutes...
 
Y

YosemiteSam

Too high K will block uptake of both P and Mg along with B. imo Jack's has too much K to begin with and then you add more with KSil you are asking for a problem. The fact that Mg has to be so high in the Jacks formula is because the K is so high.

I have better luck running K= N.

If you are using some kind of media...coco, peat/humus then the easy way to add Si is just chuck in some amorphous diatamaceous earth. My favorite is Red Lake Earth which is 67% DE and 33% calcium bentonite.

But Si does not seem to be so important to me to risk raising K levels. Better to run without it entirely than to risk ruining your cation balance.
 
BasementBreeder

BasementBreeder

Member
YosemiteSam said:
Too high K will block uptake of both P and Mg along with B. imo Jack's has too much K to begin with and then you add more with KSil you are asking for a problem. The fact that Mg has to be so high in the Jacks formula is because the K is so high.
Click to expand...

Really? I've always read that excess K blocks the other cations, not the anions.
I have better luck running K= N.
Click to expand...
Agree 100%. Plants can tolerate very high levels of K, but it definitely isn't needed. Much better to have the cations in balance.
If you are using some kind of media...coco, peat/humus then the easy way to add Si is just chuck in some amorphous diatamaceous earth. My favorite is Red Lake Earth which is 67% DE and 33% calcium bentonite.

But Si does not seem to be so important to me to risk raising K levels. Better to run without it entirely than to risk ruining your cation balance.
Click to expand...
Also agree. I think many people do more harm to their nutrient profile from adding extra K then they get from the Si that goes along with it.
 
B

black_thumb

Member
I use the potassium silicate too raise the PH. This is what my tap water reads before adding anything........
 

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Jbonez

Jbonez

Active member
Veteran
YS, Ive just switched 5/5/7/5/.5 with agsil (70ppm), what are your thoughts on this, Im told youve a profound insight into nutrient profiles, Im in coco...
 
Y

YosemiteSam

Here comes one of those imo things that will go against pretty much everything you read on this site. The pH of your fert water has virtually nothing to do with the eventual pH of your coco. The alkalinity of your water will have a big effect and the exact cation/anion balance of your ferts will have some effect although not a huge one since coco does not have a big cec.

I would not use KSil with Jacks period.

Load the coco with some Red Lake Earth for silica if you think it is important. Switch to raw salts and account for the K in your formula.

Either way I guarantee you the excess K does more harm than any gain you get from the silica.

imo...take that for what it is worth to you.
 
B

black_thumb

Member
I just ordered 20 lbs of MKP, 20 lbs magnesium sulfate, 4 lbs peters S.T.E.M and already have the calcium nitrate. I guess ill put the jacks -5-12-26 on the lawn this spring not much else use for it now.

i dont really care for the silica i was just using it to up the ph. after i add the ferts my ph is down in the 2.8 ph what is that like battery acid lol.
 
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